1982 150hp blackmax powerhead swap issues

[rjcamel2355]

Link and sync and adjusting/checking the timing is on my list of to do's after work this afternoon. I'm hoping that's my issue, and after the reading and help from the folks here on this forum I am to believe that is the right direction to go.

 

[rjcamel2355]

Alright so a little update. I came home today put the old stator back on lined it all up just how it was when I took it off. I disconnected the throttle cable and pulled it a tad off the stop. Pulled all the plugs and checked comprssion just to make sure I haven't messed anything up. Everything is still 120. Still got spark. Hit the key just to see the results. It started for a second popped/sputtered and died.

Parts house didn't have a timing light. I'll have one tomorrow for sure. Then its link and sync /timing check time.

 

[rjcamel2355]

Alright. So I got a timing light on it today. Brought #1 up to tdc followed the instructions used the dial indicator. Hooked light up to #1 And had my wife crank the motor. Never even seen the 0 mark. Moved the linkage around and it never got close. Timing light was adjustable from 0-100* adjusted it and still never saw the timing marks on the flywheel.

Checked the triggers via ohm meter and they seemed fine. Is it possible I have a sheared flywheel key?

Attached some photos of the mark on #1, and the mark I made where it is firing at currently.

This is with #1 up and 0* lined up with the timing pointer. I'm positive that part is right. How in the world can it be that far Out?

https://imgur.com/a/rO08o

 

[Dukedog]

doesn't look like ya got tha .462 part?.. thats where tha pointer should be adjusted to.

1. Remove all spark plugs and install Dial Indicator (91-58222A1) into No. 1 cylinder (top cylinder, starboard bank).
2. Turn flywheel in a clockwise direction until No. 1 piston is at top dead center (TDC). Set dial indicator at ?O? (zero) and tighten indicator set screw.
3. Turn flywheel counterclockwise until dial indicator needle is approximately 1/4-turn beyond .462 in., then turn flywheel clockwise so that dial indicator reads .462 in. (11.7mm) exactly.
4. Reposition timing pointer (a) so that timing pointer is aligned with .462 in. mark on timing decal. Retighten pointer attaching screws (b).
5. Remove dial indicator from cylinder.

 

[rjcamel2355]

I'm an idiot..... I just looked at my switch boxes. My yellow coded wire looms aren't going to the same box...... aka #2 is firing instead of #1. That's why it's so far off...... wow..... You can't make one run backwards......

I did however do the dial indicator part...... I just fish list it. At least that part and tdc is correct.

Friend stopped by and I was showing him what I had going and I noticed the backwards wires.....even though just earlier I was ohm tasting the wires. Sheesh. ...

 

[rjcamel2355]

So I set the timing today. About 4-5* idle timing and 20* for my max timing. No stabilizer on this motor. Fired it up and it idles on the hose about 800rpms. But it doesn't sound right to me. Almost like it has a miss to it. All plugs firing good. Double checked. Then triple checked the timing. Doing the whole link and sync procedure again. Just to make sure I got it right. It all appears to be correct. Just the motor doesn't sound like it should at all, I. Bumped the hotfoot and it revved up like it should have. It sounded fine revving up didn't do it for long.

I can record a video and post it if that will help tomorrow, it didn't try to die at all, perhaps its in my imagination?

I do believe that the blown powerhead was possibly a 200hp that someone stuck a 150 cowl and stickers on... could this be causing me any problems? Even though the new powerhead is a mid 90s model is it possible it's not really a 150 also?

I did have to adjust the idle stop screw quite a bit to get it to almost touch the carb roller, but I set the timing after I set the idle stop screw.

No pops or bangs or anything of that sort when starting it or while it was running. Just hope nothing got damaged when it backfired

 

[Dukedog]

I do believe that the blown powerhead was possibly a 200hp that someone stuck a 150 cowl and stickers on... could this be causing me any problems? Even though the new powerhead is a mid 90s model is it possible it's not really a 150 also?

with vertical front half at tha very most is a 2.4 175.... can you see a WH XX number stamped on tha carb flange of top carb?.. if not only way ta know for sure is to pull a head.... that design block was last produced in '90.. if it has a build date later than that its a "replacement block" so all parts will be for PRE '91 135/150/175, which ever it proves ta be.......

in tha water, in gear will tell ya where ya at with all your "adjustments/settings"... motor changes drastically compared ta hose!

 

[rjcamel2355]

I'll get the WH numbers off the old and the new powerhead today to see what I am trying to piece together.... I know for certain the old powerhead had horiztonal reeds... I never looked at the build date on that block, but I will do that today also. I THINK that the new powerhead has vertical reeds, I put a borescope through the carbs down into the intake to look at them the other day, and if I recall correctly, they sit straight up and down, and the old powerhead they sat horizontal like this
--
--
--
--.

I suppose I need to just set it in the water and see if/how it runs.... I went step by step with the timing adjustments, and they're definitely set at 20* max and roughly 4-5* idle timin'.... There's spark on all 6 that looks good and healthy, and there's no knocking banging or anything of that sorts. It (to me) just doesn't have that crisp clean/clear idle that I'm used to hearing from these motors.

 

[Dukedog]

if tha "old" '82" ph had horizontal front it was a 200... tha newer model in your pics is vertical (135, 150, 175)... last year for a vertical front was also '90 (some 135's)....

also set your "idle timing/rpm" in tha water, in gear.. don't even think about tha number... jus what ever it ends up at that makes both you and tha motor happy.....

 

[rjcamel2355]

I'll get you the carb numbers this afternoon duke, will it hurt anything that I swapped the carbs off the 200 onto the "150"(new powerhead that is on there now)?

I will try to get it in the water this week, if not this weekend for sure and see if it runs how it should, something has to give sooner or later, right?

 

[Dukedog]

won't hurt but gonna be all wrong as for performance/jetting'/venturi openin'.. will be on tha "fat" side, probably make tha little motor lazy... take notice that tha linkages, on tha carbs, cam an throttle arm are different between tha horizontal front and vertical front stuff.....

 

[rjcamel2355]

Best just to put the carbs that came on the powerhead back on it then, right? The only reason I swapped them was because of the issues I was originally having, when I swapped the carbs NOTHING whatsoever changed, so it wasn't a carb issue. Better to just bolt those back to it, and proceed from there? I could tell that the linkages were different, that's partly why I had to adjust on the idle stop screw so much. Also, the fittings where the fuel lines went were different, as was the location of the fuel pump. I noticed a few differences like those mentioned. The carbs that I pulled off were clean inside, and I really didn't THINK they were the issue, but I knew the ones on the old powerhead had no issues prior to the cylinder failures.

 

[jimmbo]

but I knew the ones on the old powerhead had no issues prior to the cylinder failures.

Often the carb or carbs is often why there is a cylinder failure

 

[rjcamel2355]

Often the carb or carbs is often why there is a cylinder failure

True, this was water pump related though (Or at least appeared to be), overheat alarm, pulled the lower unit and discovered the water pump was missing all but 2 fins, and was melted in the cup. Caused by the previous owner.

 

[rjcamel2355]

Wh39 off the old 200hp powerhead. Wh21 off the new powerhead

 

[Dukedog]

39's are right for that early 200 but can't find year and hp for tha 21's in my junk.. got tha jettin' for 'em but that's all i got!..........

 

[rjcamel2355]

I put them back on. So as it sits now is the way it was when I got it. Aside from the link and sync timing and carb cleaning. Start it on the hose[in a barrel +water hose] and it idles, but sounds a little off to me revs up fine sounds good revving up. (Just a quick bump of the hotfoot). Lots of blue smoke, pulled the plugs after it idled for a few minutes just to check them and they're all wet with fuel. Not a whole lot, but you can definitely see it. Would it be a good idea to swap the stator, triggers and switch boxes from the blown powerhead to the new one? I know it ran fine prior to the overheat. Or should I just put the boat in the Lake and try to run it and see?

 

[Dukedog]

with either a good set of insulated side cutters/fuse pullers or in my case i used my little bride (once anyway), pull one wire at a time while its idlin'..... also start it in tha dark and run a screw driver ta block ground along tha wires.. particularly around tha boots on both ends.... do this before ya start changin' stuff...........

 

[rjcamel2355]

with either a good set of insulated side cutters/fuse pullers or in my case i used my little bride (once anyway), pull one wire at a time while its idlin'..... also start it in tha dark and run a screw driver ta block ground along tha wires.. particularly around tha boots on both ends.... do this before ya start changin' stuff...........

Will do! That's a good idea thank you duke.

 

[rjcamel2355]

Here is the video I took yesterday. This was before your suggestion to check the plug wires and such. As you can tell lots of blue smoke. Fuel was pre mixed 50:1

https://youtu.be/usMuYyH_MaA