1990 Lund Tyee 1650 Interior Overhaul

[harleynut]

Re: 1990 Lund Tyee 1650 Interior Overhaul

Take a look at the pics, I know it looks painful...



Actually, it's pictures of my foam samples so keep it clean... I didn't have much time to work on the boat but did have time to take these samples.

I took a couple of plugs using a hollow metal tube. The first plug I took I hit a rib on the bottom. It came out completely clean and dry. The second plug (the longer one with the red arrow) had a tad bit of moisture at the tip (ok,careful here!) - I'm talking about a drop or two at the very end. The rest of the sample was dry and looked good.

Is this a sign that all the foam should be ripped out and replaced? The boat hasn't seen the water since last fall and has been stored indoors.

Unrelated question: What's the best way to include pictures in a post? I have tried to link to my Picasaweb pics using the URL option and I get an invalid URL message. I know the URL works because I've tried it in several browsers. I'd rather link to my pics that have to waste space here and upload them.

This week my plan is to get everything I need ordered. Progress has been slow. I'm trying to get my new deck on the house completed. I'm putting in a cable rail and waiting on those parts but that's another story for another time.

 

[ezmobee]

Re: 1990 Lund Tyee 1650 Interior Overhaul

I really don't know what to tell you about your foam. It's obviously not "saturated" so it's not weighing you down. It would be easy for me to be like "OMG it's trapping water against your hull and it will eventually corrode holes and you'll sink and die" but that seems a little alarmist.

You seem to have figured out how to properly post pics using iboats so you could keep up with that. Picassa I think has issues. Most of us use photobucket and it works well.

 

[jigngrub]

Re: 1990 Lund Tyee 1650 Interior Overhaul

Use the url/code to post pics with your posts.

Your foam looks like the old cheap urethane and will probably saturate over time if left exposed to the elements, but if you're going to keep it on the trailer and garaged or covered you should be ok. If you want peace of mind and since you're already there, you may want to replace it.

 

[harleynut]

Re: 1990 Lund Tyee 1650 Interior Overhaul

I was afraid it was going to be one of those deals...

Is this the type of pink foam that I have read about on the forums to use to replace my existing foam?

Owens Corning Foamular F-150 2 in. x 48 in. x 96 in. Scored Squared Edge Foam

It says it's a closed-cell foam.

Is it best to mount it horizontally or vertically in the floor spaces?

Should I glue the pieces together to prevent squeaking? Or isn't that a problem?

I know about the noodles option but not sure I can find those available.

 

[ezmobee]

Re: 1990 Lund Tyee 1650 Interior Overhaul

That is one of the acceptable foams. Install it however you feel like. I've seen horizontal and vertical done.

 

[harleynut]

Re: 1990 Lund Tyee 1650 Interior Overhaul

I called Greenwood who manufactures PlyDek XL and talked to their marine plywood rep. I asked if they sold to consumers and the fellow (nice guy) said they really only sell to boat manufactures. He said their only supplier in my area is Overton's (Gander Mountain), who only sells it online. He suggested I talk to Lund and see if I sweet talked them they'd sell me some sheets. I'm thinking that's not a viable option since I don't think Lund is building boats in MN anymore. I think when Brunswick bought them they consolidated the manufacturing to the NY plant where Triton and Crestliner are built.

I did a bit of online comparison and this is what I came up with. I figured I'd need between 4 - 5 sheets of ply.

PlyDek
5 sheets 3/4" = $325
Delivery = $124
Total = $449

Gander only carries the 3/4" variety.

Compared to:

Arauco ply from Menards
4 sheets 1/2" = $125
1 sheet 3/4" = $35
3 gal Epoxy Resin = $134 (plus shipping but I don't know how much that is, 3 gallons mixed)
Total = $294

My labor to apply the resin is "free"!

Plus the PlyDek will add about 80 - 100 pounds due to the 3/4" thickness used everywhere (but more support!).

Any thoughts? Is it worth the difference? Am I missing something?

 

[jasoutside]

Re: 1990 Lund Tyee 1650 Interior Overhaul

1/2" is pretty thin stuff for most applications unless you have good stringer/structure to fasten it to. Have ya got some photos of what you are working with?

 

[fishrdan]

Re: 1990 Lund Tyee 1650 Interior Overhaul

I think when Brunswick bought them they consolidated the manufacturing to the NY plant where Triton and Crestliner are built.

My labor to apply the resin is "free"!

Plus the PlyDek will add about 80 - 100 pounds due to the 3/4" thickness used everywhere (but more support!).

Crestliner (and Lund) no longer manufactured in MN Don't say it's so....:facepalm:

I'm cheap, so yeah, go with the Arauco and epoxy. If it wasn't for the extra shipping cost of the PlyDek I wouldn't be saying that though....

A couple things about Arauco ply. Pro: it's lighter than doug fir plywood, 3/4 Arauco ply is about 65# while 3/4 doug fir ply is about 75#. Con: radiata pine (Arauco ply) is not as rot resistant as doug fir. As long as you epoxy the deck panels everything should be fine. The epoxy's added weight will make the Arauco come out about equal to the same thickness of doug fir ply.

Just make sure you epoxy the deck plywood really good to seal out water. Probably 90% of the fiberglass boat rebuilds in the resto forum are from the wood rotting out from under the fiberglass; improper glassing from the factory, the fiberglass coating was breached, holes unsealed or holes not sealed properly.

 

[fishrdan]

Re: 1990 Lund Tyee 1650 Interior Overhaul

1/2" is pretty thin stuff for most applications

I agree, my Crestliner had 1/2 decks and they were kind of springy, the reason I opted for 3/4 ply during the rebuild. They are not springy anymore.

Epoxy will stiffen the deck panels though...

 

[harleynut]

Re: 1990 Lund Tyee 1650 Interior Overhaul

I attached a few shots of the flooring but more can be seen here: http://tinyurl.com/tyeerestore

Almost all of the original decking was 7/16" (yes, not even 1/2") PlyDek with a single 3/4" piece over the fuel tank. I was somewhat shocked at that. I don't really recall having much if any bounce though. The aluminum stringers are pretty close together???



So, I'm gonna think about the PlyDek for one more night and hopefully something really enlightening comes to me.

Crestliner (and Lund) no longer manufactured in MN Don't say it's so....:facepalm:

Here is the article I read that says the Little Falls plant was closing and moving to the New York MILLS plant - which is in MN!!! I read right over the Mills part. I guess I caused all the panic for nothing by reading the article too quickly!!! :facepalm: I thought that was a strange deal but never looked at the article again. So it ain't so! http://www.northlandoutdoors.com/event/article/id/50818/publisher_ID/5/

 

[Woodonglass]

Re: 1990 Lund Tyee 1650 Interior Overhaul

Seeing your substructure and the poured in foam, a 1/2 deck would not be bouncy in that boat, especially if you put the pour in foam back in. Is the existing foam water saturated?

 

[harleynut]

Re: 1990 Lund Tyee 1650 Interior Overhaul

I pulled a couple of plugs out of the foam and shared the pics a few days ago above in this thread. The foam is not saturated but I did get a drop or two of water out of one sample. I'm debating on tearing it our or not. Jig says it's the older foam and just a matter of time...

 

[Woodonglass]

Re: 1990 Lund Tyee 1650 Interior Overhaul

Ok, i checked your foam post, And i agree with JNG that is the older style foam, but I also agee with EZ in that it does NOT appear to be saturated and if you are not going to let the boat sit exposed to the elements then I would not worry about replacing it at this time. Again that is just My opinion. Do as you see fit.

 

[fishrdan]

Re: 1990 Lund Tyee 1650 Interior Overhaul

New York Mills, WHEW!!! (Still not Little Falls for Crestliner, but close enough.)

I take back the need for 3/4 decking, there is a lot of support for the decks in your rig, epoxied 1/2 should work fine for most of it. On my boat there was no attachment point against the hull and the tank is 2.5' wide, that's where the flexing was at.

 

[jasoutside]

Re: 1990 Lund Tyee 1650 Interior Overhaul

I take back the need for 3/4 decking, there is a lot of support for the decks in your rig, epoxied 1/2 should work fine.

Yup, I am with Dan on that seeing what you have there^^^^

Foam tear out, hmmmmmmmm.

Maybe another sample or two in some low spots? Once it's wet I think it's very difficult for it to dry out again.

 

[jigngrub]

Re: 1990 Lund Tyee 1650 Interior Overhaul

Seeing the overall pics of your foam has changed my mind, it looks good and I wouldn't remove it.

As for the epoxy and plywood debate, even if you use the CCA PT you should epoxy the top side. I used to think I was bulletproof because I has the CCA ply, but I just recently learned I was wrong! I just removed all my decking, ripped the carpet off, and sanded the glue off. I found I had water damage to the top layer of ply... no rot at all, but the surface layer of ply was cracked and had raised wood grain and the bottoms of the pieces looked brand new. I sanded and filled on that stuff until I was blue in the face!!! It took me over a week to get it back to being acceptable.

Here are some pics:

This is the pieces after the first coat of filler and epoxy (2 coats)

If you look closely you can still see the cracks (I hope the pic is good enough for that)

This is after 2 coats of filler and 2 coats of epoxy.

I used the 3:1 epoxy from USComposites and the fairing compound for epoxy and poly. I was able to do it all with one quart of fairing compound ($5) and the 1/2 Gallon kit of epoxy ($40)

I strongly suggest that you epoxy any wood you use for decking especially if you're going to install carpet on it.

As for ply thickness, I'd go with the 1/2" (15/32). It's not as strong as the 3/4", but all of your hatches/hinges and other stuff will work better. Put the 3'4" back over the fuel tank.

btw, the USComposites epoxy is a lot cheaper than the price you quoted. $68 per gallon and you get 1 gallon of part a and 43 oz. of hardener. Buy the pumps too, very handy.

http://www.uscomposites.com/epoxy.html

I think you can do both sides of all your decking with a gallon. It only took me the 1/2 gallon kit to do all the decking in my 17' Tracker.

 

[ezmobee]

Re: 1990 Lund Tyee 1650 Interior Overhaul

I agree with everyone else that says you've got some substantial structure and foam support there. Go ahead with a 1/2" deck if you'd like.

 

[harleynut]

Re: 1990 Lund Tyee 1650 Interior Overhaul

Jig the boards look great! And that's great news on the amount of coverage you got. US says about a quart to cover both sides of a sheet of ply (about 250 sq ft per gal). I am not sure why I thought I needed up to 3 gals. I will probably get the 2 gal kit and have extra to fool around with.

So I have never done this....

I assume with new wood I won't need the fairing compound?
What did you use to apply the resin with and at what temp?

Thx to everyone on the structure/foam feedback. I'll be using mainly 1/2" and leaving the foam. Can I reinsert the plugs and glue in with 5200?

I tell ya, the support around here is awesome!

 

[jigngrub]

Re: 1990 Lund Tyee 1650 Interior Overhaul

So I have never done this....

I assume with new wood I won't need the fairing compound?
What did you use to apply the resin with and at what temp?

Thx to everyone on the structure/foam feedback. I'll be using mainly 1/2" and leaving the foam. Can I reinsert the plugs and glue in with 5200?

I tell ya, the support around here is awesome!

Go ahead and pick up a quart of fairing compound, it'll come in handy if you need it and it's kinda fun to play around with too. It's only $5.

These are the tools I used to apply the resin and fairing with:

The black plastic wall paper hanging tool came in very handy and made application of the fairing and resin a breeze, I got it at Home Depot in the paint section and it was $5. For fairing I used it for a screed and applied a fair amount of pressure to force the compound into the cracks. For the resin I used light pressure and just squeegeed the resin around in a 2'x3' area and the used the chip brush to back brush the area, then start another area. You can do a whole sheet of ply quickly this way. I mixed the resin in the disposable plastic cups, you'll need a pack of these and a dozen chip brushes (3"). The wall paper tool cleaned up easily with paint thinner, clean it immediately after each use.

The temps here are still pretty hot and were between 80-90*F. I used the 3:1 mix and made small 4 oz. batches for doing the small pieces and 8 oz batches for doing the whole sheet. The epoxy is very low odor so you can do it indoors if you want, or if you have to do it outside you can buy the 4:1 mix for cooler temps.


You can try reinserting the foam cores with 5200, but it might be like trying to stick a wet noodle up a Wildcats butt.

 

[ezmobee]

Re: 1990 Lund Tyee 1650 Interior Overhaul

I think the amount of epoxy used varies greatly depending on thickness of the resin and thirstiness of the wood. My deck sucked up like 3 gallons!