so I moved from 26 pitch to 22 pitch and...

[monterey242]

Hey all,

I own a 1998 Monterey 242 pocket crusier w/ an enemic 305 2bbl rated at 220hp. She weighs in at 4500lbs and i"m not sure if thats' wet or dry weight.
I bought it used w/ 150hrs in July 07'. She had 26pitch (bravo3) props on her. I noticed that at WOT, she would only move to about 3900rpm with just me and the wife on board (and no cargo w/ slight headwind). Also w/ a full crew, I had a very tough time getting on plane.
Normal operating range is 4400-4800rpm.
So after a good deal of research, I went with 22pitch props. Immediately I noticed a much better hole-shot and she planes much easier. With that said, last saturday, I had 4 adults and two little ones on board with one cooler. I went WOT in a shipping channel and all she would manage is 35mph and 4000rpm. Does this sound like normal performance? I know there was some load, but I didn't expect to lose that much top end (being 42mph w/ no crew before).

She seems to run very nicely and there is no bogging/surging or loss of power anywhere in the RPM range. I'm a solid 'car guy' and I know other factors play into things here, but again, i'm just wondering if something is 'fishey' here????

thanks in advance,

Monterey242

 

[lowkee]

Re: so I moved from 26 pitch to 22 pitch and...

26 to 22 is a major pitch change, so you will likely lose 7mph top end pretty easily. You are essentially trading that 7mph for a much better hole shot. If you are still only getting 4K rpm you may want to try a 21p or even a 20p prop set in order to max out your engine effenciency. The closer you get to 4800 without going over the happier your engine will be and the better it will perform all around.

 

[QC]

Re: so I moved from 26 pitch to 22 pitch and...

Fuel and water full? What RPM did you get the 42 MPH with? Tirm? Able to trim up with the load? Seems a little dramatic to me, I would not even think twice if it was 38 MPH vs. 42, so not far off. State of tune? Good sounding operation at any other RPM than WOT is not really indicative of a good running engine, so I am not convinced she is running right even though she doesn't feel different to you.

With that all said and asked, if you told me, with no other data, that your 242 pocket cruiser was running 35 MPH with a 305, I would've said, "Cool, sounds good".

Oh, how you getting your speed numbers?

 

[MikDee]

Re: so I moved from 26 pitch to 22 pitch and...

Welcome to iboats! Yes! You're still overpropped, & killing your engine! A 22" prop, is that a 3blade or 4blade? usually 3 blades are odd number pitch, & 4 blades are even numbered pitch. IMO you need a 19" pitch 3 blade, or an 18" 4 blade, to get you to 4400 rpm with a full load, or 4800 rpm with a light load.

That's a big boat for a 305, but apparently it is the better late model Vortec head motor, it needs to breathe better, you're suffocating it

 

[monterey242]

Re: so I moved from 26 pitch to 22 pitch and...

Fuel and water full? What RPM did you get the 42 MPH with? Tirm? Able to trim up with the load? Seems a little dramatic to me, I would not even think twice if it was 38 MPH vs. 42, so not far off. State of tune? Good sounding operation at any other RPM than WOT is not really indicative of a good running engine, so I am not convinced she is running right even though she doesn't feel different to you.

With that all said and asked, if you told me, with no other data, that your 242 pocket cruiser was running 35 MPH with a 305, I would've said, "Cool, sounds good".

Oh, how you getting your speed numbers?

I'll try to answer one by one:
*Water: not much between clean/grey (42gal capacity, maybe 20% usage)
*Fuel: 70gal capacity. Saturday maybe 35gal at the time
*Speed: (two parts): the 42mph was with me the wife, noone else and reading it from the boats guage. The 35mph was w/ 4 adults, a two & four year old. And both speed was determined crudely from the onboard speedo
*Other: I had been dragging the port trim tab most of the day. It prolly was down somewhat, but I can't say to what degree...

I think the only way to tell for sure is to run her hard by myself correct?
PS: When I bought her in 07' she just had a $300 tune-up. I have not checked the timing, but this year I did replace the wires and most all common fluids...

 

[MikDee]

Re: so I moved from 26 pitch to 22 pitch and...

Just for comparison, I had a 79- 24' SeaRay Cuddy, with a 350/260hp 4bbl Mercruiser, about 4,000 lbs dry, and the best I could get out of it with a clean bottom, synthetic oil, & thru hull exhausts, was 40mph@ 4600rpm with a 17" pitch Merc Black Max alum prop.

So I wouldn't exactly call that Vortec 2bbl 305 "anemic", you just gotta prop it right! But, the 1st thing I'd do is throw a 4bbl carb on it!

 

[QC]

Re: so I moved from 26 pitch to 22 pitch and...

Mik, It's BRAVO 3!!!!

 

[QC]

Re: so I moved from 26 pitch to 22 pitch and...

Verify speed with GPS. 42 MPH was with the 22's? What RPM?

 

[monterey242]

Re: so I moved from 26 pitch to 22 pitch and...

Just for comparison, I had a 79- 24' SeaRay Cuddy, with a 350/260hp 4bbl Mercruiser, about 4,000 lbs dry, and the best I could get out of it with a clean bottom, synthetic oil, & thru hull exhausts, was 40mph@ 4600rpm with a 17" pitch Merc Black Max alum prop.

So I wouldn't exactly call that Vortec 2bbl 305 "anemic", you just gotta prop it right! But, the 1st thing I'd do is throw a 4bbl carb on it!

Ok. I hear ya buddy.

And yes she's a twin prop, 3 blade bravo III. And YES i thought about a good edlebrach 4bbl and dual plane intake to gain some of the top end back.

But from what i'm hearing, it seems the general thought is that its pretty normal. Also to add to the equation, i've added lots of stuff: A TV and other stuff that helps to weigh her down a bit...

thanks all!

 

[clemsonfor]

Re: so I moved from 26 pitch to 22 pitch and...

did you look at the plugs or replace them with the wires? I would always replace the plugs if i did the wires, unless i just did the plugs and the wires were then found to be suspect, in that case i would just throw wires on since i had jsut changed the plugs.

 

[QC]

Re: so I moved from 26 pitch to 22 pitch and...

Need to be within the 4400 - 4800 with a normal load, proper trim and the engine right. Best answer to give.

I actually like being near the lower side of that range if the load is "normal" and you are satisfied with the hole shot. I am somewhat alone in that opinion, but I stand by it. I don't like the 4000 RPM WOT at all.

 

[MikDee]

Re: so I moved from 26 pitch to 22 pitch and...

Mik, It's BRAVO 3!!!!

Okay QC, I got it, but he's still overpropped, and that means double $ Plus, those Vortec head 305's were rated at 250, or 260 hp with a 4bbl depending on the application. A 4bbl would probably take his rpm where he needs to be, without changing props.

 

[monterey242]

Re: so I moved from 26 pitch to 22 pitch and...

Verify speed with GPS. 42 MPH was with the 22's? What RPM?

the 42mph was with the 26pitch... and it dont have a GPS yet...

 

[monterey242]

Re: so I moved from 26 pitch to 22 pitch and...

Okay QC, I got it, but he's still overpropped, and that means double $ Plus, those Vortec head 305's were rated at 250, or 260 hp with a 4bbl depending on the application. A 4bbl would probably take his rpm where he needs to be, without changing props.

I'm thinking the same thing. Unfortunately, that upgrade will have to wait until next year.

PS: in 1998 the 305 was rated 220hp and the 350 at 260hp. the mag hadn't come out yet...

 

[junior1113]

Re: so I moved from 26 pitch to 22 pitch and...

are these 4 blade props if so id look into a 18-19p cant believe someone put a 26 on that application

 

[monterey242]

Re: so I moved from 26 pitch to 22 pitch and...

are these 4 blade props if so id look into a 18-19p cant believe someone put a 26 on that application

I know. I couldn't believe it either. And no they are 3 blade bravo III dual props. Its the only way they come I believe. I almost started to believe the previous owner was trying to hide something with that prop selection...

 

[QC]

Re: so I moved from 26 pitch to 22 pitch and...

No matter what, it is still possible she isn't running right. I am not clear on the propset RPM change on a Bravo 3, but I am guessing as much as 400 RPM between the 22s and 26s, maybe more. Gear ratio is really important for the rest of this discussion . . .

 

[monterey242]

Re: so I moved from 26 pitch to 22 pitch and...

No matter what, it is still possible she isn't running right. I am not clear on the propset RPM change on a Bravo 3, but I am guessing as much as 400 RPM between the 22s and 26s, maybe more. Gear ratio is really important for the rest of this discussion . . .

I don't have the gear ratio. How do I find it?

OT: and if i do decide to do the 4 barrel & intake, what are the best options? I was looking at the marine variants of the edelbrock components (at summit racing). Is there a better choice and do I need anything else other than the proper gaskets to make it work?

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/EDL-1409/
and
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/EDL-2104/


thanks again!