1976 Evinrude 115 seems to be flooding

nb_hall

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76 115 horse e-rude, ran fine all day saturday, never had any problems starting up. took it out on sunday and ran out of gas on the first tank, switched tanks ran it out and then filled up with fresh gas and added oil as usual. Now it acts as if it is flooding. took plugs out, cleaned them up, reinstalled and it fired up for 2 seconds then died. waited about 30 mins, and then it fired right up. killed it and started it half a dozen times and it performed as always. then tried it once more before leaving for the lake and it was back to not starting. turns over, even added a bit oof throttle on the warm up, treied choke/ no choke. did notice there was some oily black gunk in the prop and a tiny stream of water draining from the prop while it was on the muffs. all fuel filters were clean. think i'm going to start with the plugs, the carbs should be good, it was winterised with seafoam, and we started it and fished regularly in winter plus it ran like a champ the day before. any suggestions?
 

crb478

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Re: 1976 Evinrude 115 seems to be flooding

Just off the cuff I would suspect a sticking float, but that would just be a guess. I would start with a basic compression and spark test. Once those are verified to be good I would then look at the fuel system. Since you ran the tank dry you may have picked up some trash which is causing some type of obstruction. It is hard to diagnoise it further until you verify the base line results.
 

nb_hall

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Re: 1976 Evinrude 115 seems to be flooding

Spark and compression is great. replaced all fuel line from the fuel pump and filter to the carbs it was in pretty bad shape and not alcohol resistant. Opened the carbs and all appeared clean. gonna try some new plugs as the ones i have aren't in the best shape and if that isn't it, i guess i'm rebuilding carbs next week. anyone know if the kits come with instructions?
 

nb_hall

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Re: 1976 Evinrude 115 seems to be flooding

If i find any trash i won't be surprised, but I don't the trash would come from the fuel tank, there are three filters from the tank to the carbs, and i'm not talking about no cheap o from wal mart, i put a fuel water separator and an in line filter on
 

crb478

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Re: 1976 Evinrude 115 seems to be flooding

The kits generally don't have instructions, and they are made for more than one carb so you may have some extra parts/gaskets included in them. There are a few links that show how to rebuild carbs, check the top secret files here I think they have a good set of instructions. If you are cleaning them you should totally dissassemble them including the jets ,get a gallon can of carb cleaner and allow them to soak. Blow them out good and reassemble setting the float and replaacing the needle and seat. Simply spraying carb cleaner through them is not enough.
 

ezeke

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Re: 1976 Evinrude 115 seems to be flooding

Soaking is not enough either. You need to use compressed air or the aerosol to blow out all of the tiny capillaries, especially those between the idle jets (orifices) and the carburetor throats. At the back of the throats, behind the throttle plates, you will find four tiny openings in the floor of each barrel - those are the idle openings and must be clear. The 4 idle orifices are located behind the 4 screws on the sides of the carburetor bodies.

Don't use cloth as you work because the threads will clog the orifices.

For now, you may have picked up some water, which will settle in the bottom of your float bowls where it is particularly difficult to get rid of. You might try taking the plugs out of the float bowls one-by-one and flushing each side by squeezing the primer bulb, sometimes this will also dislodge objects blocking the high speed jets.
 

nb_hall

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Re: 1976 Evinrude 115 seems to be flooding

took the bowls off the carbs but haven't gone any further, waiting on the kits to arrive this week. everything looked clean but of course will look further when kits arrive. I did fire it up again this weekend after changing the plugs, it fired up and ran for a good ten minutes at idle and a little bit at fast idle with the warm up lever slowed it bak down and it eventually died and went back to acting like it was starving for fuel. so at least its not the spark or compression, and hopefully just a overdue carb job. I'm going to take CRB478 comment abpout trash and look into the fuel tanks and make sure they don't have any trash in them. just because i have filters doesn't mean theres no trash present. Any thoughts on which is better when replacing tanks? Plastics or 6 gallon metal tanks.
 

nb_hall

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Re: 1976 Evinrude 115 seems to be flooding

Rebuilt the carbs, and it fired right up and ran for a good twenty minutes, killed it and it restarted instantly and i waited a while an tried it and it started right up, then i spent about 5 or six hours working on other projects and came back and went to start it and its back to the same old not wanting to start or run. So i thought it over, and have determined the following. Its not the compression, the carbs, the fuel filter or lines, no trash found anywhere in the fuel system, not fouled spark plugs. Which leaves the electrical part of it. I took out one plug at a time and tried them for spark, and got nothing, no spark anywhere. Checked over the wires and everything was good nothing loose found the little fuse was good, no cracks on the power packs, (infact they look brand new), i them removed all the plugs and cleared the cylinders, replaced them and same old nothing, took a break to think it over and cam back and it fired right up, and ran for a bit and then died with no explaination. checked the plugs for spark again and got nothing.
Where to go from here?
 

nb_hall

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Re: 1976 Evinrude 115 seems to be flooding

gonna check the ignition switch this evening, saw on another post to remove the black/yellow wire form the coils and check for spark
 

ezeke

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Re: 1976 Evinrude 115 seems to be flooding

gonna check the ignition switch this evening, saw on another post to remove the black/yellow wire form the coils and check for spark

The black with yellow stripe wire is connected to the powerpack on a CD ignition. It works by grounding the powerpack so that it cannot fire.
 

nb_hall

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Re: 1976 Evinrude 115 seems to be flooding

Checked the ignition switch, and no change there. It did start up and run for a good 20- 30 minutes tuesday night, ran fresh gas and a bit of seafoam through it since it was running alittle rough at low speed. i killed it and cranked it back about five times or so with no problem. got a few minutes yesterday and stopped by to run it some more and its back to not wanting to crank. It was popping yesterday a bit more while running and seemed to be running rough again. now i have this Grey sludge in the prop exhaust. It's like a grey oily pudding consistancy, which i can only assume is unburned oil due to improper combustion. there is a tiny bit of water coming from the prop exhaust as well, is that normal, its not like its a stream of water or anything like that. i have heard that seafoam can clean a little to much sometimes, but could that be part of the issue? i have always run seafoam or STP in the gas so i don't see why that would just now cause a problem after running it a yr. I'm just running out of ideas myself, it's never got hot, that i know of, the water pump is working fine, no alarms have gone off. So i wouldn't think i have cracked anything. I just don't understand how it can run one minute and then have no spark on any of the plugs the next, i disconnect the coils ground from the ignition and get no change, and then al of the sudden its like nothings wrong. I found no loose connections, no frayed wires anywhere. now the only place i haven't checked is under the fly wheel. Can i spray some electrical connection cleaner under there and see if that helps. could it be the stator?
 

ezeke

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Re: 1976 Evinrude 115 seems to be flooding

Most of the water used during normal operation of the motor should leave through the exhaust at the propeller.

The excess oil which is not burned will pass out with the exhaust and will continue to drain from the engine when the motor is not running.

Cold starts require enriched fuel/air mix which is accomplished on your motor with the chokes. The chokes have to be 100% fully absolutely closed and stay closed for a cold start. Anytime you clean the carburetors, you have to reset the choke linkage after replacing the carburetors. So, take the cover off and watch while someone cranks the engine and holds the choke switch so that you can be sure that the chokes are closed. After they are synchronized, move the choke solenoid in small increments until it closes the plates properly.

You still need 300 RPM for your ignition to function well, so be sure that your battery is fully charged and that the cables are in good condition.

As the pistons rise and fall, they create a rhythmic vacuum behind the reeds, which open and close, thus pulling fuel and air mix through the carburetors. Crossflow carburetors deliver a precise mixture of air and gasoline using fixed orifices, sometimes referred to as jets.

When the carburetor throttle plates are closed at idle, the vacuum places greater suction on the carburetor throat behind the throttle plates, pulling fuel through the idle orifices and into the throats of the carburetors through tiny openings in the floor of the throats.

Whenever the carburetors are moved, as when cleaning, or for whatever reason, it is required that they be replaced airtight to prevent upsetting the delicate mixture of air and gasoline, so new gaskets should always be used. Additionally, the carburetors must be synchronized so that they open and close at precisely the same precise time. The throttle plates should be fully closed at idle and perfectly horizontal at WOT (Wide Open Throttle). The importance of these steps can never be overstated because it is impossible for the engine to run smoothly without them, especially at idle speed.

The synchronization of the carburetors requires two steps: first the individual carburetors have to be synchronized with each other; then the carburetor linkage has to be adjusted so that the roller of the cam follower aligns precisely with the embossed mark on the throttle cam while almost touching the cam. Any attempts to adjust these settings other than directly on the carburetors? linkage will usually only make things worse. The throttle cable should be disconnected while making these adjustments.

Once the carburetors are perfectly synchronized and the roller set to the embossed mark on the cam, the throttle cable should be adjusted so that it slips on without causing any movement of the linkage at the engine. To allow for tension, move the throttle arm on the remote control fully forward and back to neutral before adjusting the cable.
 

ezeke

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Re: 1976 Evinrude 115 seems to be flooding

What was the compression, cylinder by cylinder please?

What is the CCA of your battery?

You mention power packs, but you only have one. Were you referring to the ignition coils?

Cranking usually refers to turning the engine with the starter, from the days when motors were started with a hand crank. When you say "not wanting to crank" are you saying that the starter motor is not working properly?

The usual reason for intermittent failure to fire on that system is that the engine is not turning fast enough for the system to fire (300 RPM). You test for spark with all of the spark plugs removed for that reason so that the engine can turn fast enough to test the ignition system.

Sometimes the ignition coils will cut in and out but its usually when they are heated that they break down in that way.
 

emdsapmgr

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Re: 1976 Evinrude 115 seems to be flooding

Weak ignition components tend to fail once the engine warms up to normal operating temps. Unlikely the 4 spark plug coils all went bad at once, but those can be swapped with each other to trace misfires. That leaves three significant (expensive) ignition components: the timer base, the power pack and the stator. There are tests for these components in the ignition section of the factory service manual.
 

nb_hall

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Re: 1976 Evinrude 115 seems to be flooding

I see i need to brush up on the nomenclature of the components. there is no problem with the starter, and while cranking we have the battery charger assisting to ensure we have enough power to get at least the the three hundred rpms. The battery is fairly new and holds a charge as it should. I did mean the ignition coils when i said power packs. Gonna recheck the compression and see what i get.
 

nb_hall

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Re: 1976 Evinrude 115 seems to be flooding

Compression on all four cylinders was good, between 100 and 110, i'm thinking all thats left is the power pack.
 

ezeke

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Re: 1976 Evinrude 115 seems to be flooding

Before you purchase and replace the powerpack, be sure that you perform the troubleshooting steps in the installation guide so that you don't replace the wrong component. http://cdielectronics.com/InstallSheet/113-1731.pdf

CDI 113-1731 is one of two possible replacement powerpacks that CDI makes for your engine, depending on the amperage. Both are available from iboats.
 

nb_hall

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Re: 1976 Evinrude 115 seems to be flooding

my tool box, and skills aren't equipped for all the troubleshooting, looks like it will be heading to the locale repair shop, there goes another $400
 
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