'89 125 Force. Replace brushes on tilt/trim motor. Gotta be an easier way.

budblas

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Jun 14, 2002
Messages
40
The 'up'worked, the 'down'quit. I got two new relays but they are tripping the re-set. So, I took off the tilt/trim motor cover for a look. The armature looks shiny new. No corrosion inside. Turning the armature by hand moves the engine up and down enough that you can see it. Brushes look ok. So far, everything's under control. But here's where I lose it. Putting the cover on the armature while it's out is easy, but the strong magnets of the field make it almost impossible to line the axle into the pump. Putting the armature in first and then trying to pull the brushes back to clear the commutator is proving frustrating. Is there an easier way of putting this together? <br />By the way, a relay is a relay, right? If it's 12V and the 5 blades line up? <br />A lot of rambling here but it might save some questions. Any help is certainly welcome. Thanks.<br />Bud
 

12Footer

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Mar 25, 2001
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8,217
Re: '89 125 Force. Replace brushes on tilt/trim motor. Gotta be an easier way.

The relays are standard relays, costing 5 buks each at the auto parts store. A good counter person can cross-reference the original Bosch number.<br /><br />Have you tired the "mono-trick" yet? That is, using a 6-12lb test monofiliment fishing line looped-around the brush braid,and pulled back?<br />It werks every stinkin time. :cool: <br /><br />1.Cut two pieces of mono line about 10" long each. You could make them longer,or shorter, but 10" wont get in the way too much, while leaving you enough to grab a good hold of.<br /><br />2.Loop them around the brush braided wire,at the point where the braided wire connects to the brush.<br /><br />3.grasping the two lines at the ends, pull them into the brush cradles,and Hold them with one hand together,so that they are completely out of the comutator's way,as you line-up, and slide the cover down over it.<br />4. Once the cover is in place, you may turn the lines loose, holding the cover down (so it don't pop back off), and grasping one end of each line, simply pull the line from the cover.<br /><br />This may take a couple tries to get coordintated with the maneuver, but you'l quickly learn it.<br /><br />Before hooking-up the relays, the two wires from the tilt motor can be connected to the battery to test up.Transpose them, to test down. If it passes, your ready for the relays and the rest of the wiring.<br /><br />I hope my 'how-to' was understandable, but if not, just pop an email to me.
 

budblas

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Jun 14, 2002
Messages
40
Re: '89 125 Force. Replace brushes on tilt/trim motor. Gotta be an easier way.

Thanks 12 footer, never even tho't of the fishline<br />trick. One thing: when you mention transpose what am I missing? <br /><br />With the relays off can I not stick a 'hot'probe in the green (down) plug slot and then the other blue (up) plug slot ? <br /><br />Just as an aside,what gives this motor the capability of reversing rotation. If it's too involved don't worry, I'll be happy that it just does.<br />Thanks, you helped a lot.<br />Bud
 

12Footer

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Joined
Mar 25, 2001
Messages
8,217
Re: '89 125 Force. Replace brushes on tilt/trim motor. Gotta be an easier way.

Force made three different tilt drives,counting thier L-drive model. Of the other two, one uses two wires from the motor, the other uses three. I'm not sure which type you have, but your description (one green, one blue), leads me to surmize, it is a two wire tilt motor. <br />The short answer, yes. Blue to negative post of battery, green to positive, the motor should go one way, change the wires (blue to neg,green to pos, or "transpose") the wires, and it'll go in reverse. You can use a couple pieces of stout (#8 or better) automotive wire, and use them for testing directly to the battery. <br /><br />One caveat; Be ready for some sparking. Test away from fuel tanks)...<br />That being said, you should never get sparks like you do when jumping a car being started. It should never develop any heat iether, under normal conditions. If it does, your motor has a direct short to ground.<br /><br /> The relays normally manage this function, but for testing purposes, you can test the tilt motor's operation directly, thus elliminating or confirming it as the defective part.<br />The fact that it seemed to be shorting-out steers me to think that one of the relays had welded itself closed, so that when you pushed "UP" or "DOWN", the other relay completed a path to ground thru it.....or not. It could also have been the brushes, wire harness, or defective switch too. But those relays frequently do that if they haven't been used a lot, or when they are mechanicly-damaged, or got wet inside, and rusted closed. The latter is very common.
 

budblas

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Jun 14, 2002
Messages
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Re: '89 125 Force. Replace brushes on tilt/trim motor. Gotta be an easier way.

12 footer:<br />Thanks again, problem solved.<br />Bud
 

formerterp

Cadet
Joined
Jun 20, 2004
Messages
8
Re: '89 125 Force. Replace brushes on tilt/trim motor. Gotta be an easier way.

12 footer I'm having the same problems with my trim. Only works when I tap the pump with a wrench and then slowly falls. I've been told that the brushes aren't holding. You can hear the slipping when motor is falling under the pump. I'm not a mechanic but do all my oil changes and impellors myself. What are the odds you can walk me through a fix?
 
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