1969 Merc 650 Wont Turn

[mcbroomsear]

Hello All,

Boy am I glad I found this place!

Here's the question.

I'm looking at an old project boat. The guy's asking 400 for boat motor and trailer. (ALL THREE WILL NEED A BUNCH OF WORK)

It has the afore mentioned outboard on it and I know nothing about it. I don't want to spend $40+ for a manual if I decide not to buy the boat.

The immediate issue is that the prop won't turn. My friend told me that if the control is in neutral it should spin or at least be loose. Is that right on this engine? Perhaps the control is broken and the engine is still in gear. Any way to tell without a teardown?

Furthermore, I don't know how to use the pull cord to see if the motor will turn.

On the outside and at a glance, nothing appears really wrong with it but nothing's turning. It's been sitting for about 6 years but the fellow swears there's nothing wrong with it. ( I suppose I'd say that too if I was trying to sell my old boat)

I'd like to know what the experts think about some basic thing's I should look for before laying down the cash. Any tips as to how to tell if this motor is too far gone?

If it's locked up and un fixable I'd hate to give him the full 400. The transom, floor, seats and carpets will have to be replaced in the boat and the trailer needs an overhaul and new wheels and tires so a penny saved is a penny spent elsewhere. Know what I mean???

Any help is much appreciated.

 

[TommyA]

Re: 1969 Merc 650 Wont Turn

If he says that there is nothing wrong with the engine then let him show you. Puts some muffs on and start her up. Unless you are just looking for a big project that you have the time and money to take on I would walk away from this deal. Floors and transoms can get expensive and time consuming and needing another engine would be just one more cost to add to that. My guess is there is something wrong with the engine and he doesn't want to come clean with you.

 

[noahnsteph]

Re: 1969 Merc 650 Wont Turn

On my 1973 Merc 650 you need to take off the upper cowling to use the rope pull to try and turn over the motor. The rope should be in a plastic sleeve attached to motor somewhere under the cowling.

 

[mcbroomsear]

Re: 1969 Merc 650 Wont Turn

Thanks for the replies.

I've found the pull cord but I'm unsure as to whether it will turn and if I've even set it up correctly.

It may need to have the plugs pulled and cylinder's lubed so that I can turn it.

Anyone know how to tell if the motor is in gear. The prop won't spin and the control box is in neutral but the cables are in awful shape (easy enough fix if need be.)

 

[gregpro50]

Re: 1969 Merc 650 Wont Turn

Wow, this almost sounds like one of those deals where you get screwed over even if it was given to you for free.

Does the prop spin either way at all or does it seem frozen? You should be able to get some movement even if it is in gear.

 

[mcbroomsear]

Re: 1969 Merc 650 Wont Turn

Nope, It's pretty well stuck. Not enough to even budge.

This whole boats been sitting in the guys back yard for about 4 years. He bought it off a guy when just the seats and carpet were bad. According to this fellow, it was sitting in that guys yard for 3 years prior. He tells me this thing was in running shape but the fellow he got it from bought a new boat. SO, that's 7 years of sitting.

I'd say it's possible that the thing is just frozen because it's been sitting so long. Perhaps some lubrication is needed to get it moving but again, I have no idea of a field expedient way to get this figured out without having to tear it down.

I called him and asked him to spray some PB blaster in the cylinders and I'll give it a turn on saturday.

With a model this old, it's possible that just the cowling and other body parts might be worth it. Perhaps I could part it out and use that cash to put towards a "new to me" motor thats a little less neglected.

I'd still love to rework this one as long as theirs no catastrophic failures. But the costs involved in the parts to get it up and running is the big issue. If it needs a whole new lower unit then he'll be lucky to get me to take money for it!

 

[James R]

Re: 1969 Merc 650 Wont Turn

Hi.
If the prop will not move at all then the lower unit is siezed. It is no big deal to get a replacement lower unit off Ebay. if the motor is worth salvaging you will need to remove the lower unit , pull the plugs and check the compressions. If my memory serves, this is an electric start motor so once the lower unit is removed you should have no problem with connecting a battery and turning the motor over for the test using the ignition key. Or jump the starter motor directly. If it is a motor that has been used in salt water dont bother.

 

[ThumbPkr]

Re: 1969 Merc 650 Wont Turn

With the top cover off and the flywheel exposed you should be able to rock the flywheel back and forth enough to determine where it might be frozen.If the crank does not budge then it is internal to the engine block but if it rocks a little it might be the drive train binding.
Based on the info you have given so far I would keep looking at any price unless other factors are attracting you to the package.Ron G

 

[mcbroomsear]

Re: 1969 Merc 650 Wont Turn

Just bugging the fellow about the engine has gotten him to take a full 100 off the price. So that's 300 for the package as it stands right now.

Going over there tomorrow morning to look at the engine to see if the flywheel is rocking. Told the guy we might need to take the lower unit off.

The biggest thing with an engine this old is the electrical parts. A starter is amost 200 bucks and a wiring harness is about the same. Just re sealing the lower unit, rebuilding the carbs, fuel pump, and water pump will run me about 250 for parts. Not looking to spend 650 to get the motor up and 300 for the boat. I could get a used outboard for around 650 that's newer with cheaper parts...

Still keeping my eyes open for other deals out there but this fellow is rather desperate to unload it. I can haggle him down some more once I know the condition of the motor. Shoot, he might even end up giving it to me just to be rid of it. (The city will charge him 80 bucks to take it to the landfill LOL)

 

[mcbroomsear]

Re: 1969 Merc 650 Wont Turn

OK, Where's the best place to get an OEM manual for a 1969? I got me a new project!!!

New issue: The skeg has a huge crack in it. Looks like someone took this thing through a rock bed at low tide.

Looks like I'll either be refitting it with a new lower unit or getting a new skeg and re-building the existing one. Maybe a newer motor is due!!! Anyone know what years lower units will fit on a '69 model??? I see 67's on E-Bay all the time!

Long story short: The fellow gave it to me for free. Apparantly, I was the only one who showed more than a fleeting interest in it. He needed it out of his yard as the County was apparantly going to fine him as it was a mosqito breeding ground for most of last summer. I've taken it over to my sisters house to use the garage to start the project.

I'm gonna get that manual and start going at the motor.

Thanks for everyone's help!

 

[Yachtzee]

Re: 1969 Merc 650 Wont Turn

I have 3 merc 650 motors. One running two in parts.
Out of the three I got one lower unit if that tells you anything.
I'd bet the lower unit leaked, got water in it and corroded to scrap and maybe even cracked the case.
Other common issues are corrosion inside the cooling passages on the block.
Water leaking into the combustion chamber.
Corrosion all the way through the exhaust baffle and water jacket cover.
Bad crank bearings and a leaks where the cases are joined.
I have bought three of these motors that start right up.
But were in horrible condition internally.
I have looked on ebay since last year and never saw another 650 4 cyl lower unit