89 Four Winns Freedom 170 Floor / Stringer Rebuild PICS

[rickryder]

Re: 89 Four Winns Freedom 170 Floor / Stringer Rebuild PICS

435 is the way to go. I got mine from us composites in Fla. Where are you located? Might be places closer to you.

On the tank question..... moving it may help but think about running fuel line,vent line and fill hose.... The fill hose would have to be pretty long and the are a bit pricey.

 

[mbasonic]

Re: 89 Four Winns Freedom 170 Floor / Stringer Rebuild PICS

The only reason i asked about the 435, is because i read somewhere that vinyl ester resin might be stronger. Anyone, or rickryder have any thoughts on this? Good thoughts on the gas tank movement. I hadn't really given a whole lot of thought to the tank hoses and what not......
I'm out of Texas, but I'll be buying a majority of my stuff online i think, unless i can find it somewhere around Austin cheaper.
Here's some links on more updates of my progress. Thanks to rickryder for helping upload my pics. You can see in these pics the ease of access to my stringers up front. The walk through bow area was pretty difficult to get the old plywood out, but i was successful. I used a screw driver and my oscillating saw!! You can also see a small section of plywood in the very front that i decided to leave. It wasn't rotted, and the fiber glass floor walk through area was not sitting on this piece,. So,i decided to just leave it as is, and I'll glass or resin the edges real good before i slip the triangular bow piece of plywood with walk through stringer to stringer beam support. I'll probably add some cross support to the front of the triangle also for added walk through strength.
http://i1046.photobucket.com/albums/b468/mbasonic/cf71a38aabff9d2acc8d67024fc5276e506a1a74.jpg

http://i1046.photobucket.com/albums/b468/mbasonic/404f060ef1d2533e2d5a0de8a06f17cf4392184a.jpg

http://i1046.photobucket.com/albums/b468/mbasonic/93747bb557c2dfac512c10f40740043e6ce94fbd.jpg

Thanks in advance for any advice.
Matt

 

[mbasonic]

Re: 89 Four Winns Freedom 170 Floor / Stringer Rebuild PICS

Any opinions? I still haven't been able to locate 1/2" underlayment. Source for this plywood?
Matt

 

[rickryder]

Re: 89 Four Winns Freedom 170 Floor / Stringer Rebuild PICS

Have you called a local lumber yard?? They may not call it underlayment in Tx.... Just tell them your looking fo plywood with ext glue and little or no voids in the layers... I would use 5/8" for the deck.....1/2" is too thin IMO... Also check Lowes for ARAUCO PLYWOOD ACX that will work too!

Sorry I haven't been around lately....I got called into the union to build the stage sets for the tv show Royal Pains in NYC and that's a killer commute for me.... I'll try to get on the computer when I can Matt

Oh and on the resin....your boat is built from poly resin so the 435 will be just fine

 

[mbasonic]

Re: 89 Four Winns Freedom 170 Floor / Stringer Rebuild PICS

I'm reposting the last pictures, so you don't have to go to them. They'll be referenced. I've also come along with my progress.



Here are some more recent pictures of my project



Gas tank is out!!! I checked mccoys for the wood, and they didn't have that underlayment, rickryder.

Matt

 

[Struc]

Re: 89 Four Winns Freedom 170 Floor / Stringer Rebuild PICS

I checked mccoys for the wood, and they didn't have that underlayment, rickryder

Some good information in this thread about the different plywood out there to use:

http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=559305

 

[mbasonic]

Re: 89 Four Winns Freedom 170 Floor / Stringer Rebuild PICS

I cut the stringers back to the edge of the motor mounts...

And.....as you can see the stringers were pretty much rotten all the way through. I still haven't quite figured how I'm going to replace this area yet. I'm taking suggestions, but I'm planning on using nida bond on that also.


I also cut the deck back to the transom, and was happy to see that the deck wood wasn't directly touching the transom wood. I'm sure that's the way it is supposed to be, but I'm never surprised with how things are actually put together when i take them apart.

Here are the picture of the deck cut back.


I consider this pretty good progress. Things are definitely coming along.

Matt

 

[Woodonglass]

Re: 89 Four Winns Freedom 170 Floor / Stringer Rebuild PICS

Check the lumber Yards for MDO plywood. I'ts another great plywood for restoring boats. RR has you on the right track. The resin and materials he's suggesting are "Spot On" for your rebuild. As he stated you may have to go to the Lumber Yard and not the Big Box stores.

 

[mbasonic]

Re: 89 Four Winns Freedom 170 Floor / Stringer Rebuild PICS

Well i went ahead and bought marine plywood. I know it's expensive, but i just feel more comfortable with it. The local lumber yard ordered it for me.......69$ a sheet. I'm pretty confident i can deck it with 2-3 sheets, and have some extra left over. I've heard it costs upwards of 120$ a sheet depending on where you get it. So..... not horrible. Not great! But not horrible

 

[rickryder]

Re: 89 Four Winns Freedom 170 Floor / Stringer Rebuild PICS

Looking at the pics of your motor mounts I would consider pulling the motor and rebuilding the mounts.

 

[mbasonic]

Re: 89 Four Winns Freedom 170 Floor / Stringer Rebuild PICS

Can it be done without removing the motor? I was thinking about putting some supports under the engine that would rest perfectly in the trough(bilge) area of the boat. Basically resting the engine on this,(the trailer wooden slats are under this area) while i tear out the motor mounts and rebuild them up against the metal brackets. I know this sounds difficult, but possible??? Or...my second thought was to dig out half of the wood, pour nida bond, then dig out the other half, and fill the rest with nida bond.
Thoughts?

 

[mbasonic]

Re: 89 Four Winns Freedom 170 Floor / Stringer Rebuild PICS

Well, here's the latest progress. I cut the stringers behind the engine mounts. The wood in these parts were just as rotten as the rest of the boat. The only problem was that when i got to the wood next to the transom, there was some darkened wood on the transom. I took my oscillating saw and chopped out a small section of the transom till i got all the dark area out. I figured i could just fill this with nida bond anyways. I cut till i got to fresh looking wood. Did i get enough?, and does this wood look good enough? Feels and looks solid.

I also was thinking about cutting a half inch off the bottom of the transom plate on the inside, and up around the upside down U cut out (around the water drain), just to check the exposed area. I reach under this bottom transom lip and it doesn't feel like it was glassed or gel coated. I've attached a picture where the gel cost is cracked. Should i cut this 1/2" area out all the way around to check it? That one area where i marked solid feels pretty strong.

Thanks
Matt

 

[CRJDriver]

Re: 89 Four Winns Freedom 170 Floor / Stringer Rebuild PICS

I appreciate your pics and info! I am replacing some rotted wood on my 1986 Horizons 170. My boat is very simular, except I have an outboard with the high back transom.

Do the stringers and transom butt up to each other wood to wood or are the seperated by fiberglass? I am currious if the transom can get contaminated from a wet stringer.

 

[mbasonic]

Re: 89 Four Winns Freedom 170 Floor / Stringer Rebuild PICS

It didn't appear that my deck was wood to wood on transom, but it definitely seemed like the stringers were touching the transom. I'm not sure if this is typical or just an accident. I cut straight down the wall of the transom from the top of the stringer to the bottom, and i never saw a separation of stringer/transom by fiber glass/resin. So i ended up cutting into the transom a bit.

 

[rickryder]

Re: 89 Four Winns Freedom 170 Floor / Stringer Rebuild PICS

That's a bummer the rot entered the transom.... You need to get all the rot out of there. Most cases when using nita bond you need to remove all the wood core and pour the transom.... It's weird that your transom doesn't go to the bottom of the hull in the bilge

I had a thought on repairing where the stringer where it butts the transom.... Clean out the area real well and expose the outer skin glass. Make up your stringer with some blocking to fill the area that you removed....kinda like sister blocks on each side of the stringer and insert it into your cutout. You will need to wash out the area with acetone,pack it with PB mixture and push the stringer into the hole....smooth the PB that squishes out....then you can tab it to the transom and hull.... You will have to grind and clean the hull and transom where your laying new glass to get a good bond....

That's the idea maybe someone else will chime in on it.....

 

[mbasonic]

Re: 89 Four Winns Freedom 170 Floor / Stringer Rebuild PICS

Rickryder, did you see the pictures of the transom area i cut out? It doesn't look that bad...

 

[CRJDriver]

Re: 89 Four Winns Freedom 170 Floor / Stringer Rebuild PICS

Can you core sample if it looks good and then inject penatrating epoxy resin if it is just a small area that is bad? Then cover over the core holes with resin?

 

[rickryder]

Re: 89 Four Winns Freedom 170 Floor / Stringer Rebuild PICS

Can you core sample if it looks good and then inject penatrating epoxy resin if it is just a small area that is bad? Then cover over the core holes with resin?

Yup or fill it with PB mixture.

 

[rickryder]

Re: 89 Four Winns Freedom 170 Floor / Stringer Rebuild PICS

Rickryder, did you see the pictures of the transom area i cut out? It doesn't look that bad...

Looks like a small area and it looks like the wood is solid.

 

[mbasonic]

Re: 89 Four Winns Freedom 170 Floor / Stringer Rebuild PICS

Another day of progress... i ordered my 435 resin (5 gallons) from uscomposites, 1 quart of white gel coat (for the transom/bilge area), and some 3/4 ounce chopped strand mat(csm) today. I really need my nida bond first. H opefully i can get it ordered Monday.
So, today just ended up being a sanding day. I basically just sanded the crap out of the rough spots on the hull where i cut the stringers out, and the deck from the edge of the hull. I'm sure everyone knows!!!!, But i can't stress to you how important it is to have a respirator while you're doing this. It gets crazy dusty. I sanded till i couldn't see what i was sanding, then i vacuumed, then back to the sanding.

Dust!!! Then more dust.

Then some vacuuming!

Smooth as a babies bottom.... not really!
More to come.

Matt