No Continuity No1 Coil - 150 60 Degree

[Riley C]

Hi Guys I thought to start a new thread being a totally different issue to the water pump.

On my 98 150 60 Degree Looper.

For some time I have thought the idling has been a little rough, I have always had WOT @5500rpm. Except for on the weekend it dropped to 4000 max. I cleaned down the plugs on the water, thinking one had fouled. It was fine for most of the day after that.

The accessories gauges on that same day dropped out while engine was running, but came on after turning on off again. Maybe a bad ground? This has only happened once and not again since, with multiple starts etc over the week.

While starting her yesterday in the test tank, it did have a rough idle, mainly during startup.

I pulled the coils down and tested with the spark tester, I get 7/16 on all of them with nice blue spark.

So thought to test the coils. The number one coil has infinity resistance reading, the primary (Power Pack Terminal) grounds with 0 ohms. However, I get infinity reading when testing the primary and secondary terminals together. The manual states 275+-50. All the other coils read at 295-299.

The coil of worry Secondary or spark plug terminal, turns in the coil housing for some reason and figure it is broken.

This coil I feel may be the source of why my max rpms dropped out on the weekend. That plug however, did not look fouled out and has a good burn colour.

My question is can you have no polarity or ohm reading but have a decent coil still?

Stator tests were fine, have not done a DVA on power pack.

Stator charges to 14.7volts. Never an issue cranking her over.

I think this motor even with low hours and good care, has ignition issues.

Either way I will order a backup.

Any recommendations?

 

[jakedaawg]

So thought to test the Coil PN 583740. The number one coil has no polarity, the primary grounds, but no Ohms at all.

this makes little to no sense. Where, exactly, were you placing the test leads and which setting was the dvom set to? No polarity? Are you referring to the + or bat terminal on an automotive style coil?

 

[jakedaawg]

Also,.which side of the coil do you consider primary and which secondary? The mechanics here will understand the winding and lead that go to the plug with super high voltage and create the spark to be the secondary. The winding that is hooked to the power pack will be considered the primary.

 

[Riley C]

this makes little to no sense. Where, exactly, were you placing the test leads and which setting was the dvom set to? No polarity? Are you referring to the + or bat terminal on an automotive style coil?

Sorry Jake,

I meant to say.

Primary as testing the power pack terminal. Secondary testing the spark plug terminal.

When testing the primary I have O resistance between that terminal and ground. When testing between primary terminal and the secondary terminal per the manual, I get OPEN or infinity. This exceeds the manual 275ohms -+50.

All the other coils get in the range of 295-299ohms.

Sorry I'm just a plumber and not a mechanic.

 

[Riley C]

Also,.which side of the coil do you consider primary and which secondary? The mechanics here will understand the winding and lead that go to the plug with super high voltage and create the spark to be the secondary. The winding that is hooked to the power pack will be considered the primary.

I had the meter set to 2000 ohms.

I had my words crossed when saying polarity. Meant to say resistance.

 

[jakedaawg]

Pull the boot off the spark plug lead. You will see a little spring with a pointy end. Strip 3/16 in of insulation. Place wire between coils of spring while putting the point through the insulation and the wire core. Retest.

 

[Chris1956]

The primary winding on the ignition coil specs out at between .05 - .15 ohms. A cheap meter could easily show that as zero ohms.

The secondary winding spec is 225 - 325 ohms. A cheap meter could show that as most anything. I had a cheap meter that couldn't tell the difference between 400 ohms and an open. I tossed it out.

If you are getting spark, the coil is good.

 

[Riley C]

The primary winding on the ignition coil specs out at between .05 - .15 ohms. A cheap meter could easily show that as zero ohms.

The secondary winding spec is 225 - 325 ohms. A cheap meter could show that as most anything. I had a cheap meter that couldn't tell the difference between 400 ohms and an open. I tossed it out.

If you are getting spark, the coil is good.

Thanks Chris,

Yeah it is a cheap meter, I think you're right. All the other coils secondary winding's check out though at around 299. So that's why I thought a fault.

So I shouldn't be concerned about the spark (Secondary) Terminal turning within the case? It stays in there, you can spin it that all.

Coils do not fail often do they, compared to the other fittings?

 

[Riley C]

Pull the boot off the spark plug lead. You will see a little spring with a pointy end. Strip 3/16 in of insulation. Place wire between coils of spring while putting the point through the insulation and the wire core. Retest.

Cheers Jake,

I will do the test to confirm.

 

[jakedaawg]

So I shouldn't be concerned about the spark (Secondary) Terminal turning within the case? It stays in there, you can spin it that all.

this is what my last post will address. The terminal you talk of is the little coil spring with a pointy end. Once you pull the boot off you will see why I described it as such.

 

[Faztbullet]

So I shouldn't be concerned about the spark (Secondary) Terminal turning within the case? It stays in there, you can spin it that all.​

It will read 0 as the terminal s broken its output connection from coil internally. Now it jumps 2 spark gaps ...one internally and one at plug. Even through it still works need to replace as could cause a voltage 'buck" back into pack and damage it.

 

[Riley C]

Ok guys,

I went on the water today. Started up fine then dead!

I'm having issues on a few fronts to due previous owner neglect. I have had boat 3months.

Had no spark at all. Did the stop circuit test and it fired up straight away.

Searching deeper, I found that the Terminal M 6 pin harness plug to the control box had a bid short mark (Salt within it). The burn shorted between the YELLOW BLACK & RED YELLOW (Assume Neutral switch line to starter solenoid?). This I don't know what damage this has done but bloody hell.

I have the following.

1. Key switch check out for most steps. But not for continuity between terminals B&C.
2. With control disconnected, At the control box harness Yellow Red and black ground have continuity?
3. Yellow black and yellow red do not have continuity.
4. The neutral test switch tests fine.

If the yellow red and the yellow blcak shorted what would blow? Key switch seeing engine start when doing stop circuit test. Or could it be the harness?

In a world of hurt to fix this now.

 

[Riley C]

It will read 0 as the terminal s broken its output connection from coil internally. Now it jumps 2 spark gaps ...one internally and one at plug. Even through it still works need to replace as could cause a voltage 'buck" back into pack and damage it.

Fazt,

thanks for that. I will definitely relace this coil then.

This short between the terminals on the 6pin plug to the control box, is weird. It looks like it crossed between the black yellow and red yellow terminals.

Later this afternoon after unplugging everything and setting back up. I managed to start it normal and ran it for a while. Now it seems fixed. I want to make sure though!

I hope I have fried the power pack with this short.

You’re a real big help on this forum! Your advice is second to none.

 

[Riley C]

Later this afternoon after unplugging everything and setting back up. I managed to start it normal and ran it for a while. Now it seems fixed. I want to make sure though!

I hope I have not fried the power pack with this short.

Can anyone explain if shorting the two wires damages the starter solenoid, power pack or key switch?

My gut feel even though it’s fixed, it will strike back.

Any recommendations on what I should test next? My DVA is not the best.

 

[Riley C]

Also the kill switch doesn’t work when lanyard pulled.... I don’t know if this work previously as I have not had the boat long enough.

 

[Faztbullet]

If the kill lanyard clip to front of switch it a mechanical kill as switch is spring loaded..i

 

[Riley C]

If the kill lanyard clip to front of switch it a mechanical kill as switch is spring loaded..i[/QUO

I Tried to delete this comment, I thought it was set up
like the old style. It’s definitely the mechanical one so all good.

apologies for that.

 

[Riley C]

If the kill lanyard clip to front of switch it a mechanical kill as switch is spring loaded..i

Fazt,

Do you think I should trust this kill short issue has fixed itself now after pulling the harness plugs and switches down? It cranks now with good spark and turns on off easy enough.

I’m replacing that dodge coil tomorrow to prevent a “buck”. Just wondering if I need to get anything else.

Does the red yellow neutral switch to/from the starter, have 12v. With this then arcing to the black yellow kill wire? Causing a ground. Thus killing any chance of starting?

I sprayed connections down with contact cleaner etc.

 

[Tim Frank]

Where are you using a Dodge coil?
Picture?

 

[Riley C]

Where are you using a Dodge coil?
Picture?

The dodge coil feeds No1 cylinder. However, I'm buying a new one today.