Of trailer brakes and tow vehicles......

Cannondale

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So we're looking around at some new SUV's/trucks for a new tow vehicle. So far, Ford and Chevy/GMC.

But I found something interesting in their respective tow guides........and their recommendations for when you need trailer brakes.

We all know, pretty much, what the state regs. say for our particular state. And, maybe like me, a lot of us assume that the brakes on our vehicles are adequate for the trailer rating of the vehicle we're towing with.....but that last assumption may be incorrect.

The Cliff's Notes version is that GM says at 2K# trailer weight for their full sized SUV's/trucks, 1K# trailer weight on anything else and Ford says at 1500# trailer weight for all their vehicles, you need to add brakes to your trailer. (And, yes, I know this is the 2011 guide in each case, but older guides I've found, as far back as 2002, say the same thing.)



In the Ford guide, in the "What To Know Before You Tow" section, there's a small blurb about tow vehicle brakes. It states:

The towing vehicle?s brake system is rated for operation at the GVWR ? NOT GCWR. Separate functional brake systems should be used for safe control of towed vehicles and for trailers weighing more than 1,500 lbs. when loaded.


The above can be found on page 31 of Ford's Trailer Towing Guide (2011 version):
https://www.fleet.ford.com/showroom/rv_trailer_towing/2011/2011 RV and Trailer Towing Guide.pdf (Be forewarned, it's a 5.3MB .pdf file.....)

So, apparently even with the tow packages, you need to have trailer brakes when your trailer has a weight of 1500# or more.....a lot less than what almost all states require.



GM is a little more liberal:

Trailer Brakes
These are required above a 2,000-lb. trailer weight on Silverado, Tahoe, Avalanche, Suburban, and above a 1,000-lb. trailer weight on all other models.


This is found on page 3 of GM's 2011 Trailering Guide:
http://www.chevrolet.com/assets/pdf/en/overview/11_Trailering_Guide.pdf (Again, a rather large .pdf file download.....)


So this surprised me a tad. I'd have thought the brake systems on vehicles rated for at least semi-serious towing (like 5K# and above) would have brake systems that'd at least be capable of handling 3K# without adding brakes to the trailer, but I see that's incorrect.
 

Frank Acampora

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Re: Of trailer brakes and tow vehicles......

It may not be the tow vehicle brake system capacity they are concerned about, but rather: They may want to prevent the trailer from swapping ends with the tow vehicle--or, the tail wagging the dog, if you will.

I could forsee an unbraked trailer trying to break loose in a hard stop on a turn, or break out the back wheels of the tow vehicle.

I have even had a small trailer--about 1300-1500 gross--try to push the back end of the (small SUV) tow vehicle out. I could feel it (tow vehicle) fishtail. And, that was on dry pavement at about 40 MPH. Only Captain Driver's many years of experience prevented it from going critical! LOL

When I taught my kids to drive, I showed them exactly what a front wheel and rear wheel skid felt like in a snow covered parking lot. I taught them to feel it in their butt and react immediately, not think about it.
 

dingbat

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Re: Of trailer brakes and tow vehicles......

It depends on criteria they used to come to these numbers.

I have more than once limped home w/o brakes for one reason or another. While I wouldn't want to drag my trailer around w/o brakes day in and day out, the truck has sufficient braking power to get the job done and not white knuckle you in the process.
 

LippCJ7

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Re: Of trailer brakes and tow vehicles......

Something to think about, the way that Lawyers and Lawsuits fly here in the US dont forget the fudge factor the manufacturers place into these figures, not so much in that they know that their vehicle can safely tow X amount but more so that their vehicle in the hands of Jackwad driver Z (who can't drive to save his life, you know who I am talking about) is towing X amount(more then the owners manual suggests) and then kills 3 people when he doesn't allow for an appropriate stopping distance and rear ends another car at 55 MPH. The Manufacturer has a clear way to remove themselves of liability without having to take into account driver Z's incompetence as a driver, liability would stop with the driver.

As I have previously posted I know people that could tow a 30' cruiser with a ford ranger and be safer then 90% of the drivers out there, the specs the OP has taken from the manufacturers web site or manuals I believe simply help them remove themselves of liability due to incompetent drivers, and I don't blame them one bit either.

Disclaimer: I do not in any way condone towing a 30' cruiser with a ford ranger!!
 

Lou C

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Re: Of trailer brakes and tow vehicles......

What Ford said is interesting and is also what I have thought for years, if you look at the gross vehicle weight rating (this is the maximum the vehicle can weigh, including vehicle weight, passengers and cargo) that is how they size brake systems. If they allowed for a trailer, well then how much should they allow for? 3000 lbs, 5000 lbs etc. Different size trailers themselves have different capacity brake systems. Going by that logic you could only tow a light trailer without brakes IF the truck was very lightly loaded. It does really matter, I can say because when I first got this boat, it did not have trailer brakes. The old 98 Jeep I was towing with then did not have the best brake system out there, but it did have 4 wheel 11" disc brakes 4 channel ABS. Still with an approx 4000 lb boat, it was really getting pushed by the trailer. As soon as I could I put surge drums on it (disc systems back then were not as good as they are now)and it made a huge difference. My 07 Jeep has much better brakes but I still would not tow without brakes on the trailer....
 

JupiterJoe

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Re: Of trailer brakes and tow vehicles......

Federal law states any trailer with a GVWR of 2k or more must have brakes on all axles
 

Cannondale

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Re: Of trailer brakes and tow vehicles......

Federal law states any trailer with a GVWR of 2k or more must have brakes on all axles

Ummmm......no, it's actually the states that regulate this, per state. Look at the sticky at the top of this forum for the state-by-state trailer brake requirements.
 

JupiterJoe

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Re: Of trailer brakes and tow vehicles......

Sorry I stand corrected Kansas, Kentucky,Missouri ,and Wyoming dont have a law on trailer brakes. The rest avg. 3k some are 1k
 

jeeperman

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Re: Of trailer brakes and tow vehicles......

The tow builders are doing the CTA/CYA disclaimers.

The shorter the tow vehicle wheelbase, the easier it is for any trailer to wag the tow vehicle.

And 4-wheel drive wont do anything to help prevent that either.
 
G

Guest

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Re: Of trailer brakes and tow vehicles......

All I can say on the subject is if the trailer weighs more then 2,000 lbs IT MUST HAVE BRAKES and that is according to almost all states as well as Canada!
 

NYBo

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Re: Of trailer brakes and tow vehicles......

The limit is 3000# in NY.
 

haulnazz15

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Re: Of trailer brakes and tow vehicles......

The numbers they publish are almost undoubtedly a CYA move by the manufacturers. I doubt they have any standardized test from which to calculate the weight at which the trailer should have brakes. I'm sure each legal department went to the engineering department and asked for a weight number to estimate the total amount of weight/load that could be put on the stock brake system.
 

NYBo

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Re: Of trailer brakes and tow vehicles......

I have heard that there will soon be government standards for determining the tow rating of tow vehicles. Perhaps the same will happen for trailer ratings and brakes.
 

H20Rat

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roscoe

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Re: Of trailer brakes and tow vehicles......

The numbers they publish are almost undoubtedly a CYA move by the manufacturers. I doubt they have any standardized test from which to calculate the weight at which the trailer should have brakes. I'm sure each legal department went to the engineering department and asked for a weight number to estimate the total amount of weight/load that could be put on the stock brake system.

CYA move on the manufacturer's part or not, the lawyers will use those number to argue their case against you if you have an accident.
 

Lou C

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Re: Of trailer brakes and tow vehicles......

I would not be suprised to see more stringent brake regulation of trailers. There is so much variation in standards. Case in point, you can have a tandem trailer, with 2 3500lb axles, with brakes on one axle. Those brakes, if on a 5 lug hub, will be 10" brakes. Now how much sense does it make for a vehicle to have a pair of 10" brakes to stop close to 7000 lbs total if the boat maxes out that trailer? I have read on Champion Trailers website that braking capacity is estimated by the capacity of the axle. So if you had a single with a 5200 axle, six lug hubs, 12" brakes, that would have better stopping capacity than the above example. Doesn't make sense. I'd put brakes on both axles of any tandem but nearly every single one I see has a pair of 10" brakes on it.....
 

dingbat

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Re: Of trailer brakes and tow vehicles......

II have read on Champion Trailers website that braking capacity is estimated by the capacity of the axle. So if you had a single with a 5200 axle, six lug hubs, 12" brakes, that would have better stopping capacity than the above example. Doesn't make sense. I'd put brakes on both axles of any tandem but nearly every single one I see has a pair of 10" brakes on it.....
To calculate breaking force you would take the surface area of the pads x the pressure. The larger surface area of the pads on 12" brakes would equate to more braking force.
 

180shabah

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Re: Of trailer brakes and tow vehicles......

To calculate breaking force you would take the surface area of the pads x the pressure. The larger surface area of the pads on 12" brakes would equate to more braking force.

I don't think luo was confused about the difference in braking capacity - but rather making a remark about the lower capacity(5k) trailer having more braking ability than the 7k trailer.
 

mike343

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Re: Of trailer brakes and tow vehicles......

Lots of mis-information in this thread so far unfortunately! 3000# is the most common in the states, very few under that, quite a few over, and some with no limit.
 
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