VRO system failure, What goes when they go?

[RKwood]

As anyone reading this board knows, "to VRO or not to VRO" is often a topic of spirited debate. <br /><br />On a high level the debate seems to boil down to reliability vs convenience.<br /><br />My questions are on the realiability side of the equation. <br /><br />What do the majority of the failures result from? Is the fuel pump more prone than the oil pump, are hose or connection failures the biggest culprits? How many failures can be atttributed to operator error?<br /><br />I guess any failure of the system causing significant damage, must also be a failure of the warning system (horn / wiring / or sensor ?). Can the damage be done to quickly for the warning systems to be effective?<br /><br />Last but not least, any thoughts regarding the warning signs of a system on it's way out? Are the inspection procedures in the manuals sufficent if carried out, say seasonally?<br /><br />Inquiring minds.............<br /><br />Rob K

 

[seahorse5]

Re: VRO system failure, What goes when they go?

Most VRO "failures" are not failures at all but mis-diagnosis. A VRO cannot cause only 1 or 2 or 3 cylinders to fail. It mixes the gas and oil together before it is sent to the carbs, just like if you pre-mix the gas and lube yourself. If it would fail, they do have NO OIL alarm systems, then the engine, crank, rods, bearings, and pistons would be totally trashed, just like if you forgot to add oil in a pre-mix motor.<br /><br />Bass and Walleye Boats magazine had a good article on the myths of the VRO a couple of years ago. You should get a back issue from them.

 

[clanton]

Re: VRO system failure, What goes when they go?

Failure to service engine, or service by a tech that does not follow steps in service manual, has to be at top of list.

 

[homey]

Re: VRO system failure, What goes when they go?

Is the vro a seperate pump? If so, is it hard to get, if one fails? or is the oil injected on a vacuum type system? Can someone clarify this? Explain how it operates? Thank you, Homey.

 

[ob]

Re: VRO system failure, What goes when they go?

Homey,The Vro is a unit that consist of an oil pump component,a fuel pump component, and an air motor drive that is actuated by a hose that is common to the crankcase vacuum and pressure pulses.The fuel and oil are discharged to blend before exiting vro pump as a single line to the carbs.Replacement units and rebuild kits are readily available.

 

[RKwood]

Re: VRO system failure, What goes when they go?

I think the typical failure mode I've seen posted is the actual fuel pump portion of the system.<br /><br />I've never taken a fuel pump apart, but I do know rebuild kits are available. What do the rebuild kits come with????<br /><br />Has anyone ever expierenced failure of the oil pumps? <br /><br />How often do people actual change the filter on the oil pump assembly? How many people still have the filter in the oil line just upstream of the fuel pump still intact, if so how often do you service it? (I guess this would fall into the operator error category?)<br /><br />Has anyone expierenced failures of the sensor within the fuel pumps causing damage?<br /><br />Where's all the risk anyway??????? <br /><br />As usual, inquiring minds.............<br /><br />Rob K.

 

[ob]

Re: VRO system failure, What goes when they go?

RK,Don't know what year or hp you have in question pertaining to the VRO pump ,however on the 95 70 hp Rude I own the only fixture that is inline on the oil line is a flow indicator.I disabled mine some time ago. Not because of an outright failure but rather a leak which developed between the fuel and oil half of the unit resulting in excessive oil rich mixture on startup.If the system and its components ,including oiltank,tank vent fitting,tank pickup, hoses,and oil level are monitored and maintained it doesn't suffer many failures.Trouble is ,many people don't take the time to keep up with it on a regular basis and eventually it will result in failure.I opted to mix 50:1 rather than to worry about the maitenance required or the chance of oil pump failure.Rare as a pump failure might be ,at 6000 rpms you only get one shot.

 

[SpinnerBait_Nut]

Re: VRO system failure, What goes when they go?

Dittos to that OB. Have a new motor 3 weeks out of warranty seize up because the VRO quit and you will learn real quick that as soon as that baby is out of warranty, un-hook it and mix your own.

 

[Bobby D.]

Re: VRO system failure, What goes when they go?

Reading the responces to VRO or not to VRO. I believe I have decided to mix my own. One question what do I do with the line coming from my oil resevoir to the oil/fuel pump??? I have a 140hp Johnson, 1985.

 

[ob]

Re: VRO system failure, What goes when they go?

Either leave it in place and plug it off after the motor clamp or remove it.I left mine in place on the clamp,added a 90 degree spigot,relocated the bulb and now use it and reservoir as a handy oil dispenser.

 

[crusty]

Re: VRO system failure, What goes when they go?

Part of my problem on my 85, 60 Johnson was failure of the pump, broke the bearing on the piston shaft, screwing up the crankshaft, at least it wasn't running too hot and it was a fresh water lake it happened on, not the chuck. So yah we had it disconnected, alittle better peace of mind

 

[DJ]

Re: VRO system failure, What goes when they go?

RKwood,<br /><br />A system is only as good as the maintenance it has seen.<br /><br />If you want to go non VRO-go ahead. Now YOU will be entirely to blame if the the engine blows.<br /><br />Do a search on this board using key words:<br /><br />"VRO"<br /><br />"VRO maintenance"<br /><br />"VRO disconnect"

 

[seahorse5]

Re: VRO system failure, What goes when they go?

Crusty,<br /><br />That is exactly what I was talking about, mis-diagnosis and putting the blame on something "mechanics" don't understand. If only one bearing or piston was damaged, then it was not a VRO problem. If a VRO fails to deliver lubricant, the engine would have the same internal damage on all cylinders, as if you did not add oil to a pre-mix motor. The whole motor would have run without oil, not just one piston.

 

[MFG197]

Re: VRO system failure, What goes when they go?

I owned a 1989 90hp VRO for about 5 years. It worked great, the only problem I had was when an air leak developed because the fuel filter developed a leak (a cheap plastic one). Keep all of the clamps tight on the powerhead hoses and even replace them. It's pretty easy. Remember to purge the oil lines from the tank to the powerhead before the start of every season or after service. Also run pre-mix in the tank until oil use is verified.

 

[RKwood]

Re: VRO system failure, What goes when they go?

My personal set up is a pair of '84 1.6l Sea Drives, currently with VRO.<br /><br />I am purchsing a short block soon to remedy the ills of one of them (not due to VRO failure, but shade tree rebuild) . I plan to reassembly with relatively new VRO fuel pump with maybe 20 hours (purchsed before decline of motor being replaced). <br /><br />I still have what I believe to be the orginal "no wire" fuel pump on the other motor. I am considering purchsing a rebuild kit for that one. <br /><br />Are rebuild kits available for the oil pump? Still no one has replied with oil pump failures, does it happen?<br /><br />Rob K

 

[ICEMAN]

Re: VRO system failure, What goes when they go?

In answer to your question about oil pump failures in the VRO system, Does it happen? I would answer, I have yet to see the oil pump, "ITSELF" fail. Most of the problems I have seen are "not" directly related to the oil pump failing. I have seen oil system air leaks, broken supply hoses, clogged lines, plugged filters and empty oil tanks. All of which, supply oil TO THE PUMP, causing what everyone calls "an oil pump failure." When it actually is an oil supply problem. The design of the VRO pump leaves little possibilities for the oil pump to fail, though I would say it is possible, I have yet to see it. Do to the design, If the VRO unit fails from a leak in a diaphram, or you get an air leak in fuel supply hose, the VRO pump actually pumps more oil into the fuel. If the fuel pump portion or the air motor side of the pump fail, the motor does not get fuel and stops running. If you are running a VRO unit without the no oil warning, I would suggest an upgrade to a new VRO pump assembly. As far as reliability goes, the system is very reliable, just make sure you have an adequate oil supply going to it and your warning system works.

 

[THE-TAZ]

Re: VRO system failure, What goes when they go?

Just my 2 cents, I have recently had problems with my VRO on my '97 Evinrude 225. System worked fine but the sensor went bad sending a false "no oil" signal to the alarm, system getting plenty of oil but not registering. Found out it was cheaper to relace the whole VRO than buy the kit to rebuild it. I personally like the convenience of the VRO especially with a 150 gallon gas tank.<br /><br />Taz