OMC Cobra outdrive

[Mile-High Mariner]

Okay, fellas - time to spend some money on the big-lake boat! My buddy took my 1987 Bayliner 2150 Capri cuddy out last year, neglecting first to dewinterize the boat and do all of the pre-season maintenance checks (oil, PS fluid, gear lube, etc.) and completely FRIED the upper gears. I mean tooth-melting, metal-shaving, WELDED-TOGETHER fried. There was, apparently, insufficient gear lube in the upper unit to prevent that unfortunate event. My first question is: does the lubricant communicate between the upper and lower units, or are they separate and sealed-off from each other? The second question is: am I okay with replacing or rebuilding only the upper unit or should I address both the upper and lower unit at the same time? The mechanic who tore down the upper unit indicates that the lower is okay, but I'm somewhat of a stickler about maintenance and repair. I have considered a new replacement or rebuilt upper unit, but I'm also looking at complete replacement drives or having mine custom remanufactured, and even entertaining the conversion to the Volvo Penta drive, but I'm a little nostalgic about my OMC system (grew up with OMC, Johnson, Evinrude, you see) and I'd like to keep it original insofar as I am able to do so, reasonably. Any opinions or guidance? Thanks, in advance, for your input! Dave

 

[seahorse5]

Re: OMC Cobra outdrive

Most likely the gear failure was from improper refilling of the gearcase during winterizing.<br /><br />read the following link and I think it will describe the reason for your expensive outdrive problem.<br /><br /> http://forums.iboats.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=24;t=016948

 

[Boatin Bob]

Re: OMC Cobra outdrive

Yes the upper and lower are connected and since you mention "metal shavings" it would be wise to have the lower torn down as well as you will most likely have shavings down there now too. As seahorse mentions it most likely due to improper lube filling, need to do it from the middle hole to ensure the upper gears get covered.

 

[Mile-High Mariner]

Re: OMC Cobra outdrive

Seahorse (good fellow Johnson fan) and Boatin Bob - thanks for the input, guys. I always have my outdrives serviced before putting them away for the winter, when I actually DO put them away for the winter. The service was done by a very reputable shop that was soon after bought by a larger outfit that has disavowed any warranty claims made against the previous proprietor's work or actions. I'm not interested in a legal battle, and I accept my responsibility for not making sure that my buddy performed what was my obligation as the owner of the boat (the prerun fluid checks, etc.), so I'm focusing on the rebuild or replacement options, preferring to respond with positive action over reacting to the harm resulting from negligence, mine or others'.<br /><br />Anyone have any good suggestions regarding reasonably-priced rebuild or new aftermarket drive options? I assume there are no new OEM OMC drives available, and I have a pretty good idea of the cost of a Volvo Penta conversion. Thanks again, in advance, for your contribution to the brain trust!

 

[seahorse5]

Re: OMC Cobra outdrive

If there is nothing that would help you here on I-Boats, try Doug Russel Marine. They advertise new and rebuilt outdrives of all makes and they advertise in the back of boating magazines.<br /><br />I have never dealt with them or know them, just saw the ads.

 

[Boatin Bob]

Re: OMC Cobra outdrive

You might want to try eBay...here is a place that is advertizing new (must be rebuilds?) uppers that will fit your application. eBay Cobra Upper

 

[Lou C]

Re: OMC Cobra outdrive

I was able to get a set of the hard to find one piece OMC batwing manifolds from Doug Russel, they were good folks to deal with.<br />For the price of a re-built Cobra, though, I'd strongly consider converting to a Volvo SX, since the added costs are minimal over the cost of the drive. Then you will have something that can be serviced by volvo techs and the boat will have way better resale value than with the OMC drive. <br />I am going to keep running mine as long as I can get parts, I have had minimial problems with the Cobra drive. But if I had to replace the whole drive, the conversion makes more sense if I was keeping the boat.

 

[Mile-High Mariner]

Re: OMC Cobra outdrive

I dunno, Lou - converting to the Volvo SX is an attractive option, but $6-7 grand isn't. Crowley Marine has a complete rebuilt Cobra drive for $3180 with a one-year warranty (http://www.crowleymarine.com/sterndrives/omc/cobra_complete.cfm) and Bob's link is to Tri-State Marine's NEW upper gearcase for %1875, with a two-year warranty.<br /><br />Seahorse & Bob - thanks for reminding me about Doug Russell. They have a good rep amongst iBoats forum members, although I've found some of their prices to be higher than found elsewhere.

 

[Mile-High Mariner]

Re: OMC Cobra outdrive

Possible Stupid Question Alert: can I use a King Cobra outdrive for my application, or are they incompatible? Seems like OMC wouldn't have designed a completely different transom shield for the King Cobra, which is actually what became the Volvo SX, anyway. Lou's comment about the Volvo SX was what prompted this question, so I'm throwin' it out there.....

 

[Lou C]

Re: OMC Cobra outdrive

Main thing is can you get someone who knows how to set up a Cobra where you are located, if not and you can't do it yourself, the Cobra becomes problematical. Another option, if all you have is Merc service, is to get a re-man Alpha, and then try to get a deal on the transom shield, trim rams/pump and power steering set up. The added cost of doing the Volvo conversion will be returned in terms of less trouble down the road, and making the boat actually have some resale value, which with the Cobra will be a problem. <br />About the King Cobra, there are a number of different variations of them. From 86 to 89, there was the regular Cobra, which had different lower for the 4 cyl vs the v-6 and v-8. The Kings that came with the Chevy 350 in some years were no different than the regular Cobra, why they called it a King is not clear. Then, with the Ford 460, there was a still different (bigger, from the V-8 outboard) lower used. The standard V-6/V-8 Cobras took 64 oz of fluid, the King 460 took 108, so you can see how much bigger the lower was. There were problems in high hp applications, so for 90 the whole thing, transom included was redesigned with the cone clutch, and no parts are the same between those Kings,and the 89 and older ones. Finally, in 94 the whole Cobra line was re-designed with Volvo as the joint venture product, which is still made as the Volvo SX. <br />The main thing is you need the correct upper gear ratios, and lower unit and ratios. They are different for the different engines. You need a shop manual for your year engine to sort it out.

 

[Purduebarry]

Re: OMC Cobra outdrive

Mile high...check these guys out. The site is a bit difficult to navigate but it looks like they have the goods. Ask if anyone has delt with them. I haven't but was very immpressed with their claims and available parts. <br /><br />OMC Sterndrive Supplier <br /><br />Good luck and I like your deal about trying to keep it as is. Everytime I see an antique rebuild on the forum I get inspired that my efforts are not in vane!

 

[Mile-High Mariner]

Re: OMC Cobra outdrive

Lou - all I have right now is the Clymer latrine roll - so which years of King Cobra outdrive will fit my '87 Cobra shield, without modifications? I am not interested in resale value, as I intend to keep this boat until I see the water close over the bow. Besides, the Mercruiser conversion you mentioned is, to my best knowledge (back me up here, Don S), not at all feasible - my OMC 5.0 is the Ford 302 cid V8, whereas the Mercruiser 5.0 is GM's 305 cid V8. I think the fact that OMC for 1986-on designed the Cobra system to fit in the same transom cutout as the Mercruiser and existing Volvo Penta sterndrives has some enterprising fellas thinking the two systems are compatible with a few modifications, but has anyone ever actually documented a successful mating of these two very disparate systems?<br /><br />Barry - thanks for the link - I've actually already checked out Sterndrive.com, and I agree - they are a top-notch outfit. Their price on the complete outdrive is $3950; Crowley Marine offers the same complete outdrive for $3180:<br /><br /> http://www.crowleymarine.com/sterndrives/omc/cobra_complete.cfm

 

[Lou C]

Re: OMC Cobra outdrive

What you need to be concerned with is not if it is King or not, but rather if the upper and lower gear ratios are correct for the engine, and that it has the correct lower (the ones for the 4 cyl engine is lighter duty than the v-6/v-8 models). They were basically the same from 86-93. <br />Are you sure you have a Ford engine, I checked over at www.dougrussell.com in the OMC parts diagrams, the only 5.0 used was Chevy for 86, and 87. My 88 OMC shop manual lists only a 5.0 Chev, and for that the gear ratios are:1.50:1 overall, 21:17 upper, 14:26 lower.<br />If you wanted to convert to Merc, which may make more sense if there is no Volvo service near you, you have to replace everything,coupler on back. Transom plates, power tilt n trim, power steering, the whole nine yards. If you can buy it all from a guy parting out a boat, that is one way.Then bolt up a reman Alpha. The Volvo conversion saves you having to change the coupler, transom mounts, power tilt n trim and steering. So if the Volvo drive costs more, that offsets some of the cost, and some like a Volvo better anyway. Like I said, if you do have OMC service just replacing the Cobra is cheaper, but in the long run, a few thousand more for the Volvo makes more sense to me.<br />PLEASE , make sure your transom stringers and floor are good before doing this, or you will be kicking yourself, unless you want to rebuild that too!

 

[redblur]

Re: OMC Cobra outdrive

Been there done that. Bought my 86 Ebbtide 19' Cuddy w/4.3 Cobra last July. In Aug the upper had gear teeth and metal shavings all over the place.<br /><br />First of all, from what I found out then was that the upper and lower share lube and therefore if there was metal in the upper you better at least have the lower checked out.<br /><br />Now, when it happened to me I explored a lot of options including the Volvo swap and seriously considered selling the thing as-is, because all of the options were sooo expensive. Then I came across T.C Electronics and Marine. <br /> http://www.sterndrive.info/id132.html <br /><br />Like I said my upper was similar to yours, gears completely gone. I had the upper and lower rebuilt for $1994.46 (I'm looking at the slip right now) - including shipping and two year warranty on the upper - no warranty on the lower because they didn't have to replace any gears.<br /><br />When I found the site, I kept on thinking there was something wrong when comparing their prices to the 3-4k rebuilt units but Wayne was very helpful on the phone and other than the small hastle of having to pack up the upper and lower and ship it I couldn't be happier.<br /><br />Sorry this sounds like an info-mercial but I was just very pleased with the price and service and want to repay them by steering a little business their way.<br /><br />Give them a call and they'll explain it all to you.

 

[cobra 3.0]

Re: OMC Cobra outdrive

These guys are good for OMC Cobras:<br /><br /> http://www.sterndrive.info/

 

[HT32BSX115]

Re: OMC Cobra outdrive

That problem with the upper starving for oil is sorta classic around here.<br /><br />When my brother had this Four Winns 211 he took it to a Four Winns dealer for yearly service and they didn't put oil in the outdrive at all the first time(destroyed it completely) and didn't fill it correctly the second time(destroyed/welded the upper)!!<br /><br />They replaced the outdrive both times ...... Uhh....I don't think he went back a third time!<br /><br />Since mine is an 87 also it's the "OLD King Cobra" and is NOT the "same" as the newer Cobra/ SX/Volvos.<br /><br />My plan if it becomes necessasary to replace in the future is to go to a much newer Mercruiser engine/outdrive or Volvo EFI big block and much newer Volvo SX/DPX etc. (I can't even find exhaust manifolds for the FORD 460 for a reasonable price like all the rest! Doug Russell wants about $1000 each + shipping.)

 

[Mile-High Mariner]

Re: OMC Cobra outdrive

I'm on the fence, to, HT. I may either find a good drive from a donor boat or have mine rebult or replace with a reman; alternately, I may just pull the whole engine and transom unit and repower the boat with a Mercruiser setup - good thing they both fit the same transom cutout.<br /><br />I continue to thank you guys for the input!