Another prospect in my search.

[bigkahuna427]

I have been searching for a boat and found a 21' Bayliner Walk Around Cuddy Cabin. This is a 1983 Trophy with with the AQ131 aluminum head overhead cam closed cooling system engine. I just took a ride to see it and there was a lot I liked about it. First off let me say I am a mechanic.

What I could see under the deck and bilge area looked really solid as far as transom and stringers. It has stereo, garmin GPS, fish finder and I am told the trim tabs and stern drive lift work good as well as bilge and blower. The cuddly looked real dry with useable cushions in decent shape. The current owners used it in a fresh water river above the dam. Never been bottom painted and the outdrive looks like it has little salt water use.

This guy had quite a few repairs planned so has a bunch of parts. For the trailer he has all the u-bolts and fasteners, new springs, shackles, bushings, rollers. It is the heavy Load Rite galvanized trailer and looks good except for the parts he already has. The tires are weather cracked so it does need 4 new tires.

For the boat he has new stern drive bellows, water neck, raw water impeller and a few other things I cannot think of at the moment. The oil pan has some rusty scale on it and he has a replacement although he said it did not leak. It has been sitting for three years and currently has no spark. I am going down again this week to see if I can get it to run. I am hoping to connect the fuel pump to a can file the points an see it run, (hoping). The engine was winterized and fogged before putting up. The engine oil is brand new and does not even need a change. The antifreeze nice and green with no oil. The hour meter was at 1700 hours. I have in my head that maybe I can get it running after cleaning tank and carbs, new batteries and bilge. MAYBE do a trial run if there is not anything that is keeping me out of the water. On a slip or mooring I could get the trailer work done. Then pull the motor, oil pan, reseal, check bearings, oil pump maybe do a head gasket and certainly the timing belt. All easy stuff when in an engine stand.

I have done little research on this engine but am very familiar with it from the 1980s Volvo cars.

What are the inherent issues with this engine?

It has the 270 outdrive. Is this the correct one for this engine? What little research I have done most are AQ131 and 275 outdrive.

It probably puts out around 120 to 130HP seems like a small motor for a boat this sized. The owner and I did talk about speed and what it takes to keep it up on plane. He said it does need to be wound up pretty good to stay on plane. Any thought on fuel efficiency or speed and staying on plane at cruise for this combination?

The V near the transom is not as deep as I would like to see but this boat is a far far better value than the 1970s Grady Whites I have been looking at. It is priced very very reasonable for what is there. It is sort of a wife says it has to go situation. It has poor photos and description online. I thought I was going down to look at a scow but glad I went. I want to grab this before I get scooped. Please give me your thoughts!

 

[Walt T]

It probably has a small prop and it probably runs 4000 rpm+ to stay on plane at 25 mph or so. Fuel efficiency is 2-3 mpg for pretty much all boats. It's a good baseline anyway. You're a mechanic, you already understand how things work and you know you can figure it out. All those parts are not difficult. Buy a manual and you'll be fine. I worked heavy trucks and construction equipment when I bought my first boat. Now I give advice on forums. Incorrect advice but advice nontheless.
Closed cooling is a plus. The Volvo drive is a standard drive used in millions of boats. Parts are easy to get all over the net. If you don't mind wrenching on it and working 8 hours for 1 hour of boating, yelling at the wife on the boat ramp, losing money on it until the divorce settlement ends up with you both paying each other, hey go for it! Boating is so much fun!

 

[bigkahuna427]

Walt T,
The wife is gone and I kind of like projects. 1700 hours at 4000 RPMs is working it. I hear you about working or fishing. This looks to me like a decent well maintained boat that needs some TLC but very well worth it. I am thinking if I go through it I may get out and back OK IE it will be reliable. What can you guys tell about this engine??

 

[captmello]

The AQ131 didn't come into use until around 1986ish, along with the 275 outdrive you mentioned. They were still using the AQ125's back in 1983. The motors are similar and interchangeable but the 131 wouldn't have been original. If you post a pick of the engine, I could tell if its a 125 or a 131 as the heat exchangers are different.. 1700 hours is a lot of hours imo, but who knows if the motor has been swapped. Overall I would not be afraid of the motor. They are not a liability. However those old trophy's are too big for the motor like Walt mentioned but Bayliner didn't seem to care. I like those hulls but would be tempted to put my 350 in it.
Old boats are a gamble, if you can get it running and do a compression test, you'll be that much further ahead before buying it. As you know the AQ131 has a timing belt and a tensioner that can go bad. Good thing is, the auto replacement works fine for these items.

Let us know what happens.

 

[bigkahuna427]

The guy said it was an AQ120 as soon as I lifted the cover I knew it wasn't. I looked at some engine pics online and yes Captmello is correct AQ125. Looking at the front of the engine the raw water strainer was on the left of the exchanger as I recall.

The boat I think is a 1983 Bayliner 2060 Trophy Fish. Underpowered was my first impression too. I have found information that would suggest this 2700 pound boat should do about 30 MPH at 4500 to 4800 RPMs. If I can back off the throttle and keep it on plane at 20 to 25 MPH I would be happy.

In a day or two I am going to make a trip there to see if she will run.

I did find locally an AQ120 that came out of a 74 Glastron the guy is willing to sell me the motor and I think a 270 outdrive for $100. I am thinking I should just snag that just for the outdrive and maybe I can sell the motor and or parts.

 

[captmello]

Well, now we know its most likely the original motor with a lot of hours worked hard in that big boat. If the motor runs with good compression...who knows.

FYI, the Aq120 wasn't around in 74. Its most likely an AQ!30, totally different pushrod motor. the outdrive may be ok. Let us know wat happens.

 

[jerryjerry05]

They made thousands of those 21's with the 125/131 and both 270/275 drive.
I had a friend who owned one and he fished it a LOT!!!
Not too hard on fuel and only as dependable as the maint. that's been done.

I wouldn't hesitate to buy one for myself.
Not gonna be real fast.

The high rpm.s to stay up on plane. Not really.
The right prop on these boats is necessary, aftermarket usually ends up with poor performance.

 

[bigkahuna427]

Yeah I have my engines all mixed up push rod engines are the AQ170 B30 and AQ>>> B20.

 

[bigkahuna427]

It seems every boat in my price range I am going to look at is going to have some issues. It is not where you start on the price it is where you finish. Another boat I looked at was a Wellcraft V20 with the bad press or bad rap 470 Mercruiser 3.7 that had the common issues addressed. How does that boat compare to the Bayliner 2060 with the AQ125? I know the Bayliners are considered cheap boats but for the year this one really looks good to me.

 

[jerryjerry05]

I'd buy the dreaded Mercruiser 470
I had one and sold it to family(nuff said).
I love them.Great power to weight ratio.
Once the "problems" were fixed they are really good motors.
Most "problems" were the camshaft seal would eat the end of the cam and it would leak antifreeze into the oil.
And the riser to manifold gasket was defective.By now these probably have been fixed.
Great running motor.
The Volvo drive is a far better unit than the Mercruiser but the Mercruiser is a good unit.
The Volvo is way more expensive to buy parts.

 

[bigkahuna427]

I have been there to look at boat again. Once I had a charged battery and the engine cranking I took a fuel sample. Found no water but certainly stale fuel. I did feel it would run with that fuel but not well. I initially had no spark and had no power to the coil. Filed the points, hot wired the coil and dumped a little gas down the carb. The engine wanted to start and finally did but was pre-igniting and cranking hard like the timing was too far advanced. The engine ran on all four cylinders and was not noisy. I did not run it long as the raw water was not pumping. The engine needs fresh fuel, a carb clean, points, condenser and one plug wire. The oil is so clean I would not even change it. My guess is it never ran well when these guys were using it. Certainly with the pre-ignition it would have had a hard start condition and probably pinging or detonation. I am pretty sure she will run well as it is all in the tune.

The wiring needs some attention as I do not like some of the prior work. It does come with a GPS, VHF, stereo and a fish finder all stuff he bought three years ago. He also has parts to do projects he was planning like trailer springs and rollers, the boots for the stern drive, the water neck on the stern drive, belts for the engine, 2 impellers and some assorted stuff the prior owner gave hime with the boat. All of this for $1500.

There is two spots on the hull that had me concerned. Where the front roller sets sit on the hull there is a depression on both sides at one of the rollers. The hull is pushed in 1/2" or more. Feeling around as I move my hand outwards there are some cracks. These cracks were not huge and I could not get a fingernail into them but they were there. It seemed like right where the stringer might be the hull was bent over the stringer and that is where the cracks were. His comment was maybe the trailer was never set up right. He was suggesting the rollers should be at the stringers which sort of made sense to me. On the front sets of rollers there are 4 rollers per side. In looking at the photo in my first post it does seem like there is a good amount of weight on those four rollers and one keel roller. What do you guys think about that? Perhaps it needs a different roller set front to spread out the load more or am I looking at a soft spot on the bottom of the hull?

 

[Maclin]

A deformed fiberglass hull, no way man.

 

[bigkahuna427]

It is the inboard roller not a good pic and I hope it actually uploaded here.

 

[bigkahuna427]

So, are you saying I should cut the hull up with a chainsaw and throw it away?

 

[Maclin]

If this is directed at me, I only meant don't buy it.

 

[bigkahuna427]

The boat did not have a hook as I understand a hook. It did a deformation in the hull near the front from a trailer roller. I ended up not buying the boat as I just was not sure I would have liked it when done.

 

[jerryjerry05]

The hull might go back to it's original shape after it's off the trailer.
The Bayliner was never loaded onto a roller trailer from the factory.
Only the bigger ones used the rollers.
If the trailer wasn't set up right???
They all used bunk trailers.
To test for a weak spot.
A small hammer with a hard plastic head.
You start tapping around the spot and tap through the spot and see if the tapping noise changes in pitch or sound.