Advice please! Fiberglass boat hull hole patch (pics)

[oops!]

Re: Advice please! Fiberglass boat hull hole patch (pics)

i dont really have time to go into detail..... yd has good points.

but all i really did is give him a layup schedule close to the one on the first page of this post.

be back soon.....i have a gellcoat meeting via internet in a few seconds....

carry on guys !

 

[Truefire]

Re: Advice please! Fiberglass boat hull hole patch (pics)

I have been feathering around the interior portion of this hole as well as the exterior. The photo below is underneath the boat looking upwards.

I have gotten it a little thin here and i stopped to inquire as to whether or not i should continue to remove the gelcoat, i guess that is what the white substance is here, not quite sure. I was wondering if i had to remove all of this completely around the hole's perimeter to obtain a good bond with polyester?

Or could i simply feather lightly in this area, leaving portions of the white and eventually lay mat/cloth onto it and obtain a good lively bond?

Thanks, Chris

 

[Yacht Dr.]

Re: Advice please! Fiberglass boat hull hole patch (pics)

#1. Tip = Leave the holes on the bottom of boats to Pros ...

#2. advice = If you ignore rule #1 then by all means research..research..and more important.. RESEARCH ! This is not a cosmetic repair and I for one would take this repair in the utmost Serious manor.

#3. Concern = Your " router " cut is in my opinion kinda close to your stringer for repair localized in that compartment. I can guess that the repair is directly in line with your trailer bunks...short repairs at stringer locations bouncing down the road could be a possible failure point in the future.

IMHO.. use Vinyl Ester Resin and 1708 and 1.5 oz mat ( from the looks of things you have about 3/8" - 1/2" thickness and will require some serious grinding/beveling and lams ).

YD.

I knew this when I posted July 5th..

Your Hole goes right up to the stringer..so basically your going have to do 2 things here..

Cut out your stringer for your Proper Inside/outside repair... or .. The Other way..

You cannot Glass over gelcoat ( shouldnt at least ).

You Really need to have a Pro glasser Look at this rep man.. Tellin ya truth here.

YD.

 

[redfury]

Re: Advice please! Fiberglass boat hull hole patch (pics)

I'm gonna have to agree with Yacht Dr. on this one. It's not really going to matter how thin you make the glass on the outside. Even if the glass ends up being paper thin in spots, you are going to be bringing up the thickness back with new glass sandwiching that original glass in between it, which is going to help the overall strength of your repair.

Honestly, this is a very ambitious repair for a novice. Not to say that it can't be done...look what Oops did with the hull extension with little experience.

Yacht is right, and it's what Oops did with his...RESEARCH, and a knowledgeable eye ON SITE that can tell you what needs to be done to fix this the right way. You don't want to end up doing this again, ever..do you?

I think the red flag YD is throwing up with the location of the hole and the stringer is the most valid point that needs to be taken into consideration too. Lots of stress in this area.

Once you understand a little about how the boats structure works together, you'll understand more on why it's important to do this right. You don't want to end up with a stringer poking through the boat after hitting a good sized wave, because the strength of the boat was compromised by a poorly engineered repair.

 

[Truefire]

Re: Advice please! Fiberglass boat hull hole patch (pics)

Yeah i know all of this 'stuff', the boat isn't going to a so called pro, all of the lifting, hoisting and trailering that would be needed to make such a transition isn't going to occur, it isn't necessary. Also it sits solid up on blocks at this point. It is gonna stay where it is and get repaired on this site.

I may be a novice in fiberglassing per se, but this repair can certainly be done, i have constructed as well as repaired various repairs of a rather large magnitude in other capacities. Some doubted but ultimately it was completed.

In regards to the stringer coming through the bottom of the boat, which is doubtful, the stringer hasn't been disturbed in any manner neither has the material underneath it.

I appreciate the answer to my question in regards to whether or not the gelcoat needed to be completely removed. Thanks for that answer, but all of the other info doesn't help my situation neither did it address my single question.

I have researched and continue to do so.

 

[Yacht Dr.]

Re: Advice please! Fiberglass boat hull hole patch (pics)

Hello again Truefire..

We dont understand how your going to glass through and over your stringer...

You really have to glass that hole from inside and out.. It does not mean you hard 90 degree glass at your stringer.. you really should bevel and glass inside and out..

WE dont know how you can do this at/with a stringer from an edge..

It is unsafe and not in standard practace m8..

"I may be a novice in fiberglassing per se, but this repair can certainly be done, i have constructed as well as repaired various repairs of a rather large magnitude in other capacities. Some doubted but ultimately it was completed."

Please understand..Some of us here Know what Large is..and even Right way.. and this so far is not the Right way.. nor Large .

If you have to ask if the gelcoat has to be ground out before lams .. then Im subjectively going to say you Really dont know about the proper way to do structural repairs..and safety and reason would make me In Doubt of your abilities as Safely repairing your boat ( or just buy and flip ).

Im again.. out of this resto.. Good luck I cannot continue on this thread for conscious sake... peace ..

YD.

 

[Woodonglass]

Re: Advice please! Fiberglass boat hull hole patch (pics)

"You really have to glass that hole from inside and out.. It does not mean you hard 90 degree glass at your stringer.. you really should bevel and glass inside and out..

WE dont know how you can do this at/with a stringer from an edge.."

I too, question how you are going to correctly bevel and glass with that stringer in the way. I also agree that the Gell MUST be completely removed before the outside repairs can begin. The advice that OOPS gave concerning 3 layers of 1708 was spot on. You will need the same on the outside as well. At the very least I believe you need to cut the stringer and then scab it back in when the repair is accomplished. This is a common practice and would be no problem to accomplish.

What ever you decide to do, I wish you luck. Just please but safety first, that's all any of us can ask.

I'm just sayin...

 

[Mark42]

Re: Advice please! Fiberglass boat hull hole patch (pics)

Cut away more hull so the stringer is fully exposed on each side (port and starboard). Make a multi-layer patch the size of the hole. Glass in the bottom of the stringer. Epoxy the patch to the bottom of the stringer. Feather the edge of the patch top and bottom, and glass in. The few inches of area at the leading and trailing edge of the stringer where it passes over feathered area is not a big issue at all. Glass it all in from above, feather and glass it all in from below. You will be good. Go boating.

 

[Yacht Dr.]

Re: Advice please! Fiberglass boat hull hole patch (pics)

Cut away more hull so the stringer is fully exposed on each side (port and starboard). Make a multi-layer patch the size of the hole. Glass in the bottom of the stringer. Epoxy the patch to the bottom of the stringer. Feather the edge of the patch top and bottom, and glass in. The few inches of area at the leading and trailing edge of the stringer where it passes over feathered area is not a big issue at all. Glass it all in from above, feather and glass it all in from below. You will be good. Go boating.

Cutting away to expose both sides .. feathering/beveling the outside..making a form on the inside..glassing the outside..then glassing the inside is a dooable thing.. but.. Its also suggesting Cutting A Bigger hole..

For me.. that seems like an awfull lot of grinding ( and a bigger hole ) .. Just thinking out lou..type. Peace.

YD.

 

[Truefire]

Re: Advice please! Fiberglass boat hull hole patch (pics)

I have removed the deck flooring to gain access to this hole and have removed the segment of the stringer that was in this vicinity.

So here you can see the segment of the stringer that has been removed as well as the tapering to the hole edge and cleaning thereof to prepare for glassing

As you can see, on one end of the hole i was unable to gain access underneath the decking to remove portions of the stringer on this end of the hole. So instead, I ground a slit underneath the remaining portion whereby i was able to glass up underneath the remaining segment far enough to obtain a good bond in this region.

View of the underside of the hull showing the aftermath of my sanding/tapering/prep work which extends approximately 7-8" beyond the opening in it's entirety

Next i cut a piece of cardboard to fit the hole, wrapped it in wax paper to prevent adherence of resins and to prevent the first layer from protruding downwards through this opening

 

[Truefire]

Re: Advice please! Fiberglass boat hull hole patch (pics)

I then laid the first layer of 1708 biaxial cloth over this opening and the cardboard, however i only wet-out the edges in resin first so that i would not have an overload of weight on this cardboard thus possibly creating collapse under the load and allowing the fiberglass patch to sag.

Then i cut three more layers to be lain on top of this one layer already lain - so four pieces of 1708 in this area thus far. Each layer is larger than its predecessor to allow for a good bond and strength

Just a sample of 4 pieces of cloth sandwiched tightly together revealing that these four layers amount to a tad-bit more than an 1/8" thickness thus far

After all of the four pieces had been wet-out and installed into place

I will keep you guys posted of new work as it progresses along.

Chris

 

[oops!]

Re: Advice please! Fiberglass boat hull hole patch (pics)

looks good chris.

in the futuer when doing a hole like that.....wet out the hole thing and glass it...dont leave an inner dry spot....the edges will tend to curl and you will have a bumpy finish and also have air.
when you glass you chase the air with your resin roller.....if you are chasing into a hardend wall of resin....it makes for a mouch tougher job........as far as the bump on the bottom you were worried about.......you can just fair that off after cure when you start the exterior portion of the repair.

but you are looking good......add a full wrap of 1708 over the whole shabang with a large over lap and you are done !

cheers
oops

 

[Yacht Dr.]

Re: Advice please! Fiberglass boat hull hole patch (pics)

Thats a lot of air trapped in there..do you have some better pics of the Inside Final lams please.

Outside lams have to be better than that ( get a bubble roller ). You cant do glass with just a Brush !

YD.

 

[fmorale4]

Re: Advice please! Fiberglass boat hull hole patch (pics)

think about as if it were sheetrock .you can do anything with glass. cut out the piece of stringer sand the inside take a piece of masonite
screw it from the outside with sheetrock screws sand the screws off from the inside and glass away. after its dry remove the masonite and sand off the gelcoat 6-10 in. and pack on the glass . the more even you get it the less sanding. "dont forget to clean everything with acetone before glassing"

 

[Yacht Dr.]

Re: Advice please! Fiberglass boat hull hole patch (pics)

think about as if it were sheetrock .you can do anything with glass. cut out the piece of stringer sand the inside take a piece of masonite
screw it from the outside with sheetrock screws sand the screws off from the inside and glass away. after its dry remove the masonite and sand off the gelcoat 6-10 in. and pack on the glass . the more even you get it the less sanding. "dont forget to clean everything with acetone before glassing"

Um..NO..

Think of this as A HOLE in your boat .. make it safe !! If you dont understand the complexity of a HOLE in your boat ( Via this Forum or others ) then take it to a Pro and have them do it.

Armchair Fiberglassers are a dime a dozen ( I have not personally seen Anything on Ytube that will tell you how to do a Structural Repair !! ) .. I may be mistaken ..

YD.

 

[Truefire]

Re: Advice please! Fiberglass boat hull hole patch (pics)

Thats a lot of air trapped in there..do you have some better pics of the Inside Final lams please.

Outside lams have to be better than that ( get a bubble roller ). You cant do glass with just a Brush !

YD.

After the sheets of fiberglass were laid down and brushed into place, i used an 8" plastic, hardened edge scraper to run the air bubbles out of the the layering. I did this as each layer was being laid in place.

One of you mentioned using a roller, what type of roller exactly are you talking about, resins and select rollers will certainly not cooperate well together. I feel like with the 8" hardened edge of the plastic scraper, that i was able to chase most all of the air out between the layers and obtain the best bond i could without some sort of vacuum system being used.

There were two very minute spots that i was concerned about after the cure that were noticeably, slightly raised. They were both about the size of a quarter. I grinded down through that one top layer, opening up this concerned area, sanded the edges of this new area and will be laying on top of it to strengthen it all.

I still have to put a few more layers in here then moving on the stringer repair.

What type of roller would you suggest to squeegee out the air between the layers, i just cannot envision a napped roller creating enough surface tension to move the air as the scraper is able to generate.

However, i certainly do not know everything and I am sure there may be one specifically designed for this job that i am not aware of, please advise.

Chris

 

[Woodonglass]

Re: Advice please! Fiberglass boat hull hole patch (pics)

They are called bubble buster rollers. Make sure and have a tray of acetone on hand to keep it soaking or you'll ruin it. Or you can make your own out of a regular 4" roller arm and some 1/4" and 3/4" fender washers and a 1/4" end cap.

 

[Truefire]

Re: Advice please! Fiberglass boat hull hole patch (pics)

Woodonglass, thanks a million. Now that is what i am talking about, a man that brings the answer i am looking for right to the drawing table. Thanks a million.

Chris

 

[Truefire]

Re: Advice please! Fiberglass boat hull hole patch (pics)

What type of finishing cloth would you guys recommend on the underside of this patch on this 15' center console? Weight,type,etc;?

I am patching with 1708 biaxial cloth using polyester resin. I need something that will be compatible with that patchwork and will be good for a petit easypoxy paint job.

Could anyone expound about the differences between e cloth and s cloth? and possibly which one would be a good one for my application and why?

Thanks

Chris