Yamaha 3c 2s vs. Mercury 2c 2s

[Von Snieck]

Hi, i'm new to this forum, hope I'm at the right place. I'm from Europe and was planning to buy a Yamaha 3c 2s (edit: 3 cilinder 2 stroke) autolube engine 40 - 50 hp for my 17 boat with cuddy cabin. But now I stumbled upon a Mercury 40 hp 2c 2s (edit: 2 cilinder 2 stroke) from 2002 ( elpt or elpto? ) which happens to be in very good shape. It's hard to find decent info about this engine here in Europe, in fact this engine looks to be very uncommon here. So I have some questions for you experts abroad

Compared to a Yam from the 90's / 00's, is this 2002 Mercury:
-As reliable?
-As noisy?
-As fuel effici?nt?
-As powerfull?
-As easy to work on?

Is a price of $1800 for this engine in the USA concidered a fair price?

 

[Texasmark]

Would like to help you but don't understand your engine terminology.

Price depends on engine condition. Engine in no need of repair for that price would be a good buy. However time for new rubber: Fuel pump kit, carb kit, fuel lines, impeller, lower unit oil change, spark plugs. Don't know about Yammies. Not a lot of them around here. Mercs are good engines.....proof is in the number you see around.

 

[Faztbullet]

Go with the Yammy as more cubes,more torque.......Compared to a Yam from the 90's / 00's, is this 2002 Mercury:
-As reliable?............almost equal
-As noisy?.............will be noisier at WOT
-As fuel effici?nt?.........depends on rpm range operated
-As powerfull?.........nope
-As easy to work on?.......depends on your mechanical skills and Yammys rarely have ignition problems, that why CDI doesn't have a large selection of aftermarket items for them.

 

[Alumarine]

Would like to help you but don't understand your engine terminology.

Price depends on engine condition. Engine in no need of repair for that price would be a good buy. However time for new rubber: Fuel pump kit, carb kit, fuel lines, impeller, lower unit oil change, spark plugs. Don't know about Yammies. Not a lot of them around here. Mercs are good engines.....proof is in the number you see around.

I think he means 3 cylinder, 2 stroke versus 2 cylinder, 2 stroke.
Took me a bit to figure it out as well. Not sure why it was written that way.

 

[Von Snieck]

Sorry for not being clear. I indeed meant 3 cilinder 2 stroke etc., to shorten the length of the topic title. I'll edit my startpost

So the Merc is louder (at WOT) and less powerfull. Hmm, my wife hates noise and I love power ;D
What about the fuel efficiency? It has to push a 400kg (880lbs) boat with deep V hull. I want to go on day/weekend trips with my wife and two small kids. I think we'll be cruising mostly in a national park we live nearby at slow speed (max 5 knots). From, to and around the park at higher speeds but I guess not much at WOT, just keeping it gliding (aprox 15 knots?).

Other downsides to the Merc? I read that these Mercs don't have a low oil level safety mode? The owner told me that it beeps when oil level is getting low. This is the only safety feature? So when the beeper is broken the engine is going to destroy itself??

 

[Faztbullet]

Say the Yammy cruises at 3500 rpm @15mph the 40 will need to run a higher RPM to stay at the same speed thus more fuel usage. The Yammy has better oiling system and has one drawback the oil cap, as they are known to crack and allow rainwater to contaminate oil tank thus damaging motor.

 

[Texasmark]

I checked for loop charging on the Merc and my latest source is '97 and that model still had the classic 4 cyl cross flow. However the engines on either side were new design and looped. Gonna bet the Yammie is looped. If the Merc isn't then you have your answer......but it probably is...... Pull a spark plug and look at the piston crown. If flat, looped, if domed, cross flow and it does matter.

On big bore vs rpms, as I recall the old OMC big bore twins were harder on gas than the Mercs with lower CCs and higher rpms, but were great luggers of heavy loads and Mercs liked to run.....again, rpms....have to have them since you don't have cubes to get your ponies.....I was there. However ole Ole and company (Evinrude) at OMC did water jacket the combustion and all and they were a lot quieter. Yammie was stated to copy OMC designs....don't remember where I read that.

On the reliability thing, I think I'd just buy a couple of caps and keep them handy or cover your engine when not it use. I'm a Merc guy, but only because it seems to be the best game in town. I have had my share of ignition problems which I didn't have back then with OMC.

I'll pitch my hat in the ring for the silver one.

 

[flyingscott]

Buy the yammie in that class a better all around motor. I have a 93 3 cyl 50 great running and reliable

 

[Von Snieck]

Thanks for all the answers guys, much appreciated. I'm also taking a peek into 4-stroke and Evinrude E-tec, but not sure yet if fuel effici?ncy is going to justify the higher price (prices are times 2 for these engines). My wife certainly is going to love the lower decibels. We come from a sailing boat and she hated sailing by motor. The only equivalent to this I know of is to go electric all the way, which is a complete other league.

 

[ondarvr]

My thinking is you need a bigger motor, a 17' deep V boat with 4 people out cruising around for the weekend will be tough to get on plane with a 50hp motor. Most boats in that range are rated for a 90 or more, and if you go with a 4 stroke you'll surely need to go bigger than 50.

Now if the maximum speed you will be doing is 5 knots, then it makes no difference what hp motor you get, you could go much smaller and go the same speed with better fuel economy, less noise and lower cost.

 

[DavidMoore]

Not enough HP was my initial thought too
I have a 19 ft cuddy cabin with a 3 banger mercury 90 ELPTO - I wouldn't want less horses on my boat.

Someone might be able to give a better substantiation than my gut feeling alone.

 

[Texasmark]

Yikes!!!!! I missed the punch line. Looking back in the days of "woodies" which consisted of oak frames and ?" mahogany plywood for the skin, boats were light and with a near flat to flat transom area were easy to plane. That's why you can see 18' cruisers with mom, pop, and a couple of kids, planing out (barely....look at the spray...big droplets....tells all) with a Johnnyrude 25. But today??????

Agree as I too think you are hp limited for any kind of reasonable performance.

 

[Von Snieck]

The boat we're talking about is a Fjord Fjordling 17, a Norwegian classic runabout from the 60's. You can see them in a classic race in the movie below.

The Rana 17, which I see a lot around here, looks like the Fjordling 17 and I see them most of the time with engines <50 hp. The Rana 17 is aprox. 725 lbs. The Fjordling 17 is probably a bit heavier build, as mine is estimated at aprox. 840 lbs without an engine.
I'm converting it from an inboard to an outboard at the moment. It had a 130 hp inboard gasoline engine but I bought it without the engine.

A small engine would be my first choice, electric would be very cool, but then we're not able to travel the longer distances at higher speed or have some fun tubing occasionally or maybe even wakeboarding. I don't think it has problems planing with a decent 40 or 50 hp 2 stroke engine, but nonetheless something to check out on before hand.

 

[Texasmark]

Weight is nice and light but have to add the gear too. If your boat is like the one shown, dead rise at the stern is nice for a comfortable ride, but doesn't plane well meaning that you need more power to get a certain speed....your comfortable ride costs you....but personally I'd take it. You ought to be able to make a nice wake with your 50 for wakeboarding however. Getting on plane may be a different story. Good luck

 

[Von Snieck]

Now looking into a Honda 50hp 4-stroke. It's a '2006 epa standard' version Not sure if it's with carbs. How does this engine perform compared to a Yamaha 50 2-stroke?