40 HP VRO Engine Problems

xwingz2 · Nov 24, 2003

We have finished spending about $500 to make this little flower run...and it is no better than when it stopped running last year! The engine has 120# Compression in both jugs. There is good spark. Carbs are rebuilt...it will rev-up nicely when NOT under load. The mechanic changed the VRO to a "mix" pump saying the VRO pump is "garbage". We are now being told to buy new carbs. This engine is an 87-89...have been told different things. On vacation...trying for a self-fix...grouper and reds are biting!! Any suggestions? I got it to run into the bay...but when I have it full throttle it "fell on its nose". Coming back in...I "feathered" the throttle and it wanted to increase rpm...never did. The line is new (year old) but...the bulb doesn't seem to be "really hard"...may be my incorrect impression. The plugs on both jugs are "wet"...is there a way to adjust the mixture? Is it too rich? Thanks, edu

OBJ · Nov 24, 2003

Re: 40 HP VRO Engine Problems

Hi Edu...welcome to the forums... The primer bulb will pump up firm but will soften up after the engine is run a bit. Are you using a gas "can" or are the tanks built in? If a can, make sure it's vented. Right off the top of my withered head, sounds like it's starving for gas....or maybe to much gas. Make sure all the hose and fuell line connections are tight. Also, check the red lever on the primer solenoid is in the normal position which is straight back and not off to the side. Does it start and idle ok in gear? One more question, did the wrench do a sync and link? This gets the throttle/engine timing in sync. Keep us posted and catch a bunch a' fish.

xwingz2 · Nov 24, 2003

Re: 40 HP VRO Engine Problems

Hi Edu...welcome to the forums... from Edu: THANKS...for the welcome and the quick-reply!! The primer bulb will pump up firm but will soften up after the engine is run a bit. Are you using a gas "can" or are the tanks built in? If a can, make sure it's vented. Right off the top of my withered head, sounds like it's starving for gas....or maybe to much gas. from Edu: This is a can...and I will double-chek that it is "vented"...thanks for the suggestion...of stuff that I shoulda checked!! Make sure all the hose and fuell line connections are tight. Also, check the red lever on the primer solenoid is in the normal position which is straight back and not off to the side. fromEdu: Is this "red lever" on the port or starboard...looking to the bow from the stern? Does it start and idle ok in gear? fromEdu: Yes..it does start...but a little low on idle. One more question, did the wrench do a sync and link? This gets the throttle/engine timing in sync. fromEdu: He commented that he did this and that these functions were "interactive". Can this be something besides the carbs???????? Keep us posted and catch a bunch a' fish. from Edu: Thanks for helping...and I AM trying to get to the darned fish!!! ed

seahorse5 · Nov 24, 2003

Re: 40 HP VRO Engine Problems

First things first, what is the complete model number printed on the engine tag?

G DANE · Nov 24, 2003

Re: 40 HP VRO Engine Problems

Hi EDU The fact that you were advised to buy new carbs tells me that your mechanic could have a lack of knowledge or experience. I never met a carb problem that wasnt fixable. I would strongly suggest you to fix yourselves or get another wrenghs opinion. That being said, Was the spark tested with a spark tester, or only by looking at sparking plugs ? Try to let spark jump a 1/2" gap, by rigging up some kind of spark tester. When motor bugs down, will pressing bulb help ? Will Hitting choker help ? If pressing bulb/hitting choker helps, you have a fuel problem. If you can, prepare a spray bottle with gas/oil mix and run it without airsilencer on. Try to squirt a little fuel into both carbs, when problem appears. If it picks up, your carbs need cleaning, best is disassembling, soaking overnight and blown through all jets and orifices with compressed air for cleaning.

xwingz2 · Nov 24, 2003

Re: 40 HP VRO Engine Problems

Hi EDU The fact that you were advised to buy new carbs tells me that your mechanic could have a lack of knowledge or experience. I never met a carb problem that wasnt fixable. I would strongly suggest you to fix yourselves or get another wrenghs opinion. That being said, Was the spark tested with a spark tester, or only by looking at sparking plugs ? Try to let spark jump a 1/2" gap, by rigging up some kind of spark tester. When motor bugs down, will pressing bulb help ? Will Hitting choker help ? If pressing bulb/hitting choker helps, you have a fuel problem. If you can, prepare a spray bottle with gas/oil mix and run it without airsilencer on. Try to squirt a little fuel into both carbs, when problem appears. If it picks up, your carbs need cleaning, best is disassembling, soaking overnight and blown through all jets and orifices with compressed air for cleaning. -------------------- G DANE Thanks to all...I will check for the engine information at Sunup. Thanks for pointing me in the right direction about carbs...we rebuild SUs for many folks and ... like you ... have never seen a carb that could not be rebuilt. These things are different to us. The spark was checked and will jump a 1/2" gap. There is enough spark to "zap ya"!! Thanks to all, edu

rodbolt · Nov 24, 2003

Re: 40 HP VRO Engine Problems

Good morning its time to change technicians. while the early VRO in 85-86 had some flaws the system now works quite well. anytime a tech tells you to eliminate such a feature you can bet the tech is not well trained and equipped to deal with your problem. post the entire model number. some of the under flywheel power packs would drop a cylinder and it can happen with the side mounted pack as well. if you can rebuild a skinner-union you can deal with a jonny-rude. its a motor. it goes suck,squeeze,bang and blow, if any of this is missing it dont go. try pushing the choke switch rapidly while it is falling down. if it tries to pick up look for fuel restricions in the carb and lines. test all your fittings.and what caused the initial problems 500 dollars ago? what work was done then? does your tech use a dyno or test wheel or does he just wing it by ear? good luck and keep posting

soggybottom · Nov 25, 2003

Re: 40 HP VRO Engine Problems

Hey EDU I had the same problem with my 87 Johnson 50 hp. VRO. Had the carbs re-built, head gasket changed, same thing would happen. Wouldn't run at full throttle. Problem was my plastic gas tank was cracked around the cap threads, made the motor lose it's prime. New tank, all is well now.

xwingz2 · Nov 25, 2003

Re: 40 HP VRO Engine Problems

Once again...thanks to all...each has given me something new to check. a.) Outboard Jim mentions the position of the red solenoid lever. It is pointed to the bow of the boat. Am I correct in reading that it should be pointed to the stern? b.) The model number is: J40ELCUD The serial number is: G7420193 (does this mean it is a 1993 model) c.) Spark looks good...plugs look like they are both getting fuel. The mechanic ... claims to be a 20 year OMC veteran ... did time and adjust. Is the first thing to try...the red lever? What could you suggest is next? Thanks... edu

G DANE · Nov 25, 2003

Re: 40 HP VRO Engine Problems

EDU In spite of what Michaelt says, borrow someones tank and fuel line. Try 2 locations of red lever ( cant remember what is right ) I have the same motor 1988 - great motor.

G DANE · Nov 25, 2003

Re: 40 HP VRO Engine Problems

Yours is a 87 model - says in model nr. "CU" The key is: I N T R O D U C E S 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 Wet plugs after iddle only tells iddle jets are open, not main jets, it will only pull fuel from main jets above 2500 rpm.

Walker · Nov 25, 2003

Re: 40 HP VRO Engine Problems

How are you testing for spark? Just because a sparkplug makes a spark doesn't mean it will do the same in a compressed atmosphere. Check and clean all coil grounds and check the coils for cracks. If you can, fire her up at night and watch for stray spark from the coils and wires.

Mark42 · Nov 25, 2003

Re: 40 HP VRO Engine Problems

If it is a spark grounding problem from cracks in the coils or bad wire insulation, sometimes a simple check is to hose down those parts with a "wire drier". I think WD40 can be used, but you should read the label. Then fire it up and go for a run. If it runs strong for a minute or so, it may be spark grounding through damaged or old ignition parts. Another option is to have a spray bottle of water and spray those same parts while it is idling and see if it dies. Indicates same problem. Mark.

xwingz2 · Nov 26, 2003

Re: 40 HP VRO Engine Problems

Good morning... We have changed the fuel line, connections...and the engine is still bogging. I cannot see or hear any spark "leaking"...will look tonite. The fuel system seems not to be pressurizing...if that makes any sense. We cannot get a "hardball". Earlier this morning the fuel seemed to be leaking through...or from the top carb. There was enough to be passed through the shrouding. Any suggestions where we can be "open"? Does it seem that the floats are not closing? WE are taking the carbs apart this afternoon. It runs...but just doesn't seem to be getting onto the primary jets. edu

xwingz2 · Nov 26, 2003

Re: 40 HP VRO Engine Problems

Hello board, I am Ed's son... I am completly lost with this engine. This afternoon I took off the carbs and went through them to make sure that they were cleaned and kits were put in them. Sure enough all is well in there. While I had them off I did the old upside down trick to make sure the floats were not stuck. When the carbs were upside down I could not "deliver fuel" into the engine (me blowing into it...) so... both of them seem to be sealing and working properly. This afternoon when I took it out...it started to take off but fell on its face... I pushed the auto-choke in on the key and it went and fell... again and again. Its almost like its starving for fuel. The primer bulb also is not getting hard- it seems to be bleeding down... In other words it will get hard but if you keep pressure on it... it will bleed down. A local guy here said that it sounds like the fuel pump...?? The fuel pump was supposed to be replaced when the 500 dollar repair was done.... so... I DONT KNOW! As Dad has said... I know cars... I am out to sea when it comes to marine engines.

Thank you all for your help... Hope everyone has a great Thanksgiving

HELP!! Trey.

G DANE · Nov 26, 2003

Re: 40 HP VRO Engine Problems

On next try, leave the choker and just press the bulb. If it picks up, the fuel pump is bad. There must be some warranty on the pump, if bad

xwingz2 · Nov 26, 2003

Re: 40 HP VRO Engine Problems

We have tried pumping the bulb while running... Does not seem to make a difference. We just took it out again and played with it. Here is something funny. I took my index and middle fingure and put them in the bottom carb and it picked up for a seccond and then dropped off. Tried it in the top and the engine wanted to die. Put them back in the bottom and it picked up for like 3 secconds. A marine company in Atlanta wants us to buy a $250 set of NEW carbs. But... whats the difference between new and rebuilt... NOTHING! This engine has run on these carbs... I am just lost. Stupid question- Could there be something in the intake blocking the fuel flow?

Thanks, Trey F.

xwingz2 · Nov 26, 2003

Re: 40 HP VRO Engine Problems

G Dane-- Are you living in Jutland?

xwingz2 · Nov 26, 2003

Re: 40 HP VRO Engine Problems

When I Turned the orange lever to the back of the engine it shut off and was very difficult to get started. It is running best with it toward the front of the boat. Thanks, Trey F. (ed's son)

xwingz2 · Nov 26, 2003

Re: 40 HP VRO Engine Problems

Umm... The engine will Rev when you manually do it in Neutral... Just no power under load.

Thanks everyone... Happy Thanksgiving. Trey.

40 HP VRO Engine Problems

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