Four Winns HD 180 not getting its specs

[Niall16]

Hey Everyone. We just purchased a 2020 Four Winns HD 180 with a four stroke 115hp CT on the back. It is not getting the specs that we were told were "bulletproof". We are 5mph less at all RPMs then their specs. We have tried a lot of things that could be the problem. Spun prop, motor mounting height, proper propeller to their specs. Does anyone have this boat and what are the specs you are getting? Thanks

 

[GA_Boater]

Welcome aboard.

Brand new boat - That's what the dealer is for. Isn't it the dealer who told you the specs were "bulletproof"?

A word about performance specs - All conditions must be exactly the same. Same fuel load, passenger load, extras, water shape, wind, trim - Everything must match.

What are you using to measure speed?

 

[Niall16]

Thanks for your interest. We spoke with Four Winns propulsion engineer and he said they are conservative on their specs so we should be getting better. The best I can get with just me on board, on glass water, 1/4 of a tank of fuel is 5mph off there WOT specs. Crazy. Four Winns is now offering us a higher pitch stainless steel prop to get the specs. Just need to find someone else with the same boat to see what they are getting.

 

[Scott Danforth]

has the motor been properly broken in?

what is your WOT and how does that compare to the engine specs?

quality of fuel?

how are you triming your boat out? lack of trimming and you loose about 10mph easy.

 

[GA_Boater]

Hey Joe, how about some numbers?

WOT RPM, speed at WOT and what do the specs call for?

Again, how are you measuring speed?

Also, where are you using the boat?

How long have you had the boat and what does the dealer say?

What is a Propulsion Engineer? Quite surprised you were able to talk to a factory guy as a customer.

 

[QBhoy]

Hi

i think I can help compare things a little. I have a 19ft deep v cuddy with the same engine. If it’s a CT.
what speed and rpm are you getting ?
i have tried a few props on mine. Here is some data for you. Pretty accurate too using gps and smart craft ecu rpm

19” tempest plus will run to the limiter at about 6150 rpm at 41/42 mph GPs all being well
20” enertia will run to just under 6000 rpm or on it at about 44mph usually and one 45 mph GPs one day with a following chop. Even with the hood up and a few on board it will run early 40’s gps at about 5800 rpm roughly. The rpm range is 5000-6000 rpm supposed to be with the 2.38 CT ratio. The hull I have is known to be a quick hull with a bit of breeding to it though. The 115 CT 2.1 litre is well known these days to put out around 130ish HP too. Great engine.

 

[Faztbullet]

Make sure the control cable is pulling throttle plates full open..

 

[Scott Danforth]

I dont know of a recreational boat manufacture that has a propulsion engineer. Most simply rely on the engine application engineers to approve the rigging.

 

[tpenfield]

Isn't that boat spec'd for a 150 hp maximum ? You have a 115 HP . . . So, are there 2 sets of spec's for the boat with the 2 different power options?

where are these spec's published?

 

[Alumarine]

I wonder if it's because of the Command Thrust gearcase?

 

[Niall16]

Thanks for all the interest.
Here are the specs for my boat right down to the prop sizes for each motor the boat comes with.
I will try and answer most of the questions asked.
The motor has been broken in properly.
Right now with the prop supplied by the manufacturer we are hitting the rev limiter at 6150 RPM and getting 35mph. Should be at least 40mph. We are at least if not more than 5mph less when at the stated RPMs in their book. Hard to plane.
With regards to trim. I have spent hours micro trimming to get the best out of every RPM. Still no good.
I only use High test fuel and put in fuel stabilizer every time I put in gas.
We have had the boat for 4 weeks.
Measuring speed with 2 GPS and speedometer.
We are using the boat on lake ontario. Four Winns tests their boats on Lake Cadillac right beside Lake Michigan. Which is 1000 feet Higher in altitude than we are so we should be getting better specs.
We spoke with the engineer who rights the book that is in the photos. He said his team test each engine and they right down their results. He also said they test it with half to 2/3 load which is about 1200lbs in the boat.
Dealer and Four Winns thought my engine had something wrong with it until another boat on the lot did the exact same numbers as mine. And yes I was in the other boat and saw it perform. And only 2 of us in the boat with 1/8 tank of fuel.
Instead of figuring out what is wrong with it they just want to give me a 19 pitch Enertia prop. Yes I will go faster but what is wrong with my boat.
If you look closely we are getting the specs for the 90hp Merc.
We bought new so we wouldn't have any problems.
We will be checking soon if the motor is mounted to low.

 

[Scott Danforth]

take it to the dealer, you are currently under-prop'd

 

[Niall16]

The engineer said we were under proped but then said he got 40mph with the prop he speced out in the boat. Something wrong with my boat or the engineer is lying. Should only have to go stainless to get better performance than the specs not just to reach them. Just need to find another boat the same as mine to see what their getting.

 

[tpenfield]

I suspect that you should go up a notch (2") in the pitch, since you are hitting the rev limiter . . .

Once you go through all of this and if not living up to the published spec's . . . what do you think your re-course will be? :noidea:

 

[emoney]

I don't see in the stuff you shared written by the "Propulsion Engineer" where it says minimum 40 mph? End of the day, like tpenfield mentioned, if you find out that 35 mph is MAX your boat will do, what's the next step? Have you confirmed the controls are set up so that you're getting maximum throttle advance when they're pegged? It's a easy thing to miss.

 

[tpenfield]

Just as a reference point, Boating Magazine has a review of a FW HD 180 w/ 200HP Sterndrive . . . 41.3 mph @ WOT.

 

[QBhoy]

Hi. Have a look at my last post. You’ll need a 19” or 20” enertia or tempest. Both do well on these CT115 and a boat that size and weight. You will get 40 mph or a little more out here trimmed up with these props. You are currently under propped. I can hit the limiter with a 19” tempest at just over 40 gps with mine. The 20” is what I use now. Better at cruise speed and a little more top end too. You’ll need a steering system though. Very serious torque steer without.

 

[Niall16]

We are going up in pitch from a 17 inch to a 19 and going to stainless in the attempt to get the numbers.
However look at this. My anti-ventilation plate is 2" under water at WOT and trimmed as best we can. Everything I have read said this is not the best. Let me know what you think.

 

[dingbat]

However look at this. My anti-ventilation plate is 2" under water at WOT and trimmed as best we can.

That's on plane?

Looks like your running it in the barrel...the water coming out from under hull should not be that agitated....

 

[tpenfield]

I was thinking you already had a SS prop on the boat . . . if not it will certainly help. Engine does seem a bit low in the water . . . so maybe raise it up a bit.

Did the engineer type from FW ask about these things?