Won't turn over

[Navgunner]

Just got home from the lake and havn't had much time to look over my motor, but was wondering if anyone had an idea where to start. Went out for the day and all was running smooth, then all of a sudden I heard a sound that wasn't right. I am still not sure what the sound was, I just knew I wanted to slow down and listen to it. As I slowed the engine died and wouldn't start again. The starter would engage but was not turning the flywheel. I thought maybe the battery so I hooked up my spare and same thing. I pulled each plug and looked at them. This is a 1973 135hp Rude Model # 135383M if looking at the motor both plugs on the port side seemed pretty dry. both plugs on starboard side looked about right(not dry, but not drenched) Then just to make sure I pulled all plugs and turned her over (I was thinking this tells me that no piston has seized up?) Here is what I was thinking...plugs dry...no gas (are the top 2 plugs served by the top carb or is it possible the port 2 are seved by one carb? the later would be easier to understand) then I am brought to the why it won't turn over problem...I was thinking it could be the starter, but that wouldn't have made it die while running. I believe the second battery proved it wasn't a battery issue. So maybe a short to ground drawing juice from starter? not sure how this happens mid run <br /><br /> Bottom line...am I missing something else that would cause these symptoms before I start tearing into things? Still a rookie in the engine compartment, but loving the learning. I would just really like to learn it before next weekend! Thanks for any input!

 

[JB]

Re: Won't turn over

Check out the Engine FAQs, gunner.<br /><br />Good luck.

 

[Navgunner]

Re: Won't turn over

Will be going through those checks this afternoon JB Thanks. All the same could someone educate me on the cylinder #'s and which is served by which carb on my model? Those 2 dry plugs have me a bit concerned I may need to rebuilt carbs again. Also was a correct that turning over with plugs out means I don't have a seized piston? Thanks

 

[JB]

Re: Won't turn over

The top carb feeds the top 2 cylinders, gunner, and the bottom feeds the bottom cylinders.<br /><br />Don't put too much importance on dry looking vs. wet plugs. When you turn off the ignition the engine turns over a bit more, which will "wet" some plugs and not others.<br /><br />Engines can sieze from overheat or under lube, then release when allowed to cool. Your engine may have siezed and then released.

 

[CATransplant]

Re: Won't turn over

What kind of sound did you hear before the engine quit? That might give us an idea....

 

[Navgunner]

Re: Won't turn over

Wish I could give some explanation of the sound! We were cruising about 4800-5000rpms radio going, people talking.....you know the drill. I heard something and I knew I needed a better listen (can't even guess what it was that I heard) I didn't get everything quieted down, I just immediatly slowed her down then went for radio and people. By that time it was quiet as a mouse (DIW) <br /><br /> The bubble on the back was probably the hottest I have ever had it, but my skin didn't melt when touching it. I wouldn't have kept the back of my hand on it for more than about 3or4 seconds as it was hot. From what I have been reading that shouldn't be overheated should it? <br /><br /> Now that I am home I am heading out to the drive to try it out on muffs and then go through JB's checklist. Will let you know in a bit. If any other thoughts come to mind feel free to drop a note

 

[Navgunner]

Re: Won't turn over

Well...Starter engages but cannot turn flywheel much. Freshly charged battery...now even with plugs out it can't turn it over. <br /><br /> I went through JB's checklist:<br />1. Starter engages flywheel<br /> Solenoid Clicks<br /> Voltage from starter term to bat (-) 9V<br /> Voltage from solenoid to bat (-) 9V<br /> <br />3. Votage at bat w/all electronics off 12.96V<br /> Voltage at bat w/starter engaged 9.9V<br /><br /> removed and cleaned bat to solenoid cable, bat to eng. block cable and solenoid to starter cable. all look good and cleaned all connections<br /><br /> I am about to pull starter and clean block/starter contacts, starter is warm to the touch having only engaged it about 6 times. starter has had a rough life as I have had many of days of cranking on this old bird trying to get her to go: Once I get her going she usually fires all day long, it used to be that initial hump to get it over, but lately I started carrying premix in a ketchup bottle and helping the carbs out and she would fire right up then be fine all day. Last few weeks I havn't even had to do that. This is the worst part! She had never been starting or running better for me up to this point.<br /><br />Any other suggestions?

 

[Navgunner]

Re: Won't turn over

So I cleaned contact points b/t starter and block and no improvement. Next I decided to pull plugs again and see if I could turn it over and it did but very weak. I greased up the bendix real good and that seemed to help a little. I also hooked jumper cables up so I would know I wasn't fighting a loosing battle. I had it turning over with no plugs in. Next I put the plugs back and tried and she turned over a few times, but not hard enough to fire. about the 3rd time I tried flywheel and starter slowed and an erie squeeking sound....I didn't have the heart to continue...I presume that is the sound of an outboard freezing up? where do I go from here?

 

[Basscat 1]

Re: Won't turn over

Can you pull the plugs and turn it over by hand with out the aid of the starter?<br />If you cant do that, then it may be time to look into the powerhead and see whats going on.

 

[Blueclaw]

Re: Won't turn over

If she turns over easy by hand with the plugs out but the starter wont turn it over I'd suspect the starter motor.<br />Have the starter tested for amp draw when turning over.<br /><br />If the motor is stiff when turning it over by hand time to pull the heads

 

[Navgunner]

Re: Won't turn over

I have yet to be able to turn it over by hand with the plugs out, so I guess it's time for the heads to come off....this may be a bit outa my league. I may take it down to the local repair shop tomorrow.

 

[Basscat 1]

Re: Won't turn over

Before giving in may I make one more suggestion?<br />Drain the oil in the lower unit and see if there is a lot metal or gray looking oil (water).<br />I could be possible that something happened in the lower unit and it locked up.<br />If thats the case, I would think it would have sheared the input shaft, but maybe not.