95 Force 5hp fuel delivery

[Cherokee-Runabout]

I just recently purchased a 95 2 stroke force 5hp motor and it would start then run for a few seconds to a minute and then die. After removing pull start handle and cowling and reinstalling pull start handle I noticed that the gasket at fuel pump was cracked and was misting fuel. I ordered the Sierra replacement part for the fuel pump which included three gaskets and a diaphragm. Today I removed the old parts and reinstalled new. The old diaphragm looked worn and was not properly sealed. I hooked everything up with new parts and tried to start and nothing. I then reached for the starter fluid and was able to get the motor started for a few seconds before it would die with open choke. I repeated this process a few times and was finally able to run motor for a minute before it cut out again. I removed the line that delivers fuel to carb and started again with starting fluid to monitor output from fuel pump. There was a very minor spray coming out of pump. I am not a very experienced outboard mechanic and am fairly sure that I installed everything as it should be. The line from the tank is brand new and the primer bulb seems to stay pressurized. I am going to remove pump again and check filter in pump housing. I am open to any advice or helpful hints before I throw in the towel and have someone else work on it. Thanks for looking!

 

[kbh121956]

You shouldn't have any spray coming from the fuel pump. Check the very small reed valves on the fuel pump. They should sit flat. Make sure that all mating surfaces are clean. Instead of using "starter fluid" use a 50:1 mix in a spray bottle. Starting fluid has no lubricating properties. Here is a video of how your new fuel pump kit works. https://youtu.be/OQd15TwaxtQ

 

[Cherokee-Runabout]

update: I have since been able to keep motor for at least ten minutes without issue. My problem ended up being in the fuel connectors ( I installed new female that ended up being incompatible with existing male component on motor). Now when the motor runs at more than half speed it pings where either the rpms jump up but won’t sustain smooth action. Could this be fuel related as well or something electrical?

 

[kbh121956]

Also you can spray your 50:1 mix directly into the carb air intake while cranking the motor over. That way you won't need to remove the hose going to the carb. Make sure that you have water running to the outboard or that it's in a barrel, it doesn't take long to burn up the water pump impeller. Good luck and post your results.

 

[Cherokee-Runabout]

You shouldn't have any spray coming from the fuel pump. Check the very small reed valves on the fuel pump. They should sit flat. Make sure that all mating surfaces are clean. Instead of using "starter fluid" use a 50:1 mix in a spray bottle. Starting fluid has no lubricating properties. Here is a video of how your new fuel pump kit works. https://youtu.be/OQd15TwaxtQ

Thanks for the video I was trying to find one but was searching for Force... Also yes I knew it shouldn’t be spraying from between gaskets, what I meant was I removed the line going to carb and was looking for a spray ( ended up being a stream on the fuel out to carb once I swapped my fittings back). Do you think I should just bypass the quick connects and run a barbed fitting from tank fuel line to engine fuel line? I have quick connect on tank. Also, I had difficulties finding the quick connect make fitting that attaches to motor but will search when I have more time.

 

[Cherokee-Runabout]

Yes, haha , I at least know to put it in a barrel.

 

[kbh121956]

update: I have since been able to keep motor for at least ten minutes without issue. My problem ended up being in the fuel connectors ( I installed new female that ended up being incompatible with existing male component on motor). Now when the motor runs at more than half speed it pings where either the rpms jump up but won’t sustain smooth action. Could this be fuel related as well or something electrical?

Did you fix the leaking fuel pump? This problem isn't electrical, it is fuel related. I was going to suggest that you check your fuel fittings, you did it on your own.

 

[kbh121956]

IMO, the Chrysler/Force quick connects suck. Use a Teflon tape on your fittings.

 

[Cherokee-Runabout]

Yes, the leaking fuel pump has been fixed. Fuel now flows freely through pump when I squeeze primer bulb. So the noise probably means it’s not getting enough fuel to sustain performance under higher demand? I’m going to try to just completely bypass the quick connects on motor and just use a barbed fitting. Do you think that could be the issue, I also didn’t take the pump off again, should I do this and check the filter in pump housing? As stated before fuel flowed freely from the line out on fuel pump when using primer bulb.

 

[kbh121956]

If you have fuel being pumped into the carb, your fuel filter isn't plugged. Are you sure that you put all the gaskets and diaphragm in correctly? If any of the quick disconnects aren't working correctly it will draw air through them and cause you problems. I would bypass all disconnects for now and see how she runs. You could have a dirty carb, also the carb could be out of adjustment. Keep us posted and good luck.

 

[Cherokee-Runabout]

Unfortunately I won’t have time to work on it for a day or so. I did notice from the video that my pump is slightly different. I did not have a transport cover like the one showed and it did not have the protruding segment on the diaphragm or those gaskets. I assume that this is just a difference in the year? Instead of a transport cover all that I could see was two semi-sphere cutouts rather than a small singular hole. I will take pictures of it hopefully tomorrow to post if that will help clarify. Otherwise I’m almost certain that everything else is installed as it should be. I do have a carb rebuild kit and should maybe just go ahead and try to tackle that as well? I did squirt some carb cleaner in after I had gotten it running ( maybe I shouldn’t have done this?). Anyhow thanks again for all of the troubleshooting!

 

[kbh121956]

Sounds good. Post your model number and some pics, others will also answer you by morning.Take you time on the carb, it isn't hard to do. If you can upload a video of it running? I haven't had much luck in uploading anything. You can get this running properly by yourself.

 

[jerryjerry05]

A hose from the tank to the pump without the disconnect fittings is the best.
It sounds like the carb might need cleaning?
Is the fuel new? check for water?

 

[Cherokee-Runabout]

Okay so I had a few minutes before work this morning. I swapped out all quick connects for barbed fittings and started motor on 2nd pull. It ran for a minute at idle and then rpms started bouncing once I applied throttle. Shifted into gear. Ran smooth to WOT then rpms started to bounce again. I played with adjustment screw on carb at WOT but nothing there seemed to help. Is this indicative of clogged or semi-clogged jet? Would Seafoam help this issue or should I just roll up my sleeves and tackle the carb. Thanks again for all of the help. https://youtu.be/-6gSXeJfQcM
Also the first video shows it running smooth at WOT in gear but 15 seconds later this happened...https://youtu.be/TnjeJBxpfeo
Jerry, yes, fuel is less than a week old.

Update: (yet again) so I think it means there is too much air getting in. When I replaced the quick connect on motor I trimmed fuel line a tad to replace cracked sections. Anyway after I put new fittings on and motor started cutting out I noticed that the fuel line had another crack in it. I’m going to replace fuel lines in motor and maybe drill a hole in cowling to reduce kinks and run new fuel line through that. (Existing design is tight fitting as fuel line must be bent around carb)

 

[Cherokee-Runabout]

So it seems WOT in the barrel may cause this issue? Waiting on MSO to register new boat ( a whole other headache...) will post updates once I get on water. Thanks again!

 

[kbh121956]

Yes replace all your old fuel lines. Modern fuel lines are made for todays junk gas. Try and find a way that you don't have to drill a hole on the cowling? I think that you will end up cleaning the carb. I couple cans of spray carb cleaner will do it. If you are careful when taking the carb apart you might not even need a kit. The carb is very simple, you can do this! Seafoam makes my outboards run terrible. Sweet little outboard that you have. Enjoy!

 

[Cherokee-Runabout]

Fuel lines are replaced. I called the guy I bought it from and had him listen over the phone. He seems to know what he’s talking about and said that the air in the water in the barrel may cause the same issue ( I’m runbing it in small 33 gallon drum ). As for the hole in cowling, I was able to run the barbed fitting through with less of a kink than old, but less of a bite on the barb, maybe 3/8 but I figure that is plenty. Thanks for info on Seafoam, I’ll hold off on that then. I already have the kit so once I run it in larger body and if it still has issues I may go ahead with rebuild. Thanks for all of the help, looking to toss this on a solo skiff and see where I can’t go!

 

[kbh121956]

LOL, sounds like fun! Enjoy!

 

[Cherokee-Runabout]

I had a ‘77 Lund tri—hull with a 70hp Johnson. I downsized, girlfriend wasn’t thrilled...

 

[jerryjerry05]

Running in a barrel shouldn't cause any problems???
The screw on the carb is for idle only.
It sets the air fuel mix and doesn't do anything for the motor once it goes past idle.
Set it at about 1 1/2 turns and then adjust once the motor goes in the water and in gear.