Return Deposit?

[duscarter]

I recently sold a project boat that I could not find time for. It was listed as a project and I was totally honest about it. The buyer has given me $1500 of the $3500 he owes me as a deposit. It has been a month since he commited to it. Now he wants to haggle on the price. I agreed to hold it for him. He is a truck driver that was going out of town. He inspected the boat.

Do I stand my ground and demand the balance be paid in full?

There was no written contract at this point. I thought someone that would commit that much money was a serious buyer. Parting it out would have made me more money. I don't want to go through the hassle of trying to sell it again.

 

[werthert]

Re: Return Deposit?

My 2 cents.
The guy is being a **** by trying to renegotiate something that, when you both shook hands and walked away, was a done deal. I'd get hard on him and tell him the deal was already made and he has two choices, pay the rest or lose the $1500 deposit.

OR...

If your really at your wits end, just say "look fella, I'll take a couple hundred bucks off if you really need to sleep better at night AND you pay the remainder by (insert date)." That way he has a date to meet and no more wishy-washy. If he fails here, go directly to option one above.

 

[duscarter]

Re: Return Deposit?

Thanks for the reply. That was my plan as well, except for knocking off a couple hundred. We had a deal.

BTW, it is a 23' 1988 Wellcraft Concept on a duel axel trailer with surge brakes. The engine is apart, but all parts are there. Got a 454 block out of a Chevy half ton. We were going to put her back together (two years ago). It's been sitting since. The Bravo drive has been pressure tested good. I would have parted it out if I had more time. $3500 is a pretty fair price.

 

[204 Escape]

Re: Return Deposit?

I'm going to small claims court in the morning, over "helping a abused woman move out of the house she was in". She wrote me a check, my wife took it to our bank, (her's was 3 1/2 hours away). My wife cashed the check, the other gal waited 2 days, put a stop payment on the check, and I got a over-draft check charge, etc.

I had already gave the woman a "dis-count on the price with the provision that the check was GOOD !!!!!!!! Not so. Will see how it turns out tomorrow, at 9:05.

I can't stand people like this !!!!!!!

P.S. She duped my buddy, who hauled some of her stuff too. ALSO canceled his check !!!!!

I say tell him to pay or leave !!!!!!!! An agreement is an agreement !!!!!!

 

[scoutabout]

Re: Return Deposit?

That takes some stones to agree to a price then come back looking for more after keeping you hanging around for that long. Yeah, his deposit is gone and you can re-sell is my opinion but of course that's easy for me to say a thousand miles away versus you standing there in your driveway looking at this guy with nothing in writing and half the money missing. I don't know how the law would look on it.

Maybe worth a couple of hundred off just to get rid of it and get on with your life. But get THAT in writing along with a firm date for removal from your property. As I get older I'm discovering that time is more valuable than money. You could not have told me that ten years ago to save your life.

It's funny I saw this thread tonight. I just sold a project car last night for peanuts on the dollar compared to the money I have in it and he's supposed to get it the heck out of my driveway by tomorrow. Well, doesn't he call up tonight with tales of woe about having a hard time getting his buddy's truck, and finding a trailer, and blah, blah, blah.

When we cut the deal I dropped my price approximately half the cost of what a tow truck would cost to get it to his place. He asked for a bit of a break and I gave it to him. Now's he's getting cheap, dicking around and, I suspect, called tonight fishing to see if I'd deliver it even after the discount. Difference is I got the money in full the night of the deal. So yeah, 1-800-GOT-JUNK I'll deliver it.

Long and short of it is...selling stuff privately is a hassle.
Good luck with it.

 

[jonesg]

Re: Return Deposit?

I recently sold a project boat that I could not find time for. It was listed as a project and I was totally honest about it. The buyer has given me $1500 of the $3500 he owes me as a deposit. It has been a month since he commited to it. Now he wants to haggle on the price. I agreed to hold it for him. He is a truck driver that was going out of town. He inspected the boat.

Do I stand my ground and demand the balance be paid in full?

There was no written contract at this point. I thought someone that would commit that much money was a serious buyer. Parting it out would have made me more money. I don't want to go through the hassle of trying to sell it again.

Problem is , that "nothing was written" is a potential problem.
He can claim you agreed to sell it for $1800.!

If you really don't need the hassle, give him his money back and do it properly next time.

If you take a hard line and he does the same, you can re-sell it but must give him his money back when it sells, you don't get to write law.
You can sell it for less and keep any shortfall, he may contest it but lose.

Acting like theres some sort of "principle" involved is what makes lawyers lick their chops and I can tell you from experience what their private conversations simmer down to "my client is almost as stupid as yours, we have 2 blockheads". Kaching!

The real principle, if you must have one, is you made a mistake, don't compound it with immature reactions.
I do handshake deals all the time, but we shake hands after they pay cash in full and I don't ever play bank.

At this point I would NOT sell it to him, even if you get the full price theres potential its going to come back at you when something doesn't go right.
The gimble is seized etc.

 

[jay_merrill]

Re: Return Deposit?

Unless you have a valid oral agreement that the refund was nonrefundable against a purchase price of $3,500 ... and have a WITNESS to tha fact ... you are going to lose, if you try to keep all of the money.

In most places, $1,500 is a small enough amount to be taken up in small claims court. Filing a claim in such a court costs about $100 in most of those jurisdictions. At the same time, $1,500 is enough money to make most people follow up on the issue, if they feel that they have been "done wrong."

If you end up in court and can't prove an oral agreement, you will lose. You will also pay the court costs and you might pay damages, as well.

My recommendation is to call the guy, tell him the price is $3,500 firm and see what he says. If he backs out of the deal, tell him that you intend to keep $250 of the deposit for lost sales opportunities, lost time, etc. See what he says. My guess is that he won't argue, but even if he does, he's not likely to do anything about the situation - its not enough money to justify the fight on his part.

 

[Zeeter]

Re: Return Deposit?

Give him his deposit back and start over. That step usually shakes them up.
People get really weird when you give them their money back. Most times they won't take it. They think youve got something better on the line.

 

[soaringhiggy]

Re: Return Deposit?

I hate situations like this, but I have to agree with Jay, jonesg and zeeter, hit him hard enough 250 300 get him off your property and out of your hair and NEVER do a contract without paper again.

It is hard enough to enforce with a good paper contract, let alone a verbal.

Sorry it went this way. There are a lot of shysters out there.

 

[strokeoluck]

Re: Return Deposit?

Life is short - give him his money back and start over. Yeah, it's a pain in the *ss for you, but consider it a lesson learned.

Small claims court? Forget about it. No contract, no witness (sounds like) and EVEN IF YOU WIN good luck collecting (been there, done that as a landlord). A small claims court win means very little in the real world.

Take a few hundred from him and let him off the hook? That's an option, but now you have to spend even more time and energy talking to the guy (like he's not going to offer a counter-counter proposal?!) and if he gets p*ssed that you took some of his money you now have to lose sleep about whether your car gets keyed or he somehow starts harassing you (this is where all the tough guys chime in w/something like "talk to my friend Smith & Wesson"; but the point is...why bother w/this chain of events?!).

I can only say this from experience. My wife told me for 15 years to just let the little things go - life is short. It's only been the last few years that I've actually listened to her, and she's right. It's amazing how stress-free my life has become by letting the little things go - whether it's the guy cutting me off on the highway, the neighbor who lets his lawn get a little long, the renter who is a few weeks late w/rent, whatever.

 

[soaringhiggy]

Re: Return Deposit?

Life is short - give him his money back and start over.

Take a few hundred from him and let him off the hook? That's an option, but now you have to spend even more time and energy talking to the guy (like he's not going to offer a counter-counter proposal?!) and if he gets p*ssed that you took some of his money you now have to lose sleep about whether your car gets keyed or he somehow starts harassing you (this is where all the tough guys chime in w/something like "talk to my friend Smith & Wesson"; but the point is...why bother w/this chain of events?!).

QUOTE]


Good point, I would consider this as well

 

[reelfishin]

Re: Return Deposit?

Hand shake deals in this day and age are worthless, give the loser his money back and let him know it will sell elsewhere for more.
If that don't convince him into cutting loose the cash, chances are he never had it and was playing you from the start. I'd venture to guess someone or something changed his mind. He's either found a better deal or the old lady won't let him spend the money.

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: Return Deposit?

i totally disagree with refunding the money. he has had ample time to close the transaction, i would call it an abandonment. now wanting to renegotiate, NO WAY.

He has probably done this with everything he buys, time to stand your ground.

he either signs a release of contract, or he performs per agreement. court is a pita, but this guy deserves it. he probably will not show up for the court date, anyway, saying he was on the road. doing this he defaults, the money is rightfully yours, then you can resell the boat or take it to the landfill. right now, you have to hold the boat, until this is settled.

 

[LIQUID PROZAC]

Re: Return Deposit?

don't give in to this guy-without honor we have nothing and this guy needs a lesson handed to him-good luck

 

[duscarter]

Re: Return Deposit?

Thanks for the replies. I have never met the guy in person. The boat is at a friends house, who has room for "projects". The guy left the first check for $500 with him, and then mailed me a check for $1000 two weeks later. That was after I told him it was going back on CL. I will let you know how it goes.

 

[IVAZ]

Re: Return Deposit?

Hand shake deals in this day and age are worthless, give the loser his money back and let him know it will sell elsewhere for more.

This is sadly very true. Growing up I saw my grandpa and dad make many handshake deals. They always paid and where paid themselves when they were the seller. My handshake deals have been hit and miss so I don?t do them anymore.


I agree with TD about keeping the money. The problem is now you have to worry about a guy that?s out $1500 and holds you responsible. The right thing to do may prove to just be a headache.
At this point I would call the guy and just return his money. I?m the type of person that hates drama. I couldn?t bring myself to deal with someone that would pull such chicken s**t actions.

 

[duscarter]

Re: Return Deposit?

If you take a hard line and he does the same, you can re-sell it but must give him his money back when it sells, you don't get to write law.
You can sell it for less and keep any shortfall, he may contest it but lose.

Good advice, that is exactly what an attorney friend said. Well almost, he said to tell the guy to get bent and pay the balance in full or wait for his money when I sell it. It helps that a third party can verify my side.

 

[reelfishin]

Re: Return Deposit?

If he paid by check, he has his canceled checks or bank records to show he paid, so there is a paper trailer showing he paid. If it were to go to small claims court, this may be what tips the case in his favor. If he paid your buddy, your buddy may be the one getting sued if he was the one who collected the payments.

Chances are the guy has had time to develop a case of buyers remorse, has found something cheaper, or has spent the money.
I rarely ever do deals like this, it's happened all too often where the buyer has too much time to think about it and changes his mind. I always right the buyer a bill of sale marked partial payment with the balance owed, plus a note stating that failure to pay in full in 30 days forfeits the deposit or balance paid. Even then if it were to go to court, I'd still most likely have to return the deposit, but that may vary state to state. What it boils down to is that even a signed contract means nothing if the goods weren't received or no services rendered.
The only chance you would have is if he were to had signed a specific contract stating it was a non refundable deposit as many car dealers have a buyer sign. The bottom line is that it's probably just not worth all the aggravation to keep the deposit if he tries to fight for it.

You could tell him your keeping the deposit just to see what he does but if he threatens to take it to court, your probably better off just giving him his money back.

I would probably make him wait for it though, you could tell him you need to make payments to him over a few weeks or so, make him come collect the checks too.

 

[aspeck]

Re: Return Deposit?

Thanks for the replies. I have never met the guy in person. The boat is at a friends house, who has room for "projects". The guy left the first check for $500 with him, and then mailed me a check for $1000 two weeks later. That was after I told him it was going back on CL. I will let you know how it goes.

Was anything written on the checks (partial payment, deposit, etc.)? Was there any correspondence with the checks? Like, "This makes $1500, I still owe you $2000?" If there was anything that he wrote indicating the price, and you still have the paper trail, then you have some legal ground. If your friend was negotiating, then all you have is hearsay.

We can all tell you what we would do, but we don't have to do anything ... you do. You know the situation better than the few lines of it that we know. From what I read, I would try to keep some of the deposit and give the rest back to get him off my back and then resell the boat. But there might be more going on than that.

Keep us posted on what you decide and how it turns out.

 

[duscarter]

Re: Return Deposit?

All checks were made out to me. On the first $500 check, he wrote something like "$500 deposit of $3500 due".

I just emailed him his two options:

1. Pay the balance in full and pick up his boat and title.
2. I will re-list the boat, and give him his $1500 when it sells

We will see.