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[Bradmxz]

Hi. A few years a go I purchased a boat. A 1991 185 sea ray I/o. I bought the boat as a project as the engine had no compression. With the help of you guys on this forum I transplanted a 3.0l engine in the boat and worked through all the problems with everyone that helped me. Anyway to make a long story short, the second season the boat developed troubles in the leg, and me being young and naive, I tried to take it apart and fix it. There was water intrusion and a horrible clacking when I turned the wheel. I realize now that the clacking was probably a worn out u-joint.

Anyway to get to the real reason I'm back, ever since we sold that boat we have wanted another one. I always said I would buy an outboard if I were to get another boat. If there's trouble with the engine, you could just remove it and put on another one, after all they are very readily available where I live. But we decided this time we would spend a lot more money. After paying $2500 for the sea ray, and having trouble, we've come to the conclusion that we will go so far as $20,000. The closest dealer to me(1.5 hour drive) has a 175 bayliner that I think we can get for a good deal. It's a 2017, but it inboard/outboard. Now I don't have to tell you that this makes me apprehensive about this boat. After all, a 12 foot flat bottom boat would satisfy me, but my wife wants this boat.

Anyway I need some more of your guys help as to what to look for on this boat. It is used. I'm unsure of the hours on it at the moment. I will be asking the dealer for the service record after it was traded to them. What else can I look for? Im the kind of person that does all my own maintenance and upgrades. I installed nitrous on my mustang and tuned it myself as I wanted to make sure it was done right. I've come a long way since our first boat and the leg troubles, but I need reassurance that I won't be getting myself into the same trouble. Any help is appreciated.

Sorry for the very long post.

 

[matt167]

17' I/O is going to be smallish but a 2017 Bayliner IS a nice boat if you get it for the right price

 

[achris]

17' I/O is going to be smallish but a 2017 Bayliner IS a nice boat if you get it for the right price

Maybe you should talk to @Bondo about bayliners...

 

[matt167]

Maybe you should talk to @Bondo about bayliners...

I know Bondo's view, and I agree they are a cheap boat. But by 2017 they are mostly composite if not all composite construction, and if you can get one at the right price, it can be a good boat.

 

[Rick Stephens]

I don't own one, but from what I have seen they are decent those late years, if you can get the price right.

I run a 17 foot ski runabout/bowrider type boat. I rebuilt it for fishing with a bow deck instead of bowrider seating, and seriously fancy reclining seats instead of those worthless back to back 12 inch high ski boat seats. Only issue now is that it really is a 2 person fishing barge. Damn comfortable and quick and nimble, but for fishing, three is crowded, four impossible. I've run 7 to haul in for a day of boarding and tubing. Nothing wrong with 17 foot as long as you know exactly what you are getting.

 

[achris]

I know Bondo's view, and I agree they are a cheap boat. But by 2017 they are mostly composite if not all composite construction, and if you can get one at the right price, it can be a good boat.

Still a 'cheap' boat, and a manufacturer can only reduce the price of a product if the quality or quantity of materials going into that product have been also reduced. If you buy a cheap boat, don't expect it to be good quality, or last a long time. That's just simple economics and a fact of business in this world.

You pays your money, you takes your choice. Do you want good or do you want cheap? You pick one, you can't have both.

Chinese proverb... Cheap no good, good no cheap...

Chris......

 

[matt167]

Still a 'cheap' boat, and a manufacturer can only reduce the price of a product if the quality or quantity of materials going into that product have been also reduced. If you buy a cheap boat, don't expect it to be good quality, or last a long time. That's just simple economics and a fact of business in this world.

You pays your money, you takes your choice. Do you want good or do you want cheap? You pick one, you can't have both.

Chinese proverb... Cheap no good, good no cheap...

Chris......

I think the biggest thing is going in with open eyes.. The boat in question is going to be a reliable boat if it has been maintained correctly, it's likely a Mercruiser 3.0L. Not a powerhouse but decent. Not built with the best materials but a fairly recent build..With the right discount/ deal it probably won't be a bad deal. Not a Cadillac boat, they are more of the Kia type comparison I think, but they do the job... I'm no advocate for Bayliner in general, I own 2 40+ year old Starcraft's but have looked at many recent Bayliners because of their attractive price, though I'll keep my tin Starcraft's

 

[Bradmxz]

I don't own one, but from what I have seen they are decent those late years, if you can get the price right.

I run a 17 foot ski runabout/bowrider type boat. I rebuilt it for fishing with a bow deck instead of bowrider seating, and seriously fancy reclining seats instead of those worthless back to back 12 inch high ski boat seats. Only issue now is that it really is a 2 person fishing barge. Damn comfortable and quick and nimble, but for fishing, three is crowded, four impossible. I've run 7 to haul in for a day of boarding and tubing. Nothing wrong with 17 foot as long as you know exactly what you are getting.

Hey Rick. I remember you and bondo giving me lots of help with the sea ray.

Thanks for the replies guys. I know the bayliner is the lower end of the spectrum, but like I said, I'd be happy with a 12ft flat haha. The wife wants something with pretty colors that looks good. I was thinking we should be able to get a pretty decent boat for $20,000. Although I think we may be able to get this one a bit cheaper than that.

I know the inboard/outboard issues are probably just in my head, but this boat will be run 90-95% of the time in salt water. To me an outboard really seems the way to go as there's no manifolds or risers to worry about. It will be trailered at all times though and never left to sit in salt water, always fresh water flush after use. Am I being to picky on the I/o?

 

[matt167]

Hey Rick. I remember you and bondo giving me lots of help with the sea ray.

Thanks for the replies guys. I know the bayliner is the lower end of the spectrum, but like I said, I'd be happy with a 12ft flat haha. The wife wants something with pretty colors that looks good. I was thinking we should be able to get a pretty decent boat for $20,000. Although I think we may be able to get this one a bit cheaper than that.

I know the inboard/outboard issues are probably just in my head, but this boat will be run 90-95% of the time in salt water. To me an outboard really seems the way to go as there's no manifolds or risers to worry about. It will be trailered at all times though and never left to sit in salt water, always fresh water flush after use. Am I being to picky on the I/o?

Saltwater is for sure where an OB shines. Manifolds/ risers were they can last a boat's lifetime in freshwater, become wear maintenance items in salt water.

I actually bought my 14' Starcraft Holiday for the same reasons you want an OB except the part about saltwater. I can trailer it anywhere, and despite it's 1966 outboard running like a top, I have a spare 1988 outboard anyways.. I have a bigger Starcraft Offshore V18 with a Mercruiser I/O that might not get used this year, because it's more work to use it

 

[Bradmxz]

Saltwater is for sure where an OB shines. Manifolds/ risers were they can last a boat's lifetime in freshwater, become wear maintenance items in salt water.

I actually bought my 14' Starcraft Holiday for the same reasons you want an OB except the part about saltwater. I can trailer it anywhere, and despite it's 1966 outboard running like a top, I have a spare 1988 outboard anyways.. I have a bigger Starcraft Offshore V18 with a Mercruiser I/O that might not get used this year, because it's more work to use it

We don't have any big lakes here. The only big Lake for miles is the area reservoir. There is big pond at the park where we go a lot, but it won't spend much time in that honestly. I'm glad you agree with the outboard for salt water use. While it's no big deal to change manifolds, they aren't exactly the cheapest parts available. I know that also the wrong way to look at boating, you have to pay to play.

Thanks for the reply

 

[Lou C]

I think for that price you can do better. If its an I/O and it has cat converter exhaust stay away from it. Exhaust replacements on those will break the bank. I'd never buy one for myself. Get a late model boat decent quality with a modern 4 stroke outboard. Look at Key West Dual Console models, better quality, all composite construction, my neighbor has one that's 15 years old bought new and looks great. And that's here in the salt pond.
That's what I'm getting next. No more crawling in the bilge for me.

 

[Bradmxz]

I agree that doing anything in the bilge is a pain. She has ask this morning what they have available in an outboard. I'm not totally ruling out the I/o yet just still unsure.

 

[Scott06]

I agree that doing anything in the bilge is a pain. She has ask this morning what they have available in an outboard. I'm not totally ruling out the I/o yet just still unsure.

The biggest reason to get an IO over an outboard is having the entire transom free for the swim platform. Unless you are in salt water that would tip me the way of the IO.
you are in a totally diffferent price and age bracket vs the last boat you had. With youyr mentioned mechanical skills you wont have an issue keeping either and IO or OB going.

 

[Lou C]

really think this thru though...
cat converter exhaust, if you are in brackish or salt water...
Merc V engines, 4500 in parts
Volvo V engines 6000 in parts
then there's:
more difficult to winterize
difficult access for some repairs, do you realize what a horror show some I/O installations make of a simple starter change? Or any issue with the power steering unit up against the back of transom mount?
Safety:
no fuel vapors in the bilge concern
driveshaft bellow on I/O can let water in
a failed hose on an inboard cooling system floods the bilge with sea water

while I am not a fan of the price of outboard parts, I think that with EFI and Cat converter exhaust added to I/Os, their former advantage of mechanically simpler engines and cheaper parts....is GONE....
And you can find boats with the swim platform on either side of the OB now, Four Winns makes a nice one.

Four Winns | HD2 OB

this is similar in size to my old boat with none of the designed in I/O headaches.

 

[nola mike]

I was thinking that the OB might command a huge premium over the I/O, but it doesn't appear that that's the case anymore. Quick search showed 2021 200hp yamaha for $10k, that's maybe a couple more than a new I/O (but maybe not even for a bobtail). If it's time to repower it's easier to find a replacement longblock, but again, installation time/cost might offset that. Certainly maintenance strongly favors an OB, running in salt, winterizing (I'm going to have to drain my 4.3 on thursday, having just dewinterized it last thursday...). I do like the option of third party/domestic choices and not being chained to the manufacturer. And yet again, you can't get too far away from that with a new engine with all the electronics. So I guess if I had the $20k budget, the OB would win in most cases. If you're sticking to <$10 land, an IO might still be more bang for the buck. If you're in 40 year old boat territory like I am, an IO is still a no brainer.

 

[Lou C]

True for old boats the I/O still makes sense even more so if you grew up around Chevrolet small blocks and know how to rebuild carbs, set timing, etc. Then, they were simpler than a carbed outboard that had a carb for each cylinder (so a V6 outboard had 6 carbs to worry about).

 

[Bradmxz]

The biggest reason to get an IO over an outboard is having the entire transom free for the swim platform. Unless you are in salt water that would tip me the way of the IO.
you are in a totally diffferent price and age bracket vs the last boat you had. With youyr mentioned mechanical skills you wont have an issue keeping either and IO or OB going.

This is the biggest reason the wife likes the I/o. The full rear swim platform. She thinks the outboard engine makes the boat look funny. I really don't think I will have any trouble maintaining or replacing parts on either, but I am unsure if I have the back and patience for it anymore on the I/o haha.

 

[Bradmxz]

really think this thru though...
cat converter exhaust, if you are in brackish or salt water...
Merc V engines, 4500 in parts
Volvo V engines 6000 in parts
then there's:
more difficult to winterize
difficult access for some repairs, do you realize what a horror show some I/O installations make of a simple starter change? Or any issue with the power steering unit up against the back of transom mount?
Safety:
no fuel vapors in the bilge concern
driveshaft bellow on I/O can let water in
a failed hose on an inboard cooling system floods the bilge with sea water

while I am not a fan of the price of outboard parts, I think that with EFI and Cat converter exhaust added to I/Os, their former advantage of mechanically simpler engines and cheaper parts....is GONE....
And you can find boats with the swim platform on either side of the OB now, Four Winns makes a nice one.

Four Winns | HD2 OB

this is similar in size to my old boat with none of the designed in I/O headaches.

No doubt. The exhaust parts alone are the price of another boat. As I've aged, I think I prefer simplicity. Ofcourse the engines are simple in I/o, but not as simple as removing the outboard and placing another one.

 

[Scott06]

This is the biggest reason the wife likes the I/o. The full rear swim platform. She thinks the outboard engine makes the boat look funny. I really don't think I will have any trouble maintaining or replacing parts on either, but I am unsure if I have the back and patience for it anymore on the I/o haha.

Happy wife happy life...i like the swim platform on our sea ray 200. Our kids and their friends camp out on it. Im used to maintaining my IO wouldn’t have it any other way. All depends on how you want to use it.

 

[Bradmxz]

True for old boats the I/O still makes sense even more so if you grew up around Chevrolet small blocks and know how to rebuild carbs, set timing, etc. Then, they were simpler than a carbed outboard that had a carb for each cylinder (so a V6 outboard had 6 carbs to worry about).

That was the main thing that Rick and bondo were helping me with on the sea ray. The carbs and timing. I know my way around those things, but I'm glad for the days of fuel injection as well. Yes the 91 sea ray was a simpler boat for sure, and I was thinking of purchasing an older boat, but iny area all things are so overpriced, that it's just as well to buy new. People are asking $5-6000 for 2006- 2010 snowmobiles. The market is crazy here.