At the gelcoat stage - help needed!!!

[Yacht Dr.]

Re: At the gelcoat stage - help needed!!!

Nope ..

I use a 6" porter cable and a 5" air Dynabrade DA. follow up with wetsanding the radi and the other surfaces.

The trick is the "guide coats". I use Dykem or a marker with an acetone rag. You will never go through if you use Guide Coats ( well.. not never but hardly ever ) .

Guide coats are your friend .. use them as much as you can in your heavy grits. Beyond 400 there kinda moot.

YD.

 

[morebass 17]

Re: At the gelcoat stage - help needed!!!

my hat is off to you morebass.. looks terrific, you'd surely pass a 2 inch inspection never mind 2 feet.

Thanks for the compliment mate, it should be a 2 inch finish once im done with it hopefully, Once I do the final buff we should see some improvement.

 

[morebass 17]

Re: At the gelcoat stage - help needed!!!

Managed to get the first coat of undercoat on yesterday, I was hoping to sand and apply the second coat today, but the sandpaper would just clog up too often, so obviously need another day at least to let the paint cure.

I'm using International Prekote as the undercoat and International Toplac as the finish, My first coat of prekote has loads of visible brush marks, Not so important on the undercoats as I sand it smooth after every coat but I just hope the Toplac self levels alot better than this Prekote.

I am applying the paint with a 4" closed cell foam roller and tipping off with a 3" high quality brush, but still getting brush marks. Has anyone had good experiences with the roll & tip method, and if so whats your technique ?, dont keep it a secret

 

[morebass 17]

Re: At the gelcoat stage - help needed!!!

I had to wait 4 days for the undercoat to be sandable, (not 24 hours that the spec sheet states) so a job that I was hoping to complete in just a few days will now take at least another 2 weeks.

The first coat of undercoat is now sanded smooth in preperation for the next coat, which will hopefully be done on Friday. The following coat will be done on sunday, allow these coats to cure for at least 5 days, then I will be ready to apply the top coats.

I am going to experiment with the undercoat and thin it down a little to see if this helps reducing the brush marks. Hope it does cause it was a nightmare to sand the first coat.

So another target has failed to be reached. Im getting used to it now though, but I will get there eventually. New target for the flip is set for 3 weeks time. Hopefully this time it goes to plan.

 

[morebass 17]

Re: At the gelcoat stage - help needed!!!

Well I managed to get another coat of undercoat on today. I thinned the paint down (approx 5%) with the recomended thinner. The first few square feet that I applied went on excellent, (the brush marks were dissapearing as soon as i tipped off. I have to give it a closer inspection tomorrow because it seemed as the more I painted the more visible the brush marks were.

I would normally blame this on the batch of paint I mixed was starting to thicken a little but strangely even the second batch of paint (7% thinner) would still leave the brush strokes. So I am thinking it may be the brush loading up and causing the problems.

For the next coat I am going to thin the paint even further possibly between 9-10% (interlux recomends a max of 10% thinners) and also try and prevent the brush from loading up.

I have heard of people saying they leave their brush dipped in the thinners when not in use to limit the amount the brush loads up, so I might try this too.

Next coat set for tomorrow morning, Hope I can master this tecnique before I start applying the finish.

 

[alligatorgars]

Re: At the gelcoat stage - help needed!!!

Please take no offense but Im still in shock over you putting paint over that great gel coat job. It might have needed a last spray over a few areas but otherwise wonderful work.

 

[oops!]

Re: At the gelcoat stage - help needed!!!

hi buddy.....its your paint.

i bought some stuff that just would not lay flat......even thinned at 25% it would just not lay down. used different paint.....and no problems

 

[morebass 17]

Re: At the gelcoat stage - help needed!!!

Please take no offense but Im still in shock over you putting paint over that great gel coat job. It might have needed a last spray over a few areas but otherwise wonderful work.

Thanks alligatorgars, dont worry I'm not painting over all of the gel, Just my color scheme. I was thinking about doing a two tone gel job as YD suggested, but with this being my first gel shoot, I didn't want to complicate things any further.

The paint I am using is a one part so it will probably only last 2 - 3 seasons before needing redone, When this happens I may just sand back down to the gel and shoot the color in gelcoat.

 

[morebass 17]

Re: At the gelcoat stage - help needed!!!

hi buddy.....its your paint.

i bought some stuff that just would not lay flat......even thinned at 25% it would just not lay down. used different paint.....and no problems

Yeah Oop's I was worried that was the problem, I'm hoping its just the undercoat that doesn't like to level out. If I experience the same problems with the finish, I will change the paint.

What paint have you had good experiences with Oop's, Do you have a favorite one part paint or are you a two part paint person?

 

[alligatorgars]

Re: At the gelcoat stage - help needed!!!

Ive noticed many in southern Louisiana do the repair -sell, repair -sell, repair -sell, until they hit the boat of their dreams. They always use plywood and paint never coosa/airexPXC board and gel coat (must be an economic thing). They use the boat for one season then move on. They always start off small and work their way up.

 

[Yacht Dr.]

Re: At the gelcoat stage - help needed!!!

Brushing ( rolling/tipping or rolling/rolling ) with paint is a talent.

Im sure on the bottom of the paint can it says " for professional use only ". ..

What brush are you using..what paint..are you prepping if needed ? ..

Things about Paint are different from Gel .. you have to follow Some guidelines. You can shoot and reduce some enamels that say you cant. But you have to know what your doing as a painter.

Brushing is a labor intensive way to go ( sometimes needed depending on location ).

YD.

 

[chriscraft254]

Re: At the gelcoat stage - help needed!!!

I just spent the last hour reading this thread. Awesome job morebass17!!! Awesome. Yacht Dr, your help and experience is top knotch. Great job guys, I am a huge fan of gel coat, I think it is much more durable than any paint imo.

 

[morebass 17]

Re: At the gelcoat stage - help needed!!!

Brushing ( rolling/tipping or rolling/rolling ) with paint is a talent.

Im sure on the bottom of the paint can it says " for professional use only ". ..

What brush are you using..what paint..are you prepping if needed ? ..

Things about Paint are different from Gel .. you have to follow Some guidelines. You can shoot and reduce some enamels that say you cant. But you have to know what your doing as a painter.

Brushing is a labor intensive way to go ( sometimes needed depending on location ).

YD.

Yeah YD , its a talent i dont seem to have, but with some more trial & error I should get an acceptable finish. as long as it lasts a couple of seasons untill I decide to gel my colour scheme ( want to make sure I am happy with the colour Ive picked )

The paint i'm using is marketed to diy'ers but obviously the more skillful you are the better the finish.

Im using interlux prekote for the undercoat and interlux toplac for the finish. interlux a.k.a. international. ( website yachtpaint.com )

I am using a 4" closed cell foam roller and tipping off with a purdy 3" brush, I have also tried a harris 3" brush but results are just the same.

On my most recent coat i mixed the prekote and toplac 50:50 and added 10% thinner. this combination seemed to level out alot better which is making me think the toplac on its own will level better still. At least I hope so.

Cheers YD

 

[morebass 17]

Re: At the gelcoat stage - help needed!!!

I just spent the last hour reading this thread. Awesome job morebass17!!! Awesome. Yacht Dr, your help and experience is top knotch. Great job guys, I am a huge fan of gel coat, I think it is much more durable than any paint imo.

Thanks chriscraft254. It would'nt have been possible if it wasn't for everyone here at iboats, so many times I think about giving up but its this forum that keeps me going, and the thought of letting all you guys down, thats not an option so even if it takes another 2 years , it will be done. stay tuned

And I agree with you that gelcoat is far more durable than paint, there is going to be some people who disagree with this but everyone to their own.

Thanks again chriscraft254

 

[morebass 17]

Re: At the gelcoat stage - help needed!!!

All going well I will be applying the finish coats over the weekend. Here is where I am at just now.

This is just the undercoat mixed 50:50 with the finish coat so the overall finish will be much darker and glossier. The final color is going to be a really dark blue, almost black.

on the third pic you will see the brush marks, but hopefully by the time i'm finished the brush marks will be gone. Fingers crossed.

 

[fishfeatures]

Re: At the gelcoat stage - help needed!!!

morebass ,

looks good ,

did you use pre kote ?? and then toplac or brightside?

I am currently choosing paint scheme and am looking at different types. You do seem to have a bit of trouble with brush strokes, would you recommend spraying as an alternative?

 

[morebass 17]

Re: At the gelcoat stage - help needed!!!

morebass ,

looks good ,

did you use pre kote ?? and then toplac or brightside?

I am currently choosing paint scheme and am looking at different types. You do seem to have a bit of trouble with brush strokes, would you recommend spraying as an alternative?

Thanks fishfeatures

Yes I'm using pre-kote and Toplac for the finish.

I originally thought of spraying but a couple of things put me off -

1. - Time - You have to let the prekote cure for a minimum of 14 days before spray applying Toplac.
2. - Surroundings - My garage isn't really an ideal place for spraying ( dust, temp, space factors )

I done a load of research to make sure I could get the results I wanted with rolling & tipping, and it is possible but maybe not with the paint system I am using. Still got my fingers crossed though.

The two negatives I listed about spraying isn't really valid points anymore -

1 - The 14 day cure was an issue when I followed the spec sheet for the paint, that stated the full process could be done in just a few days with the roll & tip method, but as I recently stated I had to wait 4 - 5 days before each coat was sandable compared to the 24 hours the spec sheet states. So negative 1 is not really a negative anymore if it turns out it has to be sprayed.

2 - My surroundings isn't really as much of an issue as I thought cause I have already managed to spray the full boat in my garage albeit with gelcoat, the only thing with gel is any dust stuck to the wet gel would be sanded off anyway compared to the finish on the paint were the dust would stay there. But If I dont get the results I'm looking for with the roll & tip then I will be spraying it, and just try to keep the dust down to a minimum.

Hopefully by monday my finish coats will be applied so I will know more then on what I have to do.

About your paint scheme - is it one or two part paint you are thinking of ?
will you be spraying or rolling & tipping ?

Please let me know the paint system you decide on and if you find the time post a pic of your results.

 

[fishfeatures]

Re: At the gelcoat stage - help needed!!!

i'll keep a close eye on your progress Morebass , as I am looking to rolling and tipping. I'm going with pre kote and then toplac as the main colour I'm using is only available in toplac and not the 2 pack perfection unfortunately.

 

[morebass 17]

Re: At the gelcoat stage - help needed!!!

I got my first of two finish coats on today. The Toplac with approx 7% thinner seemed to level out much better, there are still some brush strokes but they are not noticable from more than two feet away.

I have another problem now though, - DUST

I spent alot of time cleaning the garage to get rid of the majority of the dust, and all was going well untill i was cleaned up and ready to go, when I opened the garage door a big gust of wind came in and with it a pile of dust. So the front of my boat has a good few dust particles in it. Im hoping I can fix it though without sanding it all down again though.

I'll try and get some pics tomorow , I was going to take the pics today but I did'nt want to open that damn garage door again.

 

[morebass 17]

Re: At the gelcoat stage - help needed!!!

well here is the results of the first coat. Its still a bit patchy in some areas but im sure 1 more coat will do it. As you can see there is hardly any brush strokes and certainly none you can see from more than 2 feet away. I think once I tackle the dust problem I should get a n acceptable finish.

2nd coat tomorrow - more pics to follow.