1988 Stingray SVB 192 Restoration

xanthras

Petty Officer 3rd Class
Joined
Jun 29, 2009
Messages
76
Re: 1988 Stingray SVB 192 Restoration

Not sure on your question, but wanted to say I am glad to see you are working it. I cant wait to see it finished.
 

Gator1996

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Jul 29, 2011
Messages
228
Re: 1988 Stingray SVB 192 Restoration

Hey thanks for looking in on me SD and Xanthras. Nice to see a little traffic. I am working hard at it will keep the thread updated.
Enjoy the weekend!

Later, Gator
 

SDSeville

Lieutenant
Joined
Mar 19, 2010
Messages
1,481
Re: 1988 Stingray SVB 192 Restoration

Looking great Gator! Nice to see you back and making great progress. I too know what it is like to get vapor lock from information overload. keep up the great work. You will be happy with your project for many years to come.
 

Gator1996

Petty Officer 1st Class
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Jul 29, 2011
Messages
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Re: 1988 Stingray SVB 192 Restoration

There have been a couple of the regular guys that have been going through the decision process if gel vs. paint. If you are the one guy that has been keeping up with my thread, then you know that I decided to gel. I thought that I might have some insight for posterity on mistakes I made/am making and why I decided to gel.

First off, Yacht Doctor was the main influence on deciding to use gel. He always seems to be straightforward on the difficulty of a job and the quality of the return on the investment of time and money. The main point was that gel is pretty forgiving, I did not have access to paint booth so this was pretty big. I had no experience using a paint gun so I think it would have been even better if I did. I agree that if you have the right tools and keep the basics in mind gel is a breeze and it’s hard as a rock, trust me I'm sanding it like crazy.

Here are a couple of pics. I have not gotten to the final product but I have compounded and polished a couple of feet sections to give me something to look forward to. Still have a long way to go.

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Continued in next post
 

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Gator1996

Petty Officer 1st Class
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Jul 29, 2011
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228
Re: 1988 Stingray SVB 192 Restoration

Here's some pictures of sections that I have kind of experimented with to see how it is going to buff out. Scratches are a real pain to get out I think I am going to have to set the bar and call it good. You can also see where I sanded through the orange. Not cool. I am going to have touch up some sections.

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There are a few things I have learned along the way that I probably knew but was too hard headed to believe and some that I had not read or heard anywhere. I have outlined some of them.
1. I had 0 experience with a spray gun but have painted plenty. The tip here is to forget what you know about painting. I thought I was laying down nice even coats and maybe I was but they were nowhere near thick enough. If you don't get any orange peel, drips, runs or thick spots, you probably are not laying the gel thick enough. My first coats of gel were very rough and felt like real aggressive non-skid that was very easy to sand through. I sanded back to 120 and started again, laying it on super thick. Much smoother and easier to sand and I don't go through when cutting the peel by wet sanding.

2. I bought my gun at Northern Tool, it was the $40 one with the 2.3 mm tip. This gun got me through 90% of the boat, it finally died of kicked gel. HF does not have a gun with that large of a tip so I kept the internals from the Northern gun and put them in the $9.99 HF gun. All parts are not interchangeable so if you do this, keep all internals of the Northern gun. Used a Craftsman 33 Gallon 6HP compressor I think CFM is 7.5 if I recall.

3. If I could go back, I would not have done the orange, the time it took to mask and tape that section was ridiculous, and I will have done that 3 times before its over. A pinstripe would have sufficed. Its hard to sand and as you can see that it is easy to sand through.

4. I got impatient at the beginning and was hitting the heavy peel with 220 grit. The scratches left behind are tough to impossible to get out. Don't go coarser than 320 grit.

5. I have sanded wet exclusively. When I tried dry, it seemed like the scratches were a lot deeper, may be personal preference.

6. When I laid the gel on thick, it was roughly 35-40 minutes max for it to cure tack free. I sprayed wet on wet so I was doubling back after 15 or 20 minutes.

7. As far as time goes, if I was doing one color, 3 hours of spray time would have been easy to accomplish. My time killer was doing it again and taping the other colors. If you hit one side hard, then that one can cure while you hit the other or the bottom, etc. The spraying part is the easiest because you know you're gonna hit the high spots with paper.

8. I had a helper which I could not have made it without. My first two attempts were only 250 ML and some kicked in the cup, it was about 90 degrees or so. I wound up only doing 150 ML at a time. My helper had the additives mixed in and as soon as a cup ran out, she catalyzed the next batch. We got to the point that we could do 6 150ML batches and then take the whole gun apart and clean it. My helper also cleaned the mixing cups, cleaning brushes etc. We really had an assembly line thing going.

9. Everywhere I read said that you should try not to thin the gel. The first two batches were not thinned, I didn't think it was a problem to get the gel out of the gun but as I said some kicked in the cup so I am not sure if that was one of the reasons it did. While I have seen several suggestions on what to use as a thinner, I used styrene. My mix was 150 Ml gel. 10 Ml Styrene, 15 Ml pigment and when needed 5 ML surfacing agent. This turned out to be a perfect recipe for my purposes, as I said I could do 6 batches and then clean.

I can't think of anything else, If I can answer any questions, let me know I am going to do a post with approximate costs of gel and materials.
 

Gator1996

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Jul 29, 2011
Messages
228
Re: 1988 Stingray SVB 192 Restoration

Ok Final chapter in my ongoing gelcoat saga. I am still sanding so I most likely will need more paper and I still have to shoot the gel on the cap so I will need another gallon of white gel. Besides that, I think I have everything else I will need to finish. So this is a pretty exhaustive material list.

Guns- Northern Tool Model #19023 $40
Harbor Freight Item #47016 $15 I got it on sale for $9.99

Gun Maintenence- Cleaning kits (3) HF Item #99634 $5 each
In line moisture filter (2) Item #68224 $2 each
Disposable HVLP cups (2) Sorry cant find the Item# they were $6 each I think

Supplies- Mixing cups, probably a total of 10 of the quart size ones $15
A ton of rags and paper towels $10
Latex gloves 100 ct box at HF-$8
Mixing sticks- Home depot

Chemicals- Acetone 4 gallons-$17 each
Surfacing agent- 2 quarts-$7 each
Styrene for thinning 2 quarts-$7 each
Pigment 4 blue 6 oz. -$8 each
3 Orange 6 oz.-$8 each Still have a good bit of each left.

Gelcoat- Two gallons of white- will need another for cap so make it three-$47 each
Four gallons of neutral will use all of it after touch ups for sure-$57 each Probably could have found it cheaper but this local shop is convenient and I try to keep the $ local if possible.

Sandpaper-God only knows. Between prepping and finishing I am sure that I have spent $200 in paper. It may be more.

So this may get an edit if I remember something else. I should add in about 10 cases of beer but anyway. The total without tax to gel was $835 without taxes.

For the finishing side
Polisher-HF Item #92623 $40
Lake Country 8.5 inch Wool Cutting pad-$13 got all LC pads at Autogeek shipping was $8
Lake Country 8.5 inch White polishing pad-$13
Lake Country 8.5 inch grey finishing pad-$13

Compounds-3M Super duty Rubbing compound- $27 O'Reilly Auto
Turtle Wax Rubbing compound-$7 O'Reilly Auto
3M Marine Finesse It II- $27 per PINT!!! at West marine. Price match to some boat supply store- $20 per pint.
Meguiar's Ultimate Flagship paste wax-$27 at West.

Total for finishing which I dont think Ill need anything else for-$168 before tax

Grand Total-$1,003
 

emoney

Commander
Joined
Jul 19, 2010
Messages
2,551
Re: 1988 Stingray SVB 192 Restoration

Good thread and the gelcoat looks like it's going to come out very nicely when you're done. I'm a fan of "wet-sanding" too, so you're not alone. Lighter grit always helps, just takes more time.

Fantastic idea putting the price list in for anyone that happens along that's "thinking" about repainting their boat. THis gives them a great idea as to why they've been quoted $2000 or more from a professional too.

Looking forward to seeing the final splash pics! (oh, and more people than you think are probably watching your thread, just a lot of them don't always chime in especially when they have nothing to add.....unlike me who will chime in anywhere)
 

Trooper82

Commander
Joined
Nov 21, 2011
Messages
2,648
Re: 1988 Stingray SVB 192 Restoration

Whew! Ok got through a thorough read of your thread Gator....like I said before....not sure how I missed ever seing it before....u had that transom area looking squeeky clean! Your glassing looks great too! Much better than mine....I was sloppy with tabs etc....yours are near perfect from what I can see in the pics...I like the idea of the cornerstone too...make sure you only put clear gel on it so it can be seen.

I'm sure I will have tons of questions for you when I get ready to gel. i appreciate as I'm sure others do the detail you put into that last post....helps alot.

One quick question I have for now...the mutpile colors...you sprayed one color, then just masked off and sprayed the next? Curious what happens when you sand that....do your lines stay straight?

Keep going you look to be very close!
 

Gator1996

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Jul 29, 2011
Messages
228
Re: 1988 Stingray SVB 192 Restoration

Thanks emoney. Glad you guys think the post was helpful. It was a ton of typing.
 

Gator1996

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Jul 29, 2011
Messages
228
Re: 1988 Stingray SVB 192 Restoration

Trooper. Trust me you are doing much better work than me.
The deal with the lines:
The majority of that stripe is raised, so when I masked/taped I lined the tape up with the base of that raised section. The areas at the bow are where that section was not raised anymore so they are freehand (you can tell btw) The first time I taped them I had the blue/orange section masked with paper after shooting the white so I cut out the orange areas and taped them. Not good. It took me about three hours and the orange still bled through. So I thought I could just touch up the blue so I taped the bad sections and touched them up with a foam brush...terrible results.. this is also the time that realized that my blue was not thick enough ( I really had no concept of what 30Mils was/is)

Anyway, I was not happy at all with how it looked so I re-taped and masked the orange and re-shot the blue. This time I used the frog tape, it worked much better than 3M. It took closer to 6 hours this time but I taped to correct all of the bleed throughs. The orange was the proper thickness so in some cases it required me to sand it smooth to put the tape on.

I am sure that those with experience on the gun know this already but the trick on the tape is to make sure it is down good and then shoot a light to medium coat on the tape border only. That little bit of gel cures in just a few minutes so by the time you lay that coat down, the tape is sealed and you can really lay it on thick then. This is how I got the really sweet lines the second time.

There were a few rough spots but the variance in the thickness of the orange and blue gel made it relatively easy to sand or trim it off with an old flat box cutter. The tape had been covered with three thick coats of gel, I let it sit for a week and when I pulled it was like it was plastic and the lines were close to perfect. Some people say to pull the tape before the gel is totally cured. This did not seem like the best way to me.

And yeah, the gel is so hard the lines stay true unless you really don't want them to. The section where the blue meets the white is a little touchy because it is on a corner so you have to be more careful there but it was like that when I was prepping too. As you can see, there are parts of the orange that I sanded through from sanding the actual orange and hitting when sanding the blue.

I'm gonna finishing sanding to 1500 on the last 1/4 of the boat, mask off the blue again and touch up the orange, sand up the orange, compound all the new gel, polish and wax then hit the cap in the back yard. Know that I know better, I hope I can shoot it, sand it and have it back on in three days.
 

CaptainKickback

Lieutenant Junior Grade
Joined
Jul 23, 2011
Messages
1,060
Re: 1988 Stingray SVB 192 Restoration

I'm in the 'same boat" as troop: I don't know how I missed your thread. But I saw the link you posted in his thread and decided to take a look.

Thanks for sharing your gel coating experiences. I plan on re-gel coating my entire boat. Although I haven't gotten to the point of spraying yet, I do have some trepidation about it. Your success helps with that. So far, my gel coating has been limited to rolling areas inside the boat.

Anyway, I look forward to seeing your progress. I (and many others) will be watching.

Sea ya...
 

Yacht Dr.

Vice Admiral
Joined
Feb 26, 2005
Messages
5,581
Re: 1988 Stingray SVB 192 Restoration

Hey Chris hows it going :) ..

About your orange stripe.

You can Try to do the touchups only .. but after the first try then bag it and do the whole thing.

If I had enough Matching gel left over from the first spray .. I would respray the whole thing right off the bat ( Its not really that big an area ).

The reason I suggest this is because you Might burn though around the blend edges of your touchup spots, if you only sprayed/sanded/buffed out the current burn throughs. Then your back to square one again .. but with more of an uneven pattern as you started with.

YD.
 

Gator1996

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Jul 29, 2011
Messages
228
Re: 1988 Stingray SVB 192 Restoration

Yep I agree YD. Always hoping for better news, that masking is a long ride down sucky road. I really value your opinion and appreciate you stopping by.

Thanks to all for your kind words and opinions. I will be out of town for a few days but when I make some progress, I'll post again.
Later, Gator
 
Joined
Aug 11, 2011
Messages
57
Re: 1988 Stingray SVB 192 Restoration

gator looks like we are in the same boat thanks for bringing me here ....like the res cant wait for the final results....btw i did the same thing went thru the hull but so far only one spot was not a happy camper......
 

Gator1996

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Jul 29, 2011
Messages
228
Re: 1988 Stingray SVB 192 Restoration

Well it has been quite a while...again. Same old story holidays weather you all know the drill. I have not forgotten the boat though. There are days that I wish I could go a day without thinking about it though. This project has been a life changer for sure. At the last update, I had the grand idea to spray new gel on the boat, I was going through the awesome cycle of spraying sanding and buffing etc. I had some pretty nasty run ins with sand throughs and was working to fix them. It's been a long road for me no doubt. I have some updated pics.
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There are still a ton of things to buff, some to fill and three much smaller areas I sanded through but it is a thousand times better. I still love the benefit of the gel but is has not been easy to say the least. The main lesson I learned with the gel is that I did not even come close to spraying even coats and that is pretty important when it comes to sanding it out. I feel like my prep of the surface before gel was good so the issue was really my spraying and sanding technique and abilities.
 

Gator1996

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Jul 29, 2011
Messages
228
Re: 1988 Stingray SVB 192 Restoration

As you can see in the last pictures, I had some kind of hillbilly wooden rail built on the port side of the boat and had the starboard side jacked up. The reason for this...

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Although I am obviously not done with the gel polishing I had to flip the thing. It was killing me to bend over, sand, compound and polish at that angle and I was almost happy with the bottom of the hull so off I went. I will say that the flip went well, a lot easier than the first time but every OSHA agent in the country shuddered when we did it. I am amazed again that no one got hurt. The wife said it would be fitting that I would die from being smashed by the boat. Yeah, I guess so.

Sorry for the poor quality pictures.
 

fat fanny

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Feb 9, 2006
Messages
1,935
Re: 1988 Stingray SVB 192 Restoration

Nice work on the gel and buffing! Good to see your still at it!
 

Gator1996

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Jul 29, 2011
Messages
228
Re: 1988 Stingray SVB 192 Restoration

Thanks fanny, or do you go by fat? HA!
I still have a long road to go but what a shot in the arm to see some noticeable progress.
Thanks for stopping in!
 

Trooper82

Commander
Joined
Nov 21, 2011
Messages
2,648
Re: 1988 Stingray SVB 192 Restoration

Gator looking very impressive....I hear ya on life getting in the wa and these projects being life changers!
 
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