Adding an axle

captmello

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I found a deal on a used pontoon bunk style trailer with a single axle with brakes. The owner is using it for his 22' pontoon.
I would like to use it for my 24 foot boat but I'm afraid its going to be a bit too much for a single axle. I think many standard axle weight limits are 3500lb, But I can 't confirm that is the axle limit on this trailer. I think my boat and trailer will be a bit over that. Are these just standard trailer axles like you can buy at Northern Tool? Can a guy just bolt one on and go, or is all this a no no for safety/legal reasons. Anything else I'm forgetting?

Thanks.
 

tpenfield

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Re: Adding an axle

The trailer parts are pretty much standard items that all trailer manufacturers use . . . It might take a bit of research into the motor vehicle regulation issues of a 'modified' trailer. but when you think about it folks modify their cars, etc. without much bother.

I think you are better off with more axles, so it is probably a workable idea.
 

Thalasso

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Re: Adding an axle

I found a deal on a used pontoon bunk style trailer with a single axle with brakes. The owner is using it for his 22' pontoon.
I would like to use it for my 24 foot boat but I'm afraid its going to be a bit too much for a single axle. I think many standard axle weight limits are 3500lb, But I can 't confirm that is the axle limit on this trailer. I think my boat and trailer will be a bit over that. Are these just standard trailer axles like you can buy at Northern Tool? Can a guy just bolt one on and go, or is all this a no no for safety/legal reasons. Anything else I'm forgetting?

Thanks.

Your state might require brakes on all axles
 

Bondo

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Re: Adding an axle

I found a deal on a used pontoon bunk style trailer with a single axle with brakes. The owner is using it for his 22' pontoon.
I would like to use it for my 24 foot boat but I'm afraid its going to be a bit too much for a single axle. I think many standard axle weight limits are 3500lb, But I can 't confirm that is the axle limit on this trailer. I think my boat and trailer will be a bit over that. Are these just standard trailer axles like you can buy at Northern Tool? Can a guy just bolt one on and go, or is all this a no no for safety/legal reasons. Anything else I'm forgetting?

Thanks.

Ayuh,.... Can ya post up some Pictures,..??

Alota boat wagons use the sub-frame concept for adjustability, others don't...
If it's a sub-frame style, do ya Weld,..??
Fabbin' up, Whatever ya need shouldn't be Too hard,...

If the suspension is frame mounted, ya probably can do it with bolt on pieces....

Dependin' on what ya got to start with, determines which way ya gotta go to get where ya wanta be.... ;)
 

Silvertip

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Re: Adding an axle

Adding an axle to a single axle trailer is no small task. First, the existing mounting hardware must be removed. The walking beam (called and equalizer) mount must be welded to the frame and then the front and rear spring mounts must be welded on. Make a mistake with the spring length dimensions and you get to do it all over again. Can it be done? Certainly -- provided you know what you are doing and can weld (properly).
 

H20Rat

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Re: Adding an axle

Not all pontoon trailers have walking axles.. Some just mount up 2 axles like they were independent of each other. Yes, not ideal, and you need to have the trailer level when connected to the tow vehicle.

(my pontoon trailer is set up like that, from the factory. 2 sprung, non-walking axles. When I unload one axle comes off the ground entirely as I go over the crown of the ramp)
 

tpenfield

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Re: Adding an axle

Pictures would be good, as Bond-o suggested.

For simplicity, you could add a torsion axle and avoid the complexity of a tandem spring setup. What type of springs are on there now?
 

captmello

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Re: Adding an axle

Thanks for the replies! This is exactly the feedback I need.

No, I'm not a welder...but I can tighten a bolt with the best of them.;)

I requested some pics from the seller but have yet to hear back. Used pontoon trailers are a hot commodity here so it may have been gone by the time I showed interest.

If I receive any more info I'll let you guys know. Thanks again.
 

BobGinCO

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Re: Adding an axle

Last year, I replaced the two crappy, under-rated axles the dealer in Minnesota sold me, with two new axles with electric brakes. All-out, it cost me about $1,200. Southwest Axle is the place to check. On a pontoon trailer, a lot of them use torsion axles, that just bolt to the frame.
 

captmello

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Re: Adding an axle

Last year, I replaced the two crappy, under-rated axles the dealer in Minnesota sold me, with two new axles with electric brakes. All-out, it cost me about $1,200. Southwest Axle is the place to check. On a pontoon trailer, a lot of them use torsion axles, that just bolt to the frame.

My scissor trailer has the torsion axles and just bolt on, but I'm not sure about the bunk trailer. Electric brakes on a boat trailer? I thought you couldn't use electric brakes on a boat due to the submerging of the brake system.
 

smokeonthewater

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Re: Adding an axle

There are boat trailers that come factory with electric brakes... doesn't hurt a thing.
 

captmello

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Re: Adding an axle

There are boat trailers that come factory with electric brakes... doesn't hurt a thing.

Funny, the two dealers I visited the other day, both said they didn't use electric because of the submersion of the axles. the dealers were quite different also. One was going to sell me the two axle, but only one with brakes, the other was standard both axles with brakes. Prices were 600 apart.

I had inquired because I'm wired for electric and would prefer them.
 

Silvertip

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Re: Adding an axle

Not all pontoon trailers have walking axles.. Some just mount up 2 axles like they were independent of each other. Yes, not ideal, and you need to have the trailer level when connected to the tow vehicle.

(my pontoon trailer is set up like that, from the factory. 2 sprung, non-walking axles. When I unload one axle comes off the ground entirely as I go over the crown of the ramp)

And guess what happens every time one or both wheels come off the ground? Yup, the other axle and it's tires are severely overloaded.
 

Silvertip

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Re: Adding an axle

Electric brakes are fine in fresh water. Everything electric is sealed. The mechanical portion of the system is no different than surge brakes and in fact, has fewer mechanical parts. Brakes are normally used on only one axle because that's all that is necessary in most cases. Where state laws require it, all axles will have them. Brake requirements are generally based on the state laws and GVWR of the trailer. That number my be anywhere from 2500 - 3500 pounds Gross (trailer, boat, and all contents) weight.
 

oldjeep

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Re: Adding an axle

Funny, the two dealers I visited the other day, both said they didn't use electric because of the submersion of the axles. the dealers were quite different also. One was going to sell me the two axle, but only one with brakes, the other was standard both axles with brakes. Prices were 600 apart.

I had inquired because I'm wired for electric and would prefer them.

FWIW - you are required to have brakes on all axles in MN if you are over 3K
 

oldjeep

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Re: Adding an axle

One more note for the OP. Try expanding your search area a bit, I usually see a pontoon trailer or 2 for sale when I'm at the lake place in Amery. Are you looking for a bunk trailer or scissor trailer?
 

smokeonthewater

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Re: Adding an axle

Funny, the two dealers I visited the other day, both said they didn't use electric because of the submersion of the axles. the dealers were quite different also. One was going to sell me the two axle, but only one with brakes, the other was standard both axles with brakes. Prices were 600 apart.

I had inquired because I'm wired for electric and would prefer them.
Trailering Club - Trailering Magazine Archives

"Electric Brakes
An Idea Showing No Signs of Stopping


At first glance, the idea of putting electric brakes on a boat trailer goes over like a lead balloon. And the reason is well founded: we are brought up with the caveat about what can happen when electricity is mixed with water. Well, that was then and this is now.



Today there are __ boat trailer companies offering electric brakes on some of their models. EZ Loader, one of the first to do so, will install electric brakes on about 20% of the trailers they'll build this year. In addition, this is the first year electric boat trailer brakes are being offered in the BoatU.S. catalog. At EZ Loader and at BoatU.S., Fulton Performance Products build the brakes.



"Electric trailer brakes have been used successfully in the recreational vehicle and horse trailer industries for many years, " says Fulton's Craig Wilson. "The main concern with using electric brakes on boat trailers was corrosion or shorting out of electrical components when submerged in the water. The electrical connections we use are resin-encased and sealed against moisture. The result is a brake that is reliable in water."



EZLoader Chief Executive Officer David Thielman says their boat trailers using electric brakes require no special accessories or hookups for operation. "All the newer tow vehicles are prewired so that the trailer needs only to be attached and plugged in for travel. And when people first use one with electric brakes, they always tell me how they feel the difference when stopping."



By far, the most common boat trailer braking system in use today is surge brakes. When the tow vehicle brakes are applied, the boat trailer pushes against an actuator located on the trailer tongue resulting in the brakes being engaged. Although surge brakes have proven themselves worthy of safe operation over the years, they are currently the center of a dispute regarding use on non-commercial utility and boat trailers. It is an issue of interpretation of a federal Department of Transportation law and whether or not surge brakes are legal. The Surge Brake Coalition, made up of utility and rental trailer companies as well as boat trailer builders has filed a petition with the USDOT asking for clarification regarding whether brakes on a non-commercial trailer are illegal if not controlled from the cab (as is the case with surge brakes). In a number of states (including Maryland), the federal view is considered the right view although no police units have been told to start making arrests.



Load-Rite Trailers President Bob Roseman sent a letter to then-Maryland Governor Parris Glendenning urging a settlement of the surge brake issue (this occurred after the state's Deputy Secretary of Transportation told BoatUS Trailering Magazine surge brakes are illegal on boat trailers but no violations will be cited). "The interpretation in Maryland would have you switch from a proven braking system for boat trailers to a system that has had very limited use..." Roseman argued in the letter.



But until this issue is resolved, many boat trailer buyers (as well as current boat trailer owners) are looking at other options in the unlikely event the Surge Brake Coalition's effort is unsuccessful.



While EZLoader sells a majority of its trailers with surge brakes, Dave Thielman understands the reason a prospective buyer would consider the electric brake. "Surge has to have the trailer push against the tow vehicle before any trailer braking can begin. This means, prior to the brakes going to work, there is always going to be some forward motion; a forward push against the tow vehicle before the trailer actually starts to brake."



And then there is the issue of salt water and electric brakes. Fulton's Craig Wilson is well aware of the concern. He says that's why the company spent years testing and fine-tuning the product. "Not only is the electrical connection well-sealed, but the brake springs are corrosion resistant stainless steel. Our Ful-Stop backing plates are coated with a product we designed for this very purpose called SharkSkin. This is a self-healing coating that has been salt spray tested up to 1,000 hours with no signs of red rust (a term used to describe the early stages of rust formation)."



Electric brakes use a lever installed in the tow vehicle that adjusts the sensitivity of the stopping action. This brake control can be changed prior to every trip depending on the weight being carried in the boat or a change in the terrain over which the boat is going to be pulled. The ability to control the intensity of the braking action provides the driver more flexibility in adapting to changing environments.



The center of the electric system is an electro-magnet that drags on the inner face of the brake drum. The more the magnet grabs on the surface of the drum, the more braking it provides. A major selling point that is made to trailer boat owners is the fact electric brakes provide full braking in reverse, which is certainly welcome when back down a steep or slippery boat ramp with a boat on a trailer.



Another safety characteristic that is part of electric braking system is the breakaway kit. "It is a battery in a box that mounts on the trailer," explains Craig Wilson, "and it contains a trickle charger so the battery is always operating at peak performance. If the trailer breaks away from the tow vehicle, a pin that is hooked to a cable or a lanyard is pulled out of the breakaway switch and the full current is applied to the trailer brakes from the battery." EZLoaders's Dave Thielman says the system has the ability in tests to hold the full weight of a trailer with a boat on an incline in place for up to ten minutes.



Electric brakes require no more maintenance than surge brakes and there is no specific upkeep for trailers using them. But flushing the brakes is an essential chore. "We do recommend installation of a freshwater flush kit," says Fulton's Wilson, "because this will extend the life of the brake components. We have a Freshwater Flush Kit that is hooked to a garden hose. Once in place, you just turn on the hose and the kit flushes salt and sand and debris away from the brakes. I think it's required stuff whether you use hydraulic or electric brakes."



breakaway. This will need routine lubrication with a small amount of marine grease once a year. But as is the case with any brake maintenance, keep the grease away from exposed brake shoes.



There are a number of boat trailer builders who want nothing to do with electric brakes---for the time being. "We're not going to touch them, until I see something that shows me they are safe," says one trailer-manufacturing president who asked his name not be used. For others, like EZLoader's Dave Thielman, there is awareness that electric brakes have an image problem in the general public. "To some degree," he says, "it's a battle to re-educate people about electricity and water. We have a product that has been tested, re-tested and used in all kinds of conditions on the road. It works extremely well. It is just going to take some time." In Canada, trailers with a gross weight of 10,000 pounds are required to have electric brakes.



One thing is sure: when it comes to electric brakes, both Dave Thielman and Craig Wilson have no plans on being stopped."
 

captmello

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Joined
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Re: Adding an axle

FWIW - you are required to have brakes on all axles in MN if you are over 3K

One more note for the OP. Try expanding your search area a bit, I usually see a pontoon trailer or 2 for sale when I'm at the lake place in Amery. Are you looking for a bunk trailer or scissor trailer?

Thanks for both responses. I'm a bit surprised that the one dealer I spoke with was ready to sell me an illegal trailer with brakes on only one axle.:grumpy: I have never bought anything from them however, and will continue to do so.

Funny you mention Amery, the trailer I was considering was in rice lake. the guy wanted to trade his bunk for a scissor. He never got back to me and the add is missing. I doubt I would have done it however because of the excess work of adding the axle, etc. Plus I've never had good luck with used trailers. I may just buy new. I plan to use it for many years.

I'll be buying a bunk style soon, provided my spring project works out, adding a third log to my toon. but if your in that area and see something in the next couple weeks send a pm Can't hurt to look. thanks again!
 

captmello

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Joined
Jun 30, 2008
Messages
3,848
Re: Adding an axle

Trailering Club - Trailering Magazine Archives

"Electric Brakes
An Idea Showing No Signs of Stopping

Well, hummm, would you suggest I look for an ezloader dealer and pursue a trailer with electric brakes? I know the rental industry doesn't like them because not everyone is wired for them.

I'll check around and see if anyone has ezloader electric brake trailers and see what I can find. This is a bit off topic but...
 

oldjeep

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May 17, 2010
Messages
6,455
Re: Adding an axle

I'm a bit surprised that the one dealer I spoke with was ready to sell me an illegal trailer with brakes on only one axle.:grumpy: I have never bought anything from them however, and will continue to do so.

It is pretty common to find them with brakes on only 1 near the border since WI only requires them on a single axle. Truth is that nobody would ever know ;)

As for electric brakes, I've never seen them on a boat trailer in MN. No reason that they wouldn't work, but I would expect to pay a premium for them.

I'll keep an eye out, have to run over there and pick up my boat in 3 weeks or so. Most of the trailers that I've seen for sale have been scissor trailers and that is what we have for my dads pontoon.
 
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