Started Winterization - have a few questions

[gdeangel]

I'm running a 1997 4.3 GL 6 cylinder (GLPLKD) with an SX-C outdrive in Lake Erie. In the past I've had one of the local shops winterize for me, but this year I decided to do it myself. I'm working from the SELOC manual, stuff I've read year, and a few "how to" clips online.

So today I did the fuel stabilization / engine fogging / seawater cooling system. A couple things I'm wanted to get some expert help with.

1) With the fogging, I expected to hear the engine lug / smoke / stall out as I emptied the fogging oil into the carb. However it didn't even hiccup. I even made sure to get the spray straw through the little pin holes in the intake plate. Finally I just closed the choke plate with my hand and it stalled. Should I be concerned?

2) I used the "disconnect all hoses, drain & pour antifeeze" method on the cooling system, rather than the bucket, hose and muffs method. Now, the SELOC says to actually remove the thermostat and pour the antifreeze directly into the block, but I didn't do that - I poured it down the large tube that runs from the thermostat to the water pump. I also poured antifreeze into "long supply hose" to the sea-water pump and the hoses that go the exhaust elbows (That was after I opening two engine block drain plugs and the rubber drain caps on the exhaust elbows.) In total it took just less than 3 gallons of antifreeze. Seems like it probably was about the same amount as the water that I drained out, but I'm just concerned that pouring it through the hose like that it might not have gotten into the block otherwise why would the shop manual have me go through the extra trouble of removing the thermostat.... Should I be concerned?

3) Step 16 in the SELOC says for SX drives to tilt it up, and remove the water drain plug on the port side of the pivot housing where the upper housing attaches to the bell housing. The only "plug" I could see was the same as this one: Drain plug on 98 Volvo Penta 4.3 SX Cobra, and sure enough when I pulled the plug, other than some crud, the inside looked cast solid... So is no "water drain plug" on the 1997 outdrives / the SELOC is just talking about draining the older OMC outdrives... ?

4) This boat saw about 10 hours total in the water this season. I had the lower unit gear oil changed at the end of last season, so my thinking is it shouldn't need to be done again, given how little use it got. Does that seem like a safe assumption?

Thanks in advance for the help!

 

[BrianNJ]

Re: Started Winterization - have a few questions

WRT 1), I am interested to see what others say. I am no expert, but here is my recommended procedure. 1) Warm the engine. This will help assure water vapor can evaporate after you are done. 2) Shut off the engine and turn off the safety kill switch if you have one. Otherwise, disconnect the ignition coil. 3) Have someone crank the engine while you hold the throttle open and spray in fogging oil for several rounds. This will oil coat the intake, valves, and cylinders without burning off the oil. There is no risk of damaging hydro lock from the oil, and will minimize residual fuel in the cylinders. A carburetor will not provide fuel without vacuum, and there won't be significant vacuum with the throttle open at cranking speed. 4) turn on the kill switch or reconnect the ignition so starting isn't an exercise in diagnosis in the spring.

Unfortunately, choking the engine like you did would leave a rich fuel mixture in the cylinders. The fuel can absorb moisture and lead to the corrosion that you are trying to avoid. In airplanes, it is normal procedure to cut the engine by cutting off the fuel supply rather than turning of the ignition. The claim is, for infrequently used engines, it is best to clear fuel from the engine. In the end, it probably isn't a big deal. Lots of engines survive years of sitting with no fogging.

Wrt 4), Inspect it. Pull at least the bottom plug to get a sample of the lube and check the magnet. Hold the rest of the lube in with a finger while inspecting. If the lube is clear and clean, and the magnet is clean, you should be fine. Any sign of water, at least change the lube and consider diagnosing why.

Now that you have heard from an amateur, let's see what the experts say.

 

[skydiveD30571]

Re: Started Winterization - have a few questions

First thing's first, get rid of that Seloc manual unless you want to use it as a kneepad while you work on the ground. Go here and, choose the manuals page, Volvo Penta on the left, and scroll over to find all the manuals for your engine and drive. These are the free OEM service manuals.

1) What intake plate are you talking about? The flame arrestor? If so, you can pull off the flame arrestor and give a more direct shot of fogging oil into the carb. But no, you don't necessarily need to stall the engine with fogging oil. If you gave it several good sprays then it is doing it's job. If it concerns you, you can pull the spark plugs and shoot a spray down each hole but personally I wouldn't worry about it.

2) Did I understand you correctly that you removed all hoses to drain, and then reattached them to pour antifreeze into them? If the block and manifolds are correctly drained, the AF is not necessary. Some people like the extra comfort of having it, some people believe it offers corrosion protection, others simply don't use it. It's up to you, just make sure everything was completely drained before adding it. And by completely drained, I mean don't forget to prod the drain plug holes with a screw or wire to free up the debris that is most certainly blocking them. To get AF into the block, you can remove the thermostat housing, or place a hose onto the tstat housing opening where the big hose was and pour AF into there. Since the thermostat will not be completely open (if open at all), AF will essentially be traveling backwards down through the tstat housing and into the block. To confirm this, you can leave the drain plugs off and watch for AF coming out. Then put the plugs in and continue pouring.

3) That's a Seloc manual for you. Refer to the OEM manuals linked above.

4) This is personal preference. With 10 hours I, and many others, wouldn't bother changing the drive lube. Having said that, that does NOT mean you don't have to do anything. You still need to pull the prop and drain a few ounces of lube to make sure you have no water/metal/contaminants in the lube (water settles to the bottom so the first few ounces will look milky if there is water intrusion). If all is good, plug the hole and top it off thru the dipstick hole. Also don't forget the other necessary drive maintenance which includes pulling the drive off and checking alignment, checking for water in the bellows, check/grease u-joints and gimbal bearing if applicable, and grease the input shaft splines.

 

[gdeangel]

Re: Started Winterization - have a few questions

1) What intake plate are you talking about?

I was referring to the throttle / choke plate. Flame arrestor was off.

2) ... don't forget to prod the drain plug holes with a screw or wire to free up the debris that is most certainly blocking them. To get AF into the block, you can remove the thermostat housing, or place a hose onto the tstat housing opening where the big hose was and pour AF into there.

The drain plugs on my block are the type that have a screw cover with a hole in it that screws down over a post, so you don't actually remove the plug, just open it up. I did use a paper clip to try to prod any crud out of the hole when draining, but just seemed to do nothing. Anyway, by the time I had coaxed all the hoses off the t-stat was completely closed up and when I tried to pour into the block using the hose method, it just spilled out. If I do pull the t-stat housing, I'll remember to leave the plugs open just to make sure the anti-freeze is getting in, but it sounds like pouring it in through the big hose won't get it to back up enough to fill the block....

As for pulling the outer unit and checking alignment, I had that done at the shop last winter. I'll probably put that off again until next season at least, depending on how much use it gets next summer.

The OEM manual link looks helpful, too bad you can't download it for offline viewing on the e-Reader.

 

[bajaunderground]

Re: Started Winterization - have a few questions

The OEM manual link looks helpful, too bad you can't download it for offline viewing on the e-Reader.

You can if have a Mac or Adobe .pdf maker?! Select print and save as a .pdf (I do about 20 page at a time, saved to a folder...you might be able to do more?). Once you have all pages, you can merge them!!! Bam, manual in PDF form!

~Brett

 

[gdeangel]

Re: Started Winterization - have a few questions

Well, I'm glad I checked out that link. Looks like I missed the drain plug on the intake manifold.

Wouldn't it just be easier if you could just download the PDF. I can print the pages but I forget which of my bootlegger PDF programs can actually merge PDF's (I try not to use any Adobe software since it does stuff like automatically update and turn your working computer into a dead albatross :< .)

 

[bajaunderground]

Re: Started Winterization - have a few questions

Well, I'm glad I checked out that link. Looks like I missed the drain plug on the intake manifold.

Wouldn't it just be easier if you could just download the PDF. I can print the pages but I forget which of my bootlegger PDF programs can actually merge PDF's (I try not to use any Adobe software since it does stuff like automatically update and turn your working computer into a dead albatross :< .)

I agree, downloading would be easier! But given "it is what it is!" That's what I did! I use a Mac, so .pdf's are part of the gig"

 

[gdeangel]

Re: Started Winterization - have a few questions

Update: worked on the boat again today. Got the t-stat housing off... saw the reservoir area under the intake manifold was all full of the pink anti-freeze, so I'm thinking great, looks like I got enough in when I poured through the large hose to the block. So just to be safe, I get my a-freeze tester, and guess what, no little floating balls. So I'm thinking, "Wow, that stuff must have really gotten dilluted - maybe there was some debris blocking the engine plugs. Better drain and refill again." So I start with the intake manifold drain, which is easy to get to with the t-stat off... but seriously impossible to reach with the hoses on. Then I go and read the box on my anti-freeze tester and it's only for enthelene glycol.

Bummer.

Refilled from the t-state hole. Had some trouble getting the t-stat housing back on - someone told me to use a gasket AND that permatex t-stat sealer stuff, which made it slide around. Pain in the butt. Hopefully it didn't foul up the sender contact rivets.

But after this, I've concluded that as long as you drain the exhaust manifolds, and then fill them directly from the hoses with AF, then there really is no need to pull the t-stat (in fact, the engine doesn't even need to be warm. I guess the guy's on youtube got it right for once.

 

[skydiveD30571]

Re: Started Winterization - have a few questions

You don't need to pull the tstat housing to get antifreeze into the block. You just have to pour it into the tstat housing via where the large hose (circulation pump) attaches. I do this by disconnecting the large hose at the pump, loosening it at the tstat housing, and rotating (spinning) the hose 180? on the tstat housing so it is now vertically up instead of down. Then just pour in thru the hose and it will travel into the tstat housing and down into the block. If you want to make sure it is working, pull the block drain plugs and watch antifreeze come out before replacing them and adding more antifreeze. Or, you know, skip the antifreeze all together. :joyous:

 

[bruceb58]

Re: Started Winterization - have a few questions

Pull those drains out completely. I would personally replace with brass plugs. I would redrain the block after doing that.

Also, get rid of the Seloc manual and get a real OMC version.

 

[bruceb58]

Re: Started Winterization - have a few questions

I just sent you a PM. I think you will like what's in it.