Winterizing Experiment

[SteveRay]

So for the second year in a row I winterized my old '92 3.0L Merc. I am a paranoid freak about the freezing and making sure I got all the water out so of course I drained everything, then hooked up 5 gallons of the -50F and ran through the muffs while fogging.

Last night after it was sitting for a day or tweo I decided I was going to pull the lower plug on the block and make sure antifreeze was in the block. I collected the drainage in a large cup and put it in the freezer overnight......What do ya know, it froze! Not solid by any means and looks like slush. I am leaving this in the freezer overnight again to see if I can freeze it solid.

My question is, does most anti-freeze perform this way?

 

[mkast]

Re: Winterizing Experiment

I'm not telling you what to do, but, if you drain the system, leave it empty, there is nothing to freeze.

 

[Chris1956]

Re: Winterizing Experiment

Steve, After you drain the block and manifolds, some residual water can remain. This is why I introduce the full strength A-F into the block via the hoses, with the drain plugs still out. The residual water is then pushed out. if I were you, I would drain each plug until you see a non-diluted A-F colored liquid come out. You might then refill the block via the large waterpump hose and the manifold cooling hose.

PS - While I believe the "Air doesn't freeze" motto, I have found thru experience that water remains in the block after drainage, under perfect draining conditions.

 

[erikgreen]

Re: Winterizing Experiment

Also, be aware that the "-50C" antifreeze (in fact most antifreeze for boats) is rated for its solid freeze temperature. It will "gel" (thicken to a slush/soft freeze) at a considerably higher temperature in most cases - read the fine print.

I would not be surprised if the antifreeze/water mix you had gelled up in the freezer... I think for the -50 stuff it's something like 0 for a gel temp, but it depends on brand.

Note that it's still effective in preventing cracked blocks, since gel still flows and presumeably won't exert pressure to crack the metal.

Just don't expect freely flowing liquid.

Erik

 

[Bondo]

Re: Winterizing Experiment

PS - While I believe the "Air doesn't freeze" motto, I have found thru experience that water remains in the block after drainage, under perfect draining conditions.

Ayuh,......

I can see Lots of broken Blocks with these new Single Point Draining systems,........
I think they're the biggest BS thing to come down the coast since Mercruiser started using those black,+ blue Plastic Drain Plugs.........
When using these Systems,...... You can't Clean out the drain with a Screw or something,......
Rust,+ Silt,+ Sand will block,+ plug the drains,+ folks will Think they've drained the motor,.....
Only they Haven't..........

My drains are Brass Fittings,.... I Remove them rather than just openning them,+ then rod them out with a deck screw that lives on my intake manifold when not in use.......
That,+ removing the Big Hose from the circulating pump,......
You'd be hard pressed to find Maybe a 1/2 cup of water remaining in my motor........

And,....
If the ice has Nothing to push against,........ Nothing gets Broken..............

Antifreeze is a Waste of Money,............'Cause Air doesn't Freeze.........

 

[rodbolt]

Re: Winterizing Experiment

while its true air doesnt freeze residual water in various oil/clutch coolers and such will and does every year keeps me in new shoes .
I usually start fogging,shut it down,drain all seawater systems I can access then use the permanant non-toxic concentrate mixed at 3 gallons of water to 1 gallon of AF.
this eliminates any water spots and aids in keeping salt corrosion down.
in the salt pond cast iron doesnt like to air dry. it tends to corrode rapidly in the presance of air.
and yes I agree with that crazy drain system and all the bogus plastic fittings that tend to dry rot and break apart in 4 years.

 

[whywhyzed]

Re: Winterizing Experiment

Not solid by any means and looks like slush. I am leaving this in the freezer overnight again to see if I can freeze it solid.

My question is, does most anti-freeze perform this way?

NO. I have checked the antifreeze in hundreds of rads on days MUCH colder than it gets in your freezer. (used to work in Wawa, Ontario) Never seen slush.

2/3 ethylene glycol + 1/3 water will not get slushy until around -70F

See Bottom part of this chart:

 

[f_inscreenname]

Re: Winterizing Experiment

For those who do use anti freeze, I hope you get every last drop back out before you drop your boat in the water. Antifreeze and the environment don't get along to well.

 

[wire2]

Re: Winterizing Experiment

Antifreeze is a Waste of Money,............'Cause Air doesn't Freeze.........

That was my position too, for several years. Then I had the heads off & saw the very heavy rust in there. Here in Ontario, Canada, our boats sit from now til May. That's 6 months of continuous rusting because air and a bit of water in an engine do that. Much faster than if full of water.

Yes, I carefully drain the anti freeze from the engine in the spring. I save it to use again next year. Then I run it on muffs and hose to clear the oil from the cylinders before it goes into the lake.

 

[wire2]

Re: Winterizing Experiment

Here's as good as it gets re; using anti freeze. See Boomyal's post;
http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=224578

 

[erikgreen]

Re: Winterizing Experiment

That's the toxic "car" anti-freeze. For your boats, you're all using the environmentally safe boat AF they sell at west marine and the like, right?

Car anti-freeze will not gel at the same temps as the boat anti-freeze... it handles cold much, much better. But, god help you if the coast guard sees you start your boat and expel a bunch of ethylene glycol into the lake in the spring. Not to mention that it'll kill a dog that happens to lick it up.

The non-toxic boat stuff works well, provided you're aware of its limitations. I'm going to use some for corrosion protection on my boat. Air won't freeze, but it will let rust form freely.

Erik

NO. I have checked the antifreeze in hundreds of rads on days MUCH colder than it gets in your freezer. (used to work in Wawa, Ontario) Never seen slush.

2/3 ethylene glycol + 1/3 water will not get slushy until around -70F

See Bottom part of this chart:

 

[SteveRay]

Re: Winterizing Experiment

Well unfortuantely my newer boat has the handy dandy dangerous "3 point drain system, at least I think its the 3 point system. Motor serial number is OW333888768.

Like I said in the beginning of the post I was confident I drained the block correctly but not positive, and there is no way to guarantee that it is gone without taking everything apart. Hence my use of antifreeze through the muffs.
I would like to start draining the block and backflushing through the hoses. Only other thing would be to drain the power steering cooler correct?