2000 Sea Ray 180 BR

EugeneP

Cadet
Joined
Aug 31, 2015
Messages
23
Hello all,

Thank you for reading this and thank you in advance for responding. Im fairly new to boating, last year I purchased a 1994 Bayliner Capri with a 120hp Force outboard. This boat was a nightmare from the beginning?it was very difficult to start, lots of smoke, was taking water..and later on I found out one of the cylinders was shot(low compression) and humidity all around the hull was at 100%. I got rid of it at the end of the seaon..and now with some much more money saved, I?m looking to purchase my second boat.

Im really trying to avoid the bad experience I had last year. I signed an agreement to buy contract (with a 300$ cashdown ), with the transaction to be completed upon the successfully completion of the water test (when the weather allows it, im in Quebec Caanda)and maybe a mechanical inspection. Its about a 2000 SEA RAY 180 BR, with a Mercruiser 3.0 (SN: L698974), with about 322 hours on the meter. The total price is 9200$ Canadian, with all the accessories ? water skis, bimini, fish finder, fenders etc. I had the boat surveyed and while the boat is very clean overall, the inspector found a start of delamination on the transom top right, above the water line. The humidity test were about at the 60% percent on this area, while the rest all over the boat at a perfect 30%. The expert mentioned this is just a start and might take years to develop further if it will. Even if it will develop further he said there are cheaper alternatives to removing the engine and fixing the whole transom, such as injecting with epoxy to fill out the potential spots and this should cost somewhere between 500-1000$. Considering the excellent state of the boat, he advised I should go ahead and buy it. So my questions to all of you?should I still buy it? Is this worrying in the short ? medium term? Are there any other test that would determine the state of the delamination?

Second part, its about the Mercruiser engine. Im somehow mechanically inclined and have some experience with outboards. I understand the basic tests that I could do on the engine before buying such as:..check for leaks, check for drive shaking, leaks, compression test, check idle, acceleration on the water, oil pressure and engine temperature. Other than this..are there any other tests you recommend/ spots to check? Is it worth to spend another 100-150$ to have it inspected by a marina?

Thank you so much.
 

oldjeep

Admiral
Joined
May 17, 2010
Messages
6,455
I'd walk away. Not sure what a Canadian dollar is worth these days but in good shape without the transom issues that boat is worth maybe 7000 dollars
 

EugeneP

Cadet
Joined
Aug 31, 2015
Messages
23
9200$ Cad with the canadian being at an all time low, its about $7000 US..
Not to mention, Im about 650$ in already..350$ the survey and 300$ the deposit
 

oldjeep

Admiral
Joined
May 17, 2010
Messages
6,455
9200$ Cad with the canadian being at an all time low, its about $7000 US..
Not to mention, Im about 650$ in already..350$ the survey and 300$ the deposit

There is such a thing as throwing good money after bad. a boat with partial delamination and moisture issues should be sold at a significant discount.
 

JoshOnt

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Aug 12, 2013
Messages
487
I would say still go for it if you can get him to come down to about 6.5-7k CAD due to the transom issue. The 9200 price is for the boat without that issue, with it yo should get a significant discount as oldjeep mentioned.
 

JASinIL2006

Vice Admiral
Joined
Feb 10, 2012
Messages
5,743
Have you read any of the threads of transom replacements in the Restoration section? If not, you might want to take a look at that, because that is your future if you buy this boat. In don't know how much wood the 2000 Sea Rays have in them, but if the transom is bad, any wood below deck (e.g., stringers) is likely going to be bad, too.

I can't comment on the pricee (between the funky exchange rate and the generally higher cost of stuff up there, it's hard to compare) but down here in the Midwest US, that would be a terribly overpriced boat. Between the smallish engine and the obvious rot problems, I wouldn't think of paying that much. You're probably looking at a couple hundred hours of work and a couple thousand dollars (maybe more in $CA). Is that worth it to you?
 

Scott Danforth

Grumpy Vintage Moderator still playing with boats
Staff member
Joined
Jul 23, 2011
Messages
51,720
If it was me, I would offer $5k Canadian, then run it for 2-3 years, pull the motor, fix the delamination correctly (injecting epoxy wont work). then run the boat for a few more years and sell it for your next boat.

not sure how the boats compare to the US, however there are some low hour 180's with the 3.0 for under $6k us on craigslist (one is $4500, some in the $8k range)
 

Newbie@boats

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Apr 6, 2010
Messages
536
I just bought my 2001 Bayliner 3.0L Merc I/O in real clean shape for $3,000 USD.......Transom issues? Walk away....
 

EugeneP

Cadet
Joined
Aug 31, 2015
Messages
23
No Title

I would like to add the market in Canada, is quite different than US, everything..like cars, electronics, houses..etc tend to be at least 15-20% more expensive, adding the exchange rate, where 1$ US= 1.35 -1.$ CAD we are probably looking at almost 50% difference in price. If i walk away here are some alternatives in the area, within the same budget:

2000 Crownline 180 BR, mercruiser 3.0, 11.500$ + 15% taxes (dealership)
2001 Sea Ray 180 BR, mercruiser 3.0 : 10.000$ nego (no bimini top or accessories)
2004 Bayliner 175: 9950$, with bimini
2003 Larson 180 SEI, mercruiser 3.0, 10600$..no bimini
2008 Bayliner 175, $11000, no bimini
2003 Stingray 180Ls, $9800, bimini gps

The survey evaluated the boat at 8400$, without trailer and accessories, based on the blue book and at 10.500$ with trailer and all the accessories.


I could negociate but i dont think he would go down more than 500$, there was a lot of interest and potential clients for the boat, so if its not me..he will probably find someone else. Its important to mention that here..there are very hard winters, and from what i talked to a local marina ..this is what kills most of the boats, they get a bit of water, people leave them outside in the winter..and with freeze/unfreeze cycles..the water trapped inside expands.

I called a local marina service and i was quoted between 3000-3500 to fix the transom, confirming the epoxy injection is not a solution for the transom. Also, the rest of the hull is 100% clean, no track of humidity whatsoever. From the research ive done..the hull is made of fiber glass entirely, with no wood stringers. I attached some of the boat pictures and also the humidity test for the transom
 

Attachments

  • photo239672.PNG
    photo239672.PNG
    176 KB · Views: 0

EugeneP

Cadet
Joined
Aug 31, 2015
Messages
23
No Title

more photos..
 

Attachments

  • photo239673.jpg
    photo239673.jpg
    178.3 KB · Views: 1
  • photo239674.jpg
    photo239674.jpg
    269.9 KB · Views: 1
  • photo239675.jpg
    photo239675.jpg
    356.8 KB · Views: 0
  • photo239676.jpg
    photo239676.jpg
    189.2 KB · Views: 0

roffey

Commander
Joined
Nov 22, 2012
Messages
2,206
I'm going to show my ignorance here but if the sea ray does not use wood in it's construction and as far as I know they don't. How can the hull delaminate?

My 2 cents are you are paying at the top end for that boat but being a sea ray it is a higher end boat and the pictures of look like it is immaculate.. Only you know if its worth it. It your money, whos to say you don't use it for a couple of years sell it to purchase bigger and better. I'm in Ottawa so we are close and I watch the used boat ads all the time. Now is a bad time to start looking as you will pay top dollar. It looks like you started your search early so good on you.
 

roffey

Commander
Joined
Nov 22, 2012
Messages
2,206
... and if the hull or transom is delaminating can't you repair with new fiberglass and I know I am making it sound to simple.
 

oldjeep

Admiral
Joined
May 17, 2010
Messages
6,455
I'm going to show my ignorance here but if the sea ray does not use wood in it's construction and as far as I know they don't. How can the hull delaminate?

My 2 cents are you are paying at the top end for that boat but being a sea ray it is a higher end boat and the pictures of look like it is immaculate.. Only you know if its worth it. It your money, whos to say you don't use it for a couple of years sell it to purchase bigger and better. I'm in Ottawa so we are close and I watch the used boat ads all the time. Now is a bad time to start looking as you will pay top dollar. It looks like you started your search early so good on you.

Searay in that size is not a premium boat, pretty much the same thing as a Bayliner or a Maxxum. Not that it is bad, but condition is everything.
 

EugeneP

Cadet
Joined
Aug 31, 2015
Messages
23
I'm going to show my ignorance here but if the sea ray does not use wood in it's construction and as far as I know they don't. How can the hull delaminate?

My 2 cents are you are paying at the top end for that boat but being a sea ray it is a higher end boat and the pictures of look like it is immaculate.. Only you know if its worth it. It your money, whos to say you don't use it for a couple of years sell it to purchase bigger and better. I'm in Ottawa so we are close and I watch the used boat ads all the time. Now is a bad time to start looking as you will pay top dollar. It looks like you started your search early so good on you.

Hi Roffey..thank you so much for your feedback, I know its not the best time to buy...but caught the virus last year:)...and been saving all winter for a boat, ..i would imagine will pay maybe 1-2k more than what i could get in Sept..but Im ok with it, knowing that ill enjoy it all summer..

The hull is in perfect condition, no signs whatsoever..of humidity, osmose or ..delamination. I believe the transom still has wood, or some other material. Whats is certain though..it has some humidity as per test above..

Roffey...i know its a tough call, but what would you do if you were in my shoes?:)
 

Blind Date

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Mar 5, 2014
Messages
462
I wouldn't worry about it, which is the same advice your inspector gave you. That boat looks well taken care of & will last another 16 years easy. The transom in my '79 Glastron Carlson had all kinds of rot @ 34 years old when I pulled it apart. But it was still solid and I could have run that boat another 10 years safely if the floor and stringers weren't in such bad shape.

To me it's a non-issue but use it to negotiate the price down a little as long as you spent money to have the survey done. And if it was me I wouldn't give second thought about buying that boat.
 

roffey

Commander
Joined
Nov 22, 2012
Messages
2,206
Roffey...i know its a tough call, but what would you do if you were in my shoes?:)

LOL, I would buy it... I bought three boats in as many years. Why you might ask, well because I felt I just had to have a boat. The first two boats were 1984 and 1985. Both had motor problems. The last boat I bought was brand new and it was new because of the problems I had with the first two. Keep in mind The most I paid for the first two boats was $3700 for a 26 foot wellcraft. I traded in my second boat, a 18 foot with a 3.7 188hp motor, the motor had a bent push rod. After trading it in I noticed the floors were soft, I dodged a bullet on that one.

I guess what I am saying is, I might not be the best person to take advice from. For what ever its worth my new boat is the greatest but most can't buy new and that's why this forum is great. You will get unbiased opinions here.
 

roffey

Commander
Joined
Nov 22, 2012
Messages
2,206
Searay in that size is not a premium boat, pretty much the same thing as a Bayliner or a Maxxum. Not that it is bad, but condition is everything.

good to know, I thought Sea rays were higher quality boats. I almost bought one if not for the sales person being such a nob.
 

JASinIL2006

Vice Admiral
Joined
Feb 10, 2012
Messages
5,743
I would think that a 2000 vintage boat may have a few years before it has real problems, or it may be much sooner. Lots of mid- to late-90s boats being restored if you check out the Restoration forum. You might get lucky or you might find water leaking in around your outdrive this summer. I guess it comes down to whether you like to gamble...
 

EugeneP

Cadet
Joined
Aug 31, 2015
Messages
23
thank you all for your imput...much appreciated it

In the end, i decided to pass on it..and get over the 350$ survey cost and now looking to buy something else..

I came across a 2003 Sting Ray 180 LS, in pretty good shape, for about 500 $ more ..unfortunately, there is an obvious difference in built quality when comparing to Sea Ray, the storage compartments are not gel coated, i find the leather..is thinner than sea ray and the engine bay and hatch have an inferior design; also when opening the ski storage area, it seems there is a lot more wood than the sea ray.

Does anyone have any experience with Sting Ray? Are they good quality boats?
 

Blind Date

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Mar 5, 2014
Messages
462
You might get lucky or you might find water leaking in around your outdrive this summer.

That's something you might expect to happen in 30-40 years, not next year.

Sorry to hear some of the guys on this board scared you away. They gave you bad advice. Should have listened to your surveyor and bought it.
 
Top