Any thoughts on a brand new 2010 merc/tohatsu 25hp sea pro

[boater1234]

Re: Any thoughts on a brand new 2010 merc/tohatsu 25hp sea pro

So in other words the less complicated the system the better it is.Plus less to go wrong.Well to throw more fire to the mix i found a brand new 2005 usa model that has never had a drop of gas or oil in it for $2495obo at a marina but there is no warranty as it was bought and never used by a fellow.Talk about hard to find.I went and checked out the motor,it still has the original tags and everything on it.Not a scratch on her.This is the regular version not the sea pro.This has the shifter in the handle.He said he would take $2300 cash for it,that is almost $600 cheaper then the sea pro and almost $1000 cheaper then the etec and still some what old school i guess you would say.She is a beauty.The yr warranty i will get on the sea pro will be useless anyway as it will outlive the first yr with no problems more then likely.So i do like the etec but you make alot of sense with new technology comes a greater risk of things going wrong.But what in your opinion do you think about the usa model merc compared to the other 2?What would you go with between the 2 mercs,money aside.That would be hard to pass up for $2300 wouldn't you think.

 

[TOHATSU GURU]

Re: Any thoughts on a brand new 2010 merc/tohatsu 25hp sea pro

Personally, I was raised that Mercury's were always the fastest outboards that you could get...If you could ever get one to run When they went to foreign manufacturer I felt that was a huge step up.(that's an opinion) Having said that, the domestic 2-stroke 25 wasn't a bad engine. I would still take a Suzuki, Yamaha or Tohatsu of the same vintage over it, but only because I'm a Jap mark

 

[boater1234]

Re: Any thoughts on a brand new 2010 merc/tohatsu 25hp sea pro

That is funny you say that about the merc running as every merc i have ever owned ran great unless the carb was gummed up,other then that bulletproof.Would you take the usa model over the canada model for the price difference?Also i like i said i don't think the warranty would come into play either way as i would only get a yr with the usa model if it were still covered.I have never owned a 25hp motor so this is tricky for me.Also the sea pro is the old tohatsu model,it just has different decals.Well i will see if i can work this guy over at the marina a little more.I think if i walk in there with like $2100 or $2200 cash he will move it as it has been there for a while.The motor has never been ran and is not a rebuild,it was bought by a guy and amazingly he never ran it one time and is spotless.He had it for 5 yrs and it sat in the box imagine that.Well i will see what happens.I am getting some money here in 2 weeks so i will have a few weeks to decide.I would of thought you would of pushed the sea pro as it is a tohatsu according to the guy at small outboards.Oh well like everyone says i guess you can't lose either way as their all new just different prices.The etec is def an amazing machine though.Plus you get a 5yr warranty that is hard to beat.To many choices.The suzuki is nice to with the v2 setup.I guess what i need is the motor with the most out of the hole shot i can get as top end will be close on all of them i would think.

 

[JimS123]

Re: Any thoughts on a brand new 2010 merc/tohatsu 25hp sea pro

Not really...It's more like which is more reliable, a chain saw or an axe?. The etec isn't as reliable as it is a much more complicated system. It's a better system in terms of the performance, but that does come at the price of reliability. The Tohatsu TLDI system is a DFI like the etec. It's not as reliable as the old school carb models either. It's not about brand loyalty, it's about system failures on a more advanced system that is a lot more complicated.

I see your point, but I still stick to my opinion that the long term verdict isn't in yet since the Etec doesn't have enough history behind it. All the people I've talked to can't say enough good about it and so far no issues at all. Your experience may be different.

My classic Evinrude is old-school and 100% reliable. It's 57 years old and has never let me down. But, its noisy, smells bad and uses gas like there is no tomorrow. The points and plugs need replacing way too often. My old classic Pontiac also runs like a top and has also never let me down either. But it also uses way too much gas - at least it doesn't stink or make noise....LOL. My old jetski is a total PITA and breaks down constantly. It's old school too.

In contrast, my new-school car with a newfangled computer and catalytic converter runs even better than the classic, better mileage, etc., etc. It hasn't let me down either, and it has double the mileage as the classic. My new E-Tec jetski runs circles around the old jetski, has NEVER broken down and has been bulletproof, even though its MPEG and other computerized parts are a miracle of science.

So, just because its new technology doesn't mean it will have poorer reliability. Sure, the more complicated the systems, the more "potential" for problems. But if we don't embrace new technology we won't get better performance either.

 

[JimS123]

Re: Any thoughts on a brand new 2010 merc/tohatsu 25hp sea pro

That is funny you say that about the merc running as every merc i have ever owned ran great unless the carb was gummed up,other then that bulletproof..

Mercs made during the classic age of the outboard were faster than the competition simply because they cheated! You usually got more HP than what you paid for. They were so unreliable simply because of poor engineering.

The newer Mercs are more reliable because once the HP standards were set by the industry, they had to improve their product or get run over by OMC.

If you found a nos USA Merc for a grand cheaper, then your problem is solved - now a no-brainer.

 

[boater1234]

Re: Any thoughts on a brand new 2010 merc/tohatsu 25hp sea pro

Yea jim i stumbled on the 2005 merc on craigslist.It is at a marina,so i went and looked at it since it was somewhat close.Unbelivablely the motor has never been used.It's the merc with the red decals,the classic they would call it.400cc's of raw power.Even know i have been looking at the etec more and more how can i pass a deal up for a new 25hp 2stroke that is in such high demand for around $2300.It amazes me how no one else has sucked it up.It is also on a boat so maybe people don't know they will seperate the boat and motor.I found the etec for $2895 as it went up the from the last time i spoke to the guy as the 2010 models are gone so this would be a 2011 motor fresh off the line.The price difference between the merc and the etec is around $800 when it's all said and done but one has a 5yr warranty and one has none.But the likley hood of something going wrong with any new motor is slim to none but it does happen.I have a little over a week to decide what to do,so i will think about it.If the merc is still there then i will persue it,if not then i will just wait it out.

 

[TOHATSU GURU]

Re: Any thoughts on a brand new 2010 merc/tohatsu 25hp sea pro

That is funny you say that about the merc running as every merc i have ever owned ran great unless the carb was gummed up,other then that bulletproof.Would you take the usa model over the canada model for the price difference?Also i like i said i don't think the warranty would come into play either way as i would only get a yr with the usa model if it were still covered.I have never owned a 25hp motor so this is tricky for me.Also the sea pro is the old tohatsu model,it just has different decals.Well i will see if i can work this guy over at the marina a little more.I think if i walk in there with like $2100 or $2200 cash he will move it as it has been there for a while.The motor has never been ran and is not a rebuild,it was bought by a guy and amazingly he never ran it one time and is spotless.He had it for 5 yrs and it sat in the box imagine that.Well i will see what happens.I am getting some money here in 2 weeks so i will have a few weeks to decide.I would of thought you would of pushed the sea pro as it is a tohatsu according to the guy at small outboards.Oh well like everyone says i guess you can't lose either way as their all new just different prices.The etec is def an amazing machine though.Plus you get a 5yr warranty that is hard to beat.To many choices.The suzuki is nice to with the v2 setup.I guess what i need is the motor with the most out of the hole shot i can get as top end will be close on all of them i would think.

The reason I didn't push the Tohatsu is that I don't push anything. It simply doesn't matter to me what anyone buys. The only reason I post here or on any forum is to correct falsehoods or to provide a fact or two. Too many people simply say crap that isn't based on anything....Not even their own experience. I like Tohatsu's. I also like Suzuki, Yamaha, Evinrude and to some extent, Honda. Mercury is hard to love simply because I'm old enough to have had enough bad experiences with them in the 60's and 70's that I am a little prejudiced against them now. It's unfair of me, Especially since I am a dealer for them. Their own domestic production engines are as good as anyone else's...I just don't love them

 

[TOHATSU GURU]

Re: Any thoughts on a brand new 2010 merc/tohatsu 25hp sea pro

I see your point, but I still stick to my opinion that the long term verdict isn't in yet since the Etec doesn't have enough history behind it. All the people I've talked to can't say enough good about it and so far no issues at all. Your experience may be different.

My classic Evinrude is old-school and 100% reliable. It's 57 years old and has never let me down. But, its noisy, smells bad and uses gas like there is no tomorrow. The points and plugs need replacing way too often. My old classic Pontiac also runs like a top and has also never let me down either. But it also uses way too much gas - at least it doesn't stink or make noise....LOL. My old jetski is a total PITA and breaks down constantly. It's old school too.

In contrast, my new-school car with a newfangled computer and catalytic converter runs even better than the classic, better mileage, etc., etc. It hasn't let me down either, and it has double the mileage as the classic. My new E-Tec jetski runs circles around the old jetski, has NEVER broken down and has been bulletproof, even though its MPEG and other computerized parts are a miracle of science.

So, just because its new technology doesn't mean it will have poorer reliability. Sure, the more complicated the systems, the more "potential" for problems. But if we don't embrace new technology we won't get better performance either.

And in ten years their will be definitive proof one way or another In the mean time I will maintain that the axe is more reliable than the chainsaw

 

[boater1234]

Re: Any thoughts on a brand new 2010 merc/tohatsu 25hp sea pro

Sorry tohatsu guru i didn't mean pushing me into it like you should buy that because it's the best.What i meant was because you have had alot of experience with tohatsus and know that if you kinda talked me into buying the sea pro that i was getting the best product for the money.I know what your saying about eveyone has there brand of motor that they just hate and had nothing but trouble with.I just have never had trouble with any of them besides a bowrider boat i bought about 15yrs ago and it had a 55hp suzuki on it.I had no clue what to look for in buying an outboard then and the motor was shot to crap when i bought it and did not know it.I also have had 2 problems with 2 evinrudes,other then that the only problems i have ever had was the carb being gummed up.

Question is a 25hp 2005 usa model merc with the shifter in the handle made by tohatsu also?Also do you think an unused brand new 2005 25hp merc is worth $2300 with no warranty.The motor has never been started and has the original tags on it.Also i have been looking at some reviews on the etec and it seems that there is a flaw that i think they fixed but i'm not for sure.It is the top of the oil reservoir that leaks i have read.Other then that i have heard nothing but good reports.

 

[TOHATSU GURU]

Re: Any thoughts on a brand new 2010 merc/tohatsu 25hp sea pro

"Question is a 25hp 2005 usa model merc with the shifter in the handle made by tohatsu also"

Not if it is a two-stroke.

"Also do you think an unused brand new 2005 25hp merc is worth $2300 with no warranty"

Nope.

"Also i have been looking at some reviews on the etec and it seems that there is a flaw that i think they fixed but I'm not for sure"

There was a production/engineering problem on the first ones that were sent to the U.S. Evinrude sent a few out, discovered the problem and then stopped the release until they fixed them. I remember that there was also an update or two on software that required the return of the engines back to the dealer....I might be wrong on that though. Seahorse could probably answer that that with definitive authority.

 

[boater1234]

Re: Any thoughts on a brand new 2010 merc/tohatsu 25hp sea pro

Ok tohatsu guru you got me all confused now.How can a merc/tohatsu sea pro with a 1yr warranty be worth $2595+tax which would be almost $2800,but a 2005 25hp merc that is brand new with no warranty is almost $500 less and you don't think it's worth it.You know as well as i do the yr warranty will almost not likely come into play as it will survive well past the yr warranty.The usa model has a better gear ratio at 2.25 compared to a 1.92 which equals better torque if i'm not mistaken.The cc's is slighly different as the usa model has 400cc's and the sea pro has 430cc's.So i guess that would mean a hair bit more top end if i'm not mistaken,also please correct me if i'm wrong on this.I just can't see how a yr warranty is worth $500.I just want to know why you don't think it's worth it as it is brand new.[not even started up once].

You want to hear something crazy[since the yamaha 2strokes are so hard to find the dealers who have a few are just jacking the prices up through the roof.I mean i saw a 25hp manual start for $3500+tax,thats nuts,you only get a 2yr warranty there.So i would think a new merc would be worth $2300 even without a warranty.I am probally going to go that route,hopefully he still has it.

 

[JimS123]

Re: Any thoughts on a brand new 2010 merc/tohatsu 25hp sea pro

If you buy a brand new 2011 motor and decide to sell it in 6 months, you get back nearly what you paid for it, minus 6 months depreciation. But, its still in the same model year.

If you buy the 2005 and decide to sell it the next day, you get crap back because its a 6 year old motor.

The dealer's profit here is way out of line. Find a 2005 price sheet, deduct dealer markup, deduct 15% because the warranty expired, and that's what its worth. Ask him to show you the receipt that shows what he gave the guy he bought it from....LOL. Its been titled and its a used motor, no matter whether its been run or not.

Personally, I like older antique stuff and don't mind paying more for it. My last boat cost $320 new and I paid $2200 for it. So, just buy the one you like and forget about the price. IMHO, warranties aren't worth the paper they're printed on anyway.

PS - don't forget that the 6 year oldie will need a new waterpump.

 

[TOHATSU GURU]

Re: Any thoughts on a brand new 2010 merc/tohatsu 25hp sea pro

Ok tohatsu guru you got me all confused now.How can a merc/tohatsu sea pro with a 1yr warranty be worth $2595+tax which would be almost $2800,but a 2005 25hp merc that is brand new with no warranty is almost $500 less and you don't think it's worth it.You know as well as i do the yr warranty will almost not likely come into play as it will survive well past the yr warranty.The usa model has a better gear ratio at 2.25 compared to a 1.92 which equals better torque if i'm not mistaken.The cc's is slighly different as the usa model has 400cc's and the sea pro has 430cc's.So i guess that would mean a hair bit more top end if i'm not mistaken,also please correct me if i'm wrong on this.I just can't see how a yr warranty is worth $500.I just want to know why you don't think it's worth it as it is brand new.[not even started up once].

You want to hear something crazy[since the yamaha 2strokes are so hard to find the dealers who have a few are just jacking the prices up through the roof.I mean i saw a 25hp manual start for $3500+tax,thats nuts,you only get a 2yr warranty there.So i would think a new merc would be worth $2300 even without a warranty.I am probally going to go that route,hopefully he still has it.

Old new is new...But, old. New new is new...And new. ( 6 x new ) IE A lot of what JimS123 said. Sales tax doesn't count as you are supposed to run down to your local tax collectors office and voluntarily pay your state's sales tax on anything used that you buy.

 

[boater1234]

Re: Any thoughts on a brand new 2010 merc/tohatsu 25hp sea pro

Well i understand that point of it being 6yrs old.But i buy and sell motors when i can get my hands on them belive it or not.I picked up a 1996 25hp merc that was exactly the same as this one.So that would make it 14yrs old when i sold it last yr.I paid $900 for it and sold it for $1800.If there is one thing i do know about motors is selling them and what i can get for them.The merc 25hp outboard is in so much demand i can get hi dollar for it no matter hold old it is within reason.I know you probally don't belive me and thats ok.But i never get the chance to run these motors as when i buy them they are usually gone within a day or 2.There is alot of money in 2 strokes right now especially ones that are in near mint condition.The difference in selling that 2010 25hp sea pro or the 2005 25hp merc would be almost the same.I just bought a 2005 j12 carolina skiff rig with a 2007 25hp yamaha tiller i was gonna keep,i threw it on craigslist for the heck of it to see what i could get.I bought it for $2500 so i figured if i got $3000 i would be happy.I didn't think it had a chance as i put it up for $3799obo just for the heck of it.I had a guy who wanted that yamaha so bad he bought the whole rig for $3500 just for the motor.

The biggest sellers period are 15hp 2strokes and 25hp 2strokes.They are in huge demand right now.People will take them no matter what they look like to as long as they run good.If i bought that sea pro i couldn't make any money,maybe close to breaking even.But i know for sure if i buy this 2005 merc and don't put any hrs on it i could make some money without a doubt.But the whole thing is i want that merc for me and don't have any plans to sell this motor for a long time as the opportunity to find one brand new like this may never happen again.I do understand were your coming from on resale but they would be so close in resale i'm not worried about that.I have sold over 50 motors in the past 2 yrs but like i said they don't last very long.I think the longest i have had one sit was like 5 days,all the other ones especially if it is a 15 or 25 are gone i mean fast.I don't make much on the other motors,like a few hundred here and there but the 15's and 25's is were you can make good money.The 9.9 is not to far behind.

I know the basics like checking the compression,making sure it has good water flow,good spark,make sure the lower unit oil is clean[no water],Then i make a decision.I get them home put new lower unit oil in them,new spark plugs,grease them up and away they go.I need to learn the ins and outs of the motors and i have bought some seloc books.I'm going to buy a cheap motor and tear it down and try to put it back together,also learn how to paint better.