rde-19 (update)- paul moir

seahorse44

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Sep 18, 2005
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Hey all, Put my carb kit in my 35 hp rde-19c and Now I have to choke it every time I start it. I was a little stingy with the float setting .it is a little lower than level with the housing. I was trying to save gas i guess. now it runs a little eratic at idle. Guess when they say level they mean level I'll reset it. But my main question is how smooth are these old big twins as far a shaking and vibration goes. Maybe i am expecting to much . this motor seems to shake pretty good below 850 rpm. I like smooth If I can get it. I also found a leaking spark plug wire tonight after dark running it in the garbage can so new wires tomorrow and .040 plug gaps ? Thanks for any help fine ole motor .
 

Joe Reeves

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Re: rde-19 (update)- paul moir

1957 35hp Johnson.....<br /><br />(Carburetor Float Setting)<br />(J. Reeves)<br /> <br />With the carburetor body held upside down, the float being viewed from the side, adjust the float so that the free end of the float (the end opposite the hinge pin) is ever so slightly higher (just ever so slightly off level) than the other end. And when viewed from the end, make sure it is not cocked.<br /><br />(Compression & Spark Test)<br />(J. Reeves)<br /> <br />1st - Regardless of what problem one might encounter, always start with the basic troubleshooting procedure. Check the compression which should be in the range of 100+ psi (somewhat less on the smaller hp engines) and even on all cylinders.<br /> <br />2nd - With the spark plugs removed, rig up some type of spark tester whereas you can set a gap to be jumped. On magneto ignition systems.... and also the Battery Capacitance Ignition system OMC engines from 1968 to 1972, set the gap to 1/4". On the solid state OMC ignition systems from 1973 to the present, set the gap to 7/16". The spark should jump the gap with a strong blue lightning like flame..... a real strong blue snap!<br /> <br />If there was no spark, on engines from 1973 up, disconnect the RED main electrical plug at the engine. Remove the s/plugs. crank the engine via the starter solenoid (jumper bat term to small 3/8" term nut, not the ground nut) and observe spark. If spark is now okay as stated above, the usual cause is a shorted ignition switch.<br /> <br />If the above checks out as it should, and the engine dies out when throttle is applied or won't idle, it is usually due to one or both of two things. The carburetors are fouled, in which case the cure would be to remove, clean, and rebuild them..... or the timer base under the flywheel is sticking which would result in a retarded spark.<br /> <br />To check the timer base for sticking (Engine Not Running), spin the prop to align the shifter dog with forward gear and while doing so, put the engine into forward gear. Now, while watching the timer base, slowly apply throttle clear up to full throttle. The timer base should move smoothly all the way up against the black rubber cap that is atached to the end of the full advance spark setting screw. If the timer base sticks, find out why and correct that problem.<br /><br />(Carburetor Adjustments - Two Adjustable N/Vs) <br />(J. Reeves)<br /><br />Initial settings are: Bottom high speed = seat gently, then open 1 turn out. Top slow speed = seat gently, then open 1-1/2 turns. <br /><br />Setting the high and low needle valves properly:<br /><br />NOTE: For engines that DO NOT have a shift selection, obviously there is no NEUTRAL position. Simply lower the rpms to the lowest setting to obtain the low speed needle va /lve adjustment.<br /><br />(High Speed) Start engine (it will run pretty rough), shift into forward gear, take up to full throttle. In segments of 1/8 turn, wating for the engine to respond between turns, start turning in the bottom high speed needle valve. You'll reach a point whereas the engine will either start to die out or spit back (sounds like a mild backfire). At that point, back out the needle valve 1/4 turn. Within that 1/4 turn, you'll find the smoothest setting. <br /><br />(Low Speed) Slow the engine down to where it just stays running. Shift into neutral. Again in segments of 1/8 turns, start to turn the top needle valve in. Wait a few seconds for the engine to respond. As you turn the valve in, the rpms will increase. Lower the rpms again to where the engine will just stay running. Eventually you'll hit the point where the engine wants to die out or it will spit back. Again, at that point, back out the valve 1/4 turn. Within that 1/4 turn, you'll find the smoothest slow speed setting. <br /><br />When you have finished the above adjustments, you will have no reason to move them again unless the carburetor fouls/gums up from sitting, in which case you would be required to remove, clean, and rebuild the carburetor anyway.
 

Paul Moir

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Re: rde-19 (update)- paul moir

Until you've got the carb setting's correct don't worry too much about the idle quality. It sounds like you've got it set a little rich on the idle mix causing 4 stroking at lower rpms. <br />Idle should be very smooth with the in-gear RPMS of 700-750. Don't worry about the neutral RPMS, just let them take care of themself. Many people are surprised just how smooth these engines run which is no doubt due in part to the massive flywheel they spin. <br />Did you install the little spring clip on the float's needle if this is a rubber tipped needle?<br />I personally haven't had much luck with the .040" plug gap unless the ignition system is the picture of health. Even then I don't think it does much. For now stick with .030" until you've got it sorted out.<br /><br />If you're really interested in saving on fuel, there's a modification that can be made to the fuel drain valve to drain back to the tank rather than dumping or recirculating. Search the forum for "drain valve" and it should turn up. Lark2004's has the recirculating setup that can be easily modified into the recovery setup.
 

seahorse44

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Re: rde-19 (update)- paul moir

Thanks Joe and Paul ,<br /> Been through the compression checks 105 top 100 bottom . spark jumps 3/8 gap no problem . lightning blue fire. I put the spring on the needle paul and I have the rubber tip needle. new float ,cleaned carb and new kit, new coils , new points & condenser , added fuel pump and rebuilt it.all hoses new . new lower unit seals ,cleaned and put small amount grease on timer base , smooth as silk. cant get my wires till in the morning but will replace them . Paul, I dont believe I am running rich . smokes very little and if anything I am toward the lean side. If you get the time could you explain the four cycling . still learning. <br />I started a 12 hp fastwin the other day for a guy and it was smooth as it could be. thought mine was a little rough. thanks for the help too.
 

seahorse44

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Re: rde-19 (update)- paul moir

Just wondering if someone could explain the 4 stroking caused by rich condition ? thanks
 

Paul Moir

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Re: rde-19 (update)- paul moir

When a 2-stroke runs very rich it misses on what seems like every second stroke (like a 4-stroke), leading to poor power and lots of vibration. I first heard the term from JB, it seems to describe the situation perfectly. <br /><br />The fact that you have to choke it when its warm contradicts it being set overly rich. On the contrary, with the idle adjusted a little rich it'll start very easily. Is there any variation between the spark plug's firing ends after you idle a while?
 

seahorse44

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Re: rde-19 (update)- paul moir

hey all,<br /> I put a small plastic fitting in my lower drain hole on my carb and put a clear tubing on it to see exactly where my gas level is in the bowl. any guesses on how high the gas should be in relation to the parting(gasket) line on the bowl ?<br />this should allow us to set gas height perfectly huh ? thanks
 

seahorse44

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Re: rde-19 (update)- paul moir

The plugs look perdy much the same Paul. a little sooty after shutdown . all I have been doin is idling in the barrel though. I rechecked my compression with a new comp guage and it shows 120 bottom 125 top . Rechecked spark too with tester , It will actually jump 7/16 very easily and blue and snaps. pulled breaker plate to replace ht wires tomorrow if I can find them . I reset the float as you guys teach on here. The gas level by the way was about 1/2" below the gasket level . sure does explain the hard starting. use to start with no choke ever even cold , first turn . I do like to experiment. I also was wondering what kind of wrist pin bushings these ole timers have. mine sound and feel a little lose when rocking the flywheel. not bad just can feel it. gonna change the top crank seal while Im in there since I already have one.
 

Paul Moir

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Re: rde-19 (update)- paul moir

The engine will idle a little faster when running in a barrel compared to idling on a boat due to the water swirling around. It really can make a big difference in the end. It's always best to be doing your idle adjustments on the water.<br />You've got plain bushings on the wrist pin end of the connecting rod. They didn't switch to caged rollers until about '60 or '61. That is the only plain bearing in the rotating assy though.<br />When you rock the flywheel at TDC, you'll feel a few things. Most predominantly is the gap between the piston rings and their lands, which feels like play but isn't. Then you feel the bearing play, which on a plain bearing will be a couple thousands of an inch (to make room for oil). <br />So it's normal to have quite a bit of free swing at TDC. The important thing is you feel everything hooking up at the same time, not one cylinder lagging 10 degrees after the other.
 
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