Audio installation?

[Serge33]

Hi,

I'm new to this forum, so first off I'll introduce myself. My name is Serge, I'm a student and my interests are music (I play drums and keyboards), reading and boating. Isn't that cool to have a party on a boat, drinking champagne when girls are around?

I've got a brand new Glastron GT-205, and I'd like to tweak it a little bit. First, I'm thinking of installing a stereo system, but I'd like to start with a sub-woofer and depending on the installation outcome, I will (or will not) proceed further.

What really worries me is the wiring. How do you do that? What additional equipment (like amplifier) is required for a sub-woofer installation? What is the best place for it?

Thank you.

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: Audio installation?

the main problem with that is providing enough power to supply the equipment. multiple batteries. just follow the installation direction of the unit you are using. and find places big enough for the speakers, and places to hide the wires. it is best to use waterproof speakers.

personally, i have always gone to the auto junk yard, and bought my systems. you really only need enough stereo for the boat, not the whole lake. remember the people living on the water, and others on the water, do not necessarily like your choice of music.

 

[Serge33]

Re: Audio installation?

Thank you, but how do you do the wiring inside of the boat, so the cords are not visible?

 

[Silvertip]

Re: Audio installation?

Running wires in a boat requires that you examine the boat structure and run them wherever you can get through. In many cases you will need a "snake" that you push through the area you want to run the wires. You tie the wires to the snake and pull them through. Some boats have built-in "chases" or tubes that you can run the wires in. I'm with Tash on the sub woofer. Sound carries very easily over water. You will likely get some ugly responses from fishermen, other boaters, and residents if you start belting out the "boom boom". In my view you don't need a sub woofer on a boat.

 

[waterone1@aol.com]

Re: Audio installation?

This is a deep subject....sorry about the pun ! Seriously, to barely touch on a few issues, subwoofers require the right amount of amplifier power going to the right size speaker and just as importantly that speaker has to be in the right sized enclosure with the right porting. This space can be tricky to build into a boat of your size. My suggestion is to look at powered subwoofers or "bass tubes" that have the amp and crossover matched to the speaker in a tuned enclosure. Then see if you can find a location to mount this unit in your boat where it will stay dry.
As for the other issue : If you are cruising in the middle of the lake or river in broad daylight and not surrounded by cabins or other boats.....enjoy your music. But please.........when entering a marina or harbour or anywhere near cabins or other boats....turn the thing down !!! Don't forget, boat hulls, water and other boat hulls are great "drum heads".....bass will carry to other's like you wouldn't believe. We had fist fights at my marina this summer over this issue. Put a switch on the power lead to your subwoofer.....turn it OFF if you want to listen at night and others are around.

 

[Serge33]

Re: Audio installation?

Thanks for the tips! But still the wiring issue worries me... If you were me, would you bother to wire through the boat?

I should've mentioned in the initial post that I do understand the discomfort I may cause by excessive bass frequencies; however I normally have the rides weekdays, when I'm practically the only one on the river, and should it happen I play my music weekends, I'm always sensible to those who surround me.

 

[jevery]

Re: Audio installation?

When you say, ?I?m thinking of installing a stereo system.? I take that to indicate that you currently do not have a stereo in the boat. If that is the case then is your boat prewired with at least a power lead to the passenger console? If no then can you fish a wire from the helm to the passenger console? If your only adding a sub to an existing system at this point can you fish a wire from the stereo unit to the probable or best guess location of installation. I would try this before buying a sub. There are often hatches and covers at strategic locations that help when fishing wires and a fishing snake will help immensely. A small one is only $10-$15 at your hardware store. Don?t be tempted to leave wires exposed - Patience and perseverance usually pay off when fishing wires in a boat.

 

[Serge33]

Re: Audio installation?

Thanks, Jevery. Indeed, my boat has only two speakers and I'd like to add a subwoofer to them.

 

[NelsonQ]

Re: Audio installation?

the main problem with that is providing enough power to supply the equipment. multiple batteries. just follow the installation direction of the unit you are using. and find places big enough for the speakers, and places to hide the wires. it is best to use waterproof speakers.

Serge, TD is right. I'm having similar though process on upgrading my boat's audio system. I've done the 130dB stereo in the car thing as a teenager and you're biggest issue to tackle up front is the power. You'll need to review your batteries, as well as upgrading the alternator to provide adequate charge that an amplifier will draw. If not, you'll be replacing batteries and alternators quicker than fishing lures. You'll also need to ensure proper gauge cabling to handle these power connections (such as a fused distribution block for the amp and possibly the head unit)

As for the wiring, everyone else has mentioned using a snake to either feed the wiring through the wall cavities, underneath the cap, or even through the ski storage and bilge areas. Depends on where you're going and what access your boat has to the 'insides' My boat for instance has closed walls but has access ports where throttle cables, etc run through so I can snake wires for audio, fishfinder, etc through but will be different for each boat.

 

[NelsonQ]

Re: Audio installation?

Also, for the electronics since they'll have potential for contact with water via rain, swimmers, or splashing, ensure you have a marine grade amplifier and deck. They are usually sealed better to prevent water penetration and tin coated copper connections to prevent corrosion on the internal circuitry.

Lastly, plan the end result before you start to prevent buying twice or cutting holes in your boat you don't later want.

Think of things like:

- power sources (where to add additional batteries)

- Power distribution (what needs power; deck, amp)

- type of deck (pre amp or powered - will the deck drive the speakers and the amp the sub or will the amp handle both)

- type of amp and size
- with or without electronic crossovers
- separate electronic crossover
- basic cap and coil configuration
- how many channels - sub or all speakers? Mono bridgeable to run multiple channels to single subwoofer

A lot to really plan. The good news is, it doesn't differ from car audio but you really need to plan upfront. The actual installation is easy.

 

[waterone1@aol.com]

Re: Audio installation?

I'm thinking that the best place for a subwoofer would be in close proximity to your engine hatch. That would also be where the battery and best place for power would be. The rest of the wiring would be control and audio, which would be small diameter. Only you can crawl around your boat and find the best place to run wires.

 

[Serge33]

Re: Audio installation?

Friends, thank you for explanations!

Now I understand it's much more harder than I had thought, so I'll probably give up my idea and just use my two standard speakers. It's a shame, though, Glastron corporation doesn't offer custom audio options for their boats, as it's so much easy to do all the installation and wiring before each particular boat is ready to be sold.

Anyway, I have a follow-up (non-audio-related) question: I want to install one of these 12-V electonic coolers — seen in the supermarker, for primarily in-car use — on my boat. You know, you've got to keep the beer cool, eh? Will it requite additional battery or replacement of the standard alternator? Because I've never seen such kind of equipment in the boats.

Thank you.

 

[NelsonQ]

Re: Audio installation?

Friends, thank you for explanations!

Now I understand it's much more harder than I had thought, so I'll probably give up my idea and just use my two standard speakers. It's a shame, though, Glastron corporation doesn't offer custom audio options for their boats, as it's so much easy to do all the installation and wiring before each particular boat is ready to be sold.

Anyway, I have a follow-up (non-audio-related) question: I want to install one of these 12-V electonic coolers ? seen in the supermarker, for primarily in-car use ? on my boat. You know, you've got to keep the beer cool, eh? Will it requite additional battery or replacement of the standard alternator? Because I've never seen such kind of equipment in the boats.

Thank you.

Adding a 12V accessory plug to add a 12V cooler should be fairly straight forward and run off the standard battery and charging system in your boat

 

[cdnfthree2]

Re: Audio installation?

I'd check on the strength of you charging system. It may not be a big deal but if you run a high powered system along with a high powered amp, you could run into eventual problems on the water if you alt doesn't kick enough juice. I want a stereo on my boat too but think I'll wire it to a different battery or get a portable.

 

[azlakes]

Re: Audio installation?

Hi,
Isn't that cool to have a party on a boat, drinking champagne when girls are around?


Thank you.

... hiya Serge;

yup, most fun you can have with most of your clothes on but be careful our new young friend. you are the skipper and responsible for your guests. fines are just as bad on booze behind the helm and horsing around like lunging your boat to toss some off the bow fatal.

as for speaker, ya skip the sub, look at marine grade Polks. they are excellent.

good-luck

 

[Serge33]

Re: Audio installation?

Hi, Azlakes! I wouldn't relate drinking a couple of champagne glasses while the boat is on ancor and your friends and you just sunbath to, say, driving under influence. Furthermore, the only good thning about my boat being in Europe is that the water cops there are not as strict (and not as fast, in case the first premise appears to be wrong ) as the guys in America. But thanks for notifying, Azlakes!

Thanks for the audio advice! Actually, the whole thing for me is not the question of installing a sub-woofer or not (I'll probably be OK with simply a good stereo system), but the question of whether I can deal with the electric issues. I'm not sure I would do everything right if I had to replace the alternator and/or install the second battery. But nonetheless the PolkAudio website is worth looking at!

 

[Serge33]

Re: Audio installation?

Here comes another question: could I replace my stnadard speakers with the ones of the above brand without having to install additional hardware? Thank you.

 

[waterone1@aol.com]

Re: Audio installation?

This thread is making me ill. I do REAL SOUND for a living.....every day. Without getting too specific, if you are in my area and are paying 40- 500 dollars for a ticket to see a national touring act, chances are I had something to do with that production. This thread started out so simple, and turned into something so far from what it needed to be. Yes, there are companies that sell large capacitors that have nice LED voltage meters built into them for some purpose....I can't figure out why. Yes, there are people that install multiple batteries into their car to power their "sound system" again, unless it is a competition type system, I can't figure out why. Let's get away from the competition system for a minute.
Quite simply that has nothing to do with reality.
Bass requires larger speakers and more power to reproduce. That is simple mathmatics. A factory stereo usually lacks the ability to reproduce bass at an acceptable level without causing clipping or distortion. If you remove bass frequencies from the equation, most factory systems will do an acceptable job of reproducing sound for the area it is intended for. In most cases, if you simply turn down the bass and allow the factory system to reproduce the mid-bass and higher frequencies, it will do just fine. If you suppliment that system with a sub-woofer, you will have a very nice sounding system that will do what most people require. A powered subwoofer, that can reproduce reasonable bass, for the typical stereo will have an average amplifier power of around 400 -500 watts. If you round out the electrical requirements, that is around 40 - 50 amps. Yes, that does require "thick" wires. That does not require extra batteries and audiofile capacitors.
If you have a reasonable stereo system with 4- 30 watt full range speakers and add a 500 watt sub with a tuned 12" woofer, you will have a pretty decent stereo system. No, you will not win "crank-up" competitions, but your boat will rock. Yes, you can take this much farther, but I don't think that is what this post intended.

 

[NelsonQ]

Re: Audio installation?

Here comes another question: could I replace my stnadard speakers with the ones of the above brand without having to install additional hardware? Thank you.

Yes you should have no problems with that.

 

[cdnfthree2]

Re: Audio installation?

This thread is making me ill. I do REAL SOUND for a living.....every day. Without getting too specific, if you are in my area and are paying 40- 500 dollars for a ticket to see a national touring act, chances are I had something to do with that production. This thread started out so simple, and turned into something so far from what it needed to be. Yes, there are companies that sell large capacitors that have nice LED voltage meters built into them for some purpose....I can't figure out why. Yes, there are people that install multiple batteries into their car to power their "sound system" again, unless it is a competition type system, I can't figure out why. Let's get away from the competition system for a minute.
Quite simply that has nothing to do with reality.
Bass requires larger speakers and more power to reproduce. That is simple mathmatics. A factory stereo usually lacks the ability to reproduce bass at an acceptable level without causing clipping or distortion. If you remove bass frequencies from the equation, most factory systems will do an acceptable job of reproducing sound for the area it is intended for. In most cases, if you simply turn down the bass and allow the factory system to reproduce the mid-bass and higher frequencies, it will do just fine. If you suppliment that system with a sub-woofer, you will have a very nice sounding system that will do what most people require. A powered subwoofer, that can reproduce reasonable bass, for the typical stereo will have an average amplifier power of around 400 -500 watts. If you round out the electrical requirements, that is around 40 - 50 amps. Yes, that does require "thick" wires. That does not require extra batteries and audiofile capacitors.
If you have a reasonable stereo system with 4- 30 watt full range speakers and add a 500 watt sub with a tuned 12" woofer, you will have a pretty decent stereo system. No, you will not win "crank-up" competitions, but your boat will rock. Yes, you can take this much farther, but I don't think that is what this post intended.

Waterone, I liked your bass tube/matched crossover suggestion. Any ways, people use several/ seperate batteries in their competition car stereos so that it doesn't drain their main battery when their 100+ amp alternator isn't running. People who use trolling motors often do the same even though these don't pull 40-50 amps like the 500w amp you mention. Typically running you motor for 15-30 minutes can recharge any loss from trolling motor use to your original battery. I do not know the specs on a GT205 but I believe many boat alternators run only 60 or fewer amps. You'd be crazy to run an amplifier that pulls 50 amps, add stereo, add battery charging needs regardless of how thick your wires are. Quite possibly though the GT205 can handle it. I'm not so arrogant to claim it would or wouldn't because I don't know for sure. I have always believed seperate batteries (cranking for starting and deep cycle for stereos) is the way to go. Many old mariners believe that seperate batteries for accessories are a good idea too. Even though the alt has no strain other than the battery itself, drawing that much power off a single battery isn't that great of an idea. A well known wise man around here even stated "multiple batteries". I like to think for myself, but if he were to tell me a cricket could pull a plow -honestly, I'd probably hook em up. I am glad that you feel comfortable and confident with the knowledge you've obtained doing sound but pleae don't let reasonable experienced suggestions make you ill.