2007 Crusader 5.7L Classic Won't Start

69Allmand

Cadet
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
Messages
17
Re: 2007 Crusader 5.7L Classic Won't Start

Okay, I'm gonna make assumptions here, tell me if I'm wrong,,, It is an old boat, with the original wiring, & a new engine package. Not knowing the color of your wiring, I'm gonna make a generalization here.

The boat is old but the engines (twin engine boat) and harnesses are new, installed and wired by me (per the Crusader wiring diagram) and ran great with no probelms for 2 years. Also,the starboard engine does not have this problem. Please see wiring diagram on page 67 here: http://www.crusaderengines.com/manuals/L510019-07.pdf

If you're using the old original "I" ignition wire, it is a built in resistor wire! So, no external resistor is needed, it puts out less the 12volts, so just run it straight to the coil.\

No, there is no such wire in the harness. Again, the resistors came with the brand new engines and the starboard engine runs fine and is set up exacly the same, resistor included.

If you're uncomfortable with this idea, run a new wire from the ignition, Or any source?, (from anywhere?) that is controlled by the ignition switch to deliver a full 12volts to the ballast resistor on your engine.

If you want to test this, run a wire directly from your battery to feed the ballast resistor, then try to start it as usual,,, If it starts, & runs, then you must do one of the 2 things I mentioned (as a permanent fix!)

As earlier stated, I've already done this and the engine fires right up and runs great. I had to do this to get the boat off the dock and onto my mooring when I launched Monday.

Remember, the only way to shut the engine off when you do this test, is to pull the wire off the battery! That's why you need a full 12volt switched wire

Yup, got this too, had to pull the jumper or shut off engine batteries to kill the engine. I knew this wehn I added the jumper.

Disregard the "S" wire, as it is only powered when you hold the key to crank, otherwise it's dead, it is used only for starting, as you have found out ;)

An easy way to confirm all this, is check the voltage on the "I", or "run" wire with the ignition on to see if it has a full 12volts or not? probably not, meaning it's a resistor wire ;)

A bit of history...

I did run both engines "on the hard" prior to launch this past weekend with no issues. When I launched Monday the port engine fired up, then 30 to 60 seconds later died abruptly as if shut off with the switch indicating an electrical fault (ie. didn't sputter and get lumpy and then die). When I tried to re-start, all I got was the "fire" when cranking, classic symptom of an open ballast resistor. This is when I decided to replace the resistor because I had a spare on the boat and I did not have a meter to start troubleshooting. When the new resistor did not fix the problem I added the jumper so I could get off the launch dock and onto my mooring. The tide was running pretty good and I did not want to do the trip to the mooring on one engine.
 

69Allmand

Cadet
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
Messages
17
Re: 2007 Crusader 5.7L Classic Won't Start

It is an electric fuel pump. I jumped the oil pressure/fuel pump interlock switch out of the circuit last night and had the exact same problem.
I was pretty confident that would fix the problem....oh well!


I have to check the key switch itself. I have 12v at the batt terminal on the switch but I have not done a continuity test of the ignition circuit from the key switch to the engine. This is my new, best suspect. I'll be back at it tonight.
 

MikDee

Banned
Joined
Jun 6, 2007
Messages
4,745
Re: 2007 Crusader 5.7L Classic Won't Start

Humor me, is this a 2007 Boat? or an old boat with new 2007 engine packages? Then I would know if I'm giving you the right info, or not?
 

69Allmand

Cadet
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
Messages
17
Re: No Voltage at Starter "I" Terminal when Key in "Run"

Re: No Voltage at Starter "I" Terminal when Key in "Run"

Trust me, there is no safety lanyard circuit on this boat. The boat is a 1969, I bought and installed the engines, harnesses and guages two years ago, including the extension harness from the helm panel to the engines. They are very basic point to point harnesses using the older style 10 pin rectangular connectors.
 

69Allmand

Cadet
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
Messages
17
Re: 2007 Crusader 5.7L Classic Won't Start

It is an old boat with new engines, new harnesses and new guages. All of the new stuff was installed two years ago and ran fine for two full seasons (about 300 hours).
 

bruceb58

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Mar 5, 2006
Messages
30,581
Re: No Voltage at Starter "I" Terminal when Key in "Run"

Re: No Voltage at Starter "I" Terminal when Key in "Run"

Sorry...didn't see that from you earlier post.
 

MikDee

Banned
Joined
Jun 6, 2007
Messages
4,745
Re: 2007 Crusader 5.7L Classic Won't Start

I know you said you have good continuity in the "I" wire itself from the starter, but with the ignition on, do you have 12volts from the starter "I" terminal to the resistor? If not, that's your problem!

Your temporary hookup, just supplied 12volts to the jumped ballast resistor, why is it not getting 12volts from the "I" wire? Or, that resistor is bad as well?
 

JustJason

Vice Admiral
Joined
Aug 27, 2007
Messages
5,321
Re: 2007 Crusader 5.7L Classic Won't Start

Somebody needs to combine this guys 2 threads on the same thing.
 

69Allmand

Cadet
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
Messages
17
Re: 2007 Crusader 5.7L Classic Won't Start

Is there a way for me to combine the posts?
Sorry for the confusion, when I saw my original post buried on page 5 this morning I decided a new post with new info was a good idea. Obviously a boneheaded decision.
 

69Allmand

Cadet
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
Messages
17
Re: 2007 Crusader 5.7L Classic Won't Start

After a closer look at the wiring diagram and some help in my other thread I believe that Jason is correct and the I terminal should only have voltage when cranking. The voltage when the key is in run comes from the key switch via the purple wire on circuit 5. I will be checking that circuit tonight.
 

JustJason

Vice Admiral
Joined
Aug 27, 2007
Messages
5,321
Re: 2007 Crusader 5.7L Classic Won't Start

That's all it is man. Power into the keyswitch and power right back out of it to the ignition system when the key is on run. Fairly simple. The only way that would change is if you had an ESS.
 

MikDee

Banned
Joined
Jun 6, 2007
Messages
4,745
Re: 2007 Crusader 5.7L Classic Won't Start

After a closer look at the wiring diagram and some help in my other thread I believe that Jason is correct and the I terminal should only have voltage when cranking. The voltage when the key is in run comes from the key switch via the purple wire on circuit 5. I will be checking that circuit tonight.


Somethings fishy, usually the "S" wire is for "start", and the "I" wire is for "Ignition"
 

Bt Doctur

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Aug 29, 2004
Messages
19,344
Re: No Voltage at Starter "I" Terminal when Key in "Run"

Re: No Voltage at Starter "I" Terminal when Key in "Run"

Using points there is a ballast resistor or resistance wire in the ign, circuit.
At the starter solenoid: one lug supplies power to the coil ONLY during cranking mode. If motor fires and then stops when key is in run, there is no power getting to the coil.
Hot wire from battery to coil: runs or dosent
main harness plug: pull,clean, grease
extention harness plugs, harness plug under dash (if equipped)
Ign .switch
 

boatguya1

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Apr 24, 2009
Messages
444
Re: No Voltage at Starter "I" Terminal when Key in "Run"

Re: No Voltage at Starter "I" Terminal when Key in "Run"

I do have 12v at the batt terminal on the key switch and my guages all work when the switch is in run.

Jason, I don't think you're correct about the "I" and "S" terminals on the starter. My understanding is the "S" terminal provides a full 12v to the ignition circuit when cranking and the "I" terminal is supposed to supply ignition voltage thru the ballast resistor when the key is in the run position.

There is no safety lanyard on this setup. It is a twin engine inboard boat.

Jason is correct if you have not yet figured it out. The S (start) terminal on the starter receives the 12v from the key switch through the neutral safety switch and "tells" the starter to kick in and turn. While the starter S terminal is energized it connects to the starter I (ignition) terminal and sends 12v out to whatever circuits on your boat need it while cranking. The I terminal is only energised by the starter when it is cranking.

James
 

69Allmand

Cadet
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
Messages
17
Re: No Voltage at Starter "I" Terminal when Key in "Run"

Re: No Voltage at Starter "I" Terminal when Key in "Run"

Yes James I did realize that Jason was correct. What I'll be checking tonight is the ignition switch and the ignition circuit from the helm all the way down to the engine.

Thanks,
Mike D.
 

boatguya1

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Apr 24, 2009
Messages
444
Re: No Voltage at Starter "I" Terminal when Key in "Run"

Re: No Voltage at Starter "I" Terminal when Key in "Run"

You're on the right track now. :cool:

James
 

Don S

Honorary Moderator Emeritus
Joined
Aug 31, 2004
Messages
62,321
Re: 2007 Crusader 5.7L Classic Won't Start

Somebody needs to combine this guys 2 threads on the same thing.


Done. They are now one post. Look at the title line of each post if you want to know which thread it came from.
 

JustJason

Vice Admiral
Joined
Aug 27, 2007
Messages
5,321
Re: 2007 Crusader 5.7L Classic Won't Start

Don S said:
Done. They are now one post. Look at the title line of each post if you want to know which thread it came from.

Kewl... mang.... :)
 

69Allmand

Cadet
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
Messages
17
Re: 2007 Crusader 5.7L Classic Won't Start

Problem solved!!

It turned out to be a bad ignition switch. I replaced it Saturday morning and was OTW by noon.

Thanks for all your help and thanks DonS for combining the threads. I'll be more patient on that in the future.

Mike D.
 

MikDee

Banned
Joined
Jun 6, 2007
Messages
4,745
Re: 2007 Crusader 5.7L Classic Won't Start

I'm glad it was a simple easy inexpensive fix! ;) It sure was a bugger to figure out though :rolleyes: :D
 
Top