SNAPPED a head bolt :-(

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Franki

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Hi all, <br /><br />I've got a 100ESL70 100HP V4 Johnson outboard.<br /><br />I just added a tmp guage to the unit, and while trying to get a headbolt out so I could stick a bracket under it, I snapped a headbolt. (no I wasn't accidently tightning it, It just snapped.)<br /><br />The bolts shank is tiny, but I managed to drill a tiny hole into the center of it.<br />Tomorrow I am going to go looking for an eze-out to try and get this puppy out and replaced. Having never done this before, particulatly on an alloy head.. I thought I'd ask for suggestions and tips..<br /><br /><br />has anyone got any for me?<br /><br />rgds<br /><br />Frank
 
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G DANE

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Re: SNAPPED a head bolt :-(

Franki - I have a good bullitprof way to get it out. Dont drill and cut, you will end up off center. Get in touch with a workshop that has TIG Welding. TIG weld a nut or end of another bolt in same size to the shank. The flame will not seek the aluminium but only the steel. The bolt expands from the redheat and when cold again, you can easily turn it out with a wrench. I done this 6 times now and all got out - no damage to threads. It is the best way i ever seen. A good MIG Welder can do it too !
 
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petryshyn

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Re: SNAPPED a head bolt :-(

Ditto Gdane<br /><br />If it broke taking it out, its in there good. An easyout will be futile. I've mig'd several. Maybe putting that Z bracket under a water jacket cover bolt would be easier.....
 
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Franki

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Re: SNAPPED a head bolt :-(

I am going to have to try the ezeout, I can gently apply heat to the surrounding alloy, <br /><br />and I meant to say water cover bolt, not heaad.. sorry, it broke 4 mm into the hole, so I won't be able to get to it to weild anything to it..<br /><br />I will soak it in penetrine, and heat the surrounts and hope like hell that I can get it out..<br /><br />rgds<br /><br />Frank
 
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Gold Bear

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Re: SNAPPED a head bolt :-(

Franki,<br /><br />Since you are going to try the ez out (and soaking it) put a punch on top of it and give it a few good hits with a hammer before trying to remove it with the ez out.<br /><br />(Make sure the small hole you drilled doesn't "expand" from your effort, maybe use a flat tipped punch that will fit inside the hole?)<br /><br />Good luck,<br /><br />Gold Bear ;)
 
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petryshyn

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Re: SNAPPED a head bolt :-(

Ditto Gold bear<br /><br />Your success will depend on how centered you dilled the hole. Try to drill right through so penetrant can get below and work from both sides.
 
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G DANE

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Re: SNAPPED a head bolt :-(

Franki<br /><br />If you plan on applying heat, drill a hole in some asbestos or similar and heat shank of bolt. Aluminium is a fabulous heatleader, it will be difficult for you to do anything else but burn paint off. Heating bolt will loosen it when it cools off.
 
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petryshyn

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Re: SNAPPED a head bolt :-(

They make a stick rod specificaly for bolts broken below surface. You set a nut over the hole, insert the welding rod through the nut till it reaches the broken bolt. It arcs and automaticaly limits the flow until the nut is full!!! It doesn't touch the aluminum cause of the insulative jacket. It works unnnnbeleiveable!! It good for anyone who has a buzz box welder.(stick welder)
 
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G DANE

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Re: SNAPPED a head bolt :-(

Franki <br /><br />You can MIG weld some into the hole - i tried that too, but dont know about 4 m.m. But again, if you hit the bolt - no harm to aluminium !
 
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Franki

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Re: SNAPPED a head bolt :-(

I had toyed with several ideas each more desparate then the last, that nut and stick weilder approach has merit.. I can get a stick weilder. unfortunatly I sold my mig years ago.. so thats not really an option..<br /><br />I have already drilled the hole, its not "exactly" dead center, but its close..<br /><br />I'll drill all the way though now, see if I can't get it full of oil..<br /><br />I even toyed with the idea of getting my power engraver/grinder and cutting a screwdriver slot in it.. but that is less likely to work then the ezeout...<br /><br />I don't even think this bolt is that important, it has bolts in each diagnal of it.. so its not on a corner or anything..<br /><br />still, I didn't come this far to not do everything properly. I'll let you guys now how I make out tomorrow.<br /><br />rgds<br /><br />Frank
 
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FNG

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Re: SNAPPED a head bolt :-(

Just be patient! Don't rush anything. If your not missing out on the winter boating scene than allow the penetrating oil to soak in for a few days. Keep spraying it a couple times a day. Adding heat and resoaking will help get it in too. Each time you try to back it off, if it doesn't want to come...don't force it. Take your time. As mentioned above, the shock treatment by hitting the bolt while soaking will also help.<br />Something else not really mentioned, don't just heat it up and let it cool, heat it up and pour cold water on it. That will also shock the two metals in hopes to free it up.
 
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Grizzly

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Re: SNAPPED a head bolt :-(

Just went thru the same thing on an exhaust manifold bolt. First thing I did was drill it off center. Next thing was to snap the ease out. Finally I realised what GDane meant in a recent thread. FNG just said it again-PATIENCE. I used a Dremmel tool with two diamond tipped bits that cme in a single pack at Walmart. One about the size of a pin head, the second about the size of a BB. The tiny bit squealed and chattered so I used a very soft touch and PATIENCE to keep the tool centered. I followed the same path with the larger bit. Then I started using the drill 10 minutes of slow drilling followed by 2 minutes filing the bit. When I got the hole large enough for the new ease out, it still wouldn't come out. I then started with the Dremmel tool again, this time using a cabide cutter- looks like a tiny milling machine tool. I continued enlarging the hole. alternately tapping the edges with a hammer and punch. Finally the bolt collapsed and I pulled it out using a pair of hemostats. Kind of reminded me of an old snake skin. About 4 hr. not counting head scratching and shopping. The threads were in remarkably good shape, but just for insurance, I put some JB Weld in the hole and screwed a bolt in til the stuff was firmly set- about an hour, then removed the bolt and let it set up over night. Probably not the best idea but it worked- Thanks GDane! If I can do it......... -G. ;)
 
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Grizzly

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Re: SNAPPED a head bolt :-(

PS Schematic,I typed all that by myself. Aint goan tell ya how long it took. :D Life is good! -G.
 
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petryshyn

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Re: SNAPPED a head bolt :-(

Hey Griz...<br /><br />Don't have to tell me how long it took to type......cause I know it would take me atleast 30 minutes!<br /> ;)
 
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Franki

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Re: SNAPPED a head bolt :-(

Well, I drilled right through it, and soaked the puppy in oil, been out and done it three times, I will give the ezeout a shot first.. gently..<br /><br />I was toying with firing up the engine for a couple of minutes,, get the whole block warm.<br /><br />then taping it while its getting cool.. see if that can't loosen it off abit..<br /><br />I guess its just a matter of trying stuff till it works..<br /><br />I get the feeling that the shank of the bolt was just rusted behind the head.. the rest is probably not that bad.. it might come easy..<br /><br />heres hoping anyway.
 
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Franki

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Re: SNAPPED a head bolt :-(

bit of an update...<br /><br />after 2 days soaking in penetrine oil, I stuck in the easy out.. no luck, stuck tight.<br /><br />I drilled the hole to the next size up. soaked it some more, heated and cooled it twice, tapped it with a hammer to see if I couldn't loosen it.. soaked it some more... no luck.<br /><br />tried drilling it some more, drill snapped inside the bolt, after half an hour of fiddling I got it out.<br /><br />soaked it some more, heated and cooled it again. tried again.. no luck.<br /><br />tomorrow I am going to try to drill the whole thing out slowly and see if I can get whats left to collapse.<br /><br />any suggestions?<br /><br /><br />rgds<br /><br />Frank
 
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Grizzly

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Re: SNAPPED a head bolt :-(

When the edges of the bolt begin to turn loose, use a small flat screw driver to help seperate and crush it inward. If you have acsess to a dremmel, tool the carbide cutter works real good, as it cuts lateral, allowing you to cut away the thicker parts of the bolt. If you could just get the bit, tou might be able to chuck it up in the drill and use it that way. Keep the bolt as thin in the back as it is in the front and use a pair of tweezers or smallneedle nose pliers to finally twist it out. A pair of hemostats works. It's gonna take a while but you'll get it. The only way you can fail is to quit before you finish. Take your time and improvise. Let us know when you get it out. Have a great day (night)?-G,<br />I almost forgot- I used the ease out every now and then to burr up the insde of the bolt to mske the cutting go a little faster.
 
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mrm

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Re: SNAPPED a head bolt :-(

Forget about it. put silcone on the gasket.
 
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Franki

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Re: SNAPPED a head bolt :-(

ummm, how would a left hand drill bit help?<br />is that so the turning force can pull the remains of the bolt out? I was thinking about that today but didn't know anyone made them.<br /><br />I was thinking that once I got it close, by drilling extremely slowly with a bit thats roughly 1/2 to 1mm less then the bolt shank I would again try an easy out to gently get it out, if that didn't work, I'd get a 1/8th bit drill and use side presure in one point to eat its way closeer to the side, once that point gets weak, I should be able to use a centerpunch or someing similiar to collapse the bolt at that point, I don't imagine that once you have a small area collapsed that the rest would be that hard..<br /><br />I have a dremal, so I'll give that a shot..<br /><br />rgds<br /><br />Frank
 
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