Bayliner construction How safe??

[walkingfish]

Hi all,<br />Just how safe is a Bayliner?<br />What is it made of?<br /><br />I have a 19.5 foot cuddy cabin and i live in the Southern most part of New Zealand (Invercargill). Where i go fishing is around Stewart Island or Bluff.<br />That probably doesn't mean a lot to most of you, but it gets pretty rough!<br />Best case scenario 1 meter swells (3 foot) worst case scenario 4 meter swells (13 foot) and that happens at the drop of a hat (1 to 2 hours) but generally i will be out about 8 to 10 miles of shore, so i see rough stuff often!<br /><br />What i really wnat to know is how bouyant is a Bayliner? Do they have a foam filling? how much water could i take in before i'm in deep trouble?<br /><br />Obviously i dont intend on getting in to any trouble that will require the extra bouyancy, but it would be nice (piece of mind) to know what i'm dealing with!<br /><br />

Thanks to all

<br />Brad

 

[page62]

Re: Bayliner construction How safe??

It sounds like somebody's been badmouthing Bayliners again...<br /><br />You didn't mention what year your Bayliner was made. Throughout the '90s, their reputation for quality steadily improved. (However, I have a 1985 model, and it's a nice little (14') boat.) Anyhow, in order to meet Coast Guard approval, smaller boats must have foam in order to achieve neutral buoyancy. Of course, I wouldn't want to swamp ANY boat in 4 meter swells!<br /><br />At any rate, while it's no Boston Whaler, Bayliners are decent boats at a good price. If you want some mutual support, check out the Bayliner Owners Club at www.boc-web.org

 

[12Footer]

Re: Bayliner construction How safe??

I was told the problem was poorly constructed stringers, and layup meathods used. But I am here to debunk that claim,if my '89 CAPRI is typical. I had deck rot when I purchased the boat,due to standing water left on the deck (boat was savaged by previous owner).<br />I mention that,only because I had to rip it all out, and rebuild it. I've seen the stringers and final glass work up close.<br />The final glass was somewhat "hairier" than normal, but there was much MORE glass than normal. Also, there were too MANY stringers for my liking,as they tend to wiegh a boat down. But when the storm is gaining,the seas are 3meters, and I'm WAVE-JUMPING home, I'm glad they are there.<br />I found the hull to be lacking sufficiant floatation. No problem for me, but you might want to spray some in between the stringers if you ever go into deck rebuilding as I have. But i did not,as more wieght is all i need.

 

[walkingfish]

Re: Bayliner construction How safe??

Thanks for the info guys, by the way my boat is also a 1989 Bayliner Capri-Cuddy Cabin with a Force 125Hp.<br />Now you mention it the floor at the back of the boat (from the seats back) is a little springy.<br />Is this what you meant by Deck Rot?<br />If so, how serious is it?<br />Whats the worst that can happen?<br />How much/hard is it to replace/fix?<br /><br />Phew, i really can pump out the questions!<br />All advice is more than welcome!<br /><br />Thanks,<br />Brad

 

[page62]

Re: Bayliner construction How safe??

Woo hoo! Deck rot! I just finished replacing/fixing a deck myself. <br /><br />You can't tell how serious it is until you pull up the carpet and then pull out the rotten wood. There's no way of telling what the stringers are like until you get in there. (I was lucky -- my Glastron has fiberglass stringers -- no wood to rot!)<br /><br />Anyhow, here's the process in a nutshell: Remove seats. Pull up carpet. Remove rotten wood sections. Determine if stringers are OK; replace and fiberglass as needed (hopefully you wont have to do this). Replace wooden flooring. Fiberglass and/or epoxy floor (I only had to fiberglass the section around the ski locker). Recarpet. Replace furniture.<br /><br />If you do it sooner rather than later, the job will be simpler. For more info, check out www.rotdoctor.com

 

[JB]

Re: Bayliner construction How safe??

I'll bet you guys get tired of hearing about the unsinkable legend, so I wont mention it.<br /><br />Bayliners aren't the only boats that get rot. Two of the reasons I stick to, ah, um. . .them. . . are a Tracker and a Larson that I had the misfortune to own briefly. I now have the opinion that carpet is the enemy of un-encapsulated wood.<br /><br />A well cared for Bayliner is a much better, safer boat than a neglected ________ (you name it) boat that has wood in it.<br /><br />Sunny days.<br />JB

 

[page62]

Re: Bayliner construction How safe??

I'd rather face 4 meter swells in a 4 meter (13 foot) Boston Whaler (yes, I can say it) than a 19 foot Bayliner (or Larson or Tracker). That's because I know the Whaler won't sink no matter what!!! (Of course, I'd much rather have a larger Whaler in that situation...)<br /><br />On the other hand, I'd rather have the larger Bayliner on our relatively calm Texas lakes (where I could try to entice the wife into the cuddy cabin . . .)

 

[mikec]

Re: Bayliner construction How safe??

ok... Ill bite

its lunch time and I have time to kill... I would not have wanted to be in a whaler (with all due respect to them )when I got caught in a thunderstorm squall line last year. My seaworthy 1984 20' CC Mako with its self bailing ****pit, foam floatation, center console mount sterring which allowed me to stand and keep my balance by shifting with each wave, and the large bow which crashed down and seperated the frothing waves, performed marvoulously. Although, I wish I had a shirt on, I can still feel the rain like it was BBs, even behind the plexiglass windshield... OUCH!

 

[mikec]

Re: Bayliner construction How safe??

I guess you cant say ****pit... ****pit ****pit ****pit. ok... it has a self bailing place where the seats and controls are in the midsection of the boat.

<br /><br />- couldnt resist.

 

[JB]

Re: Bayliner construction How safe??

Yes, Mike. Makos are excellent boats and I would rather face a storm in a 20' Mako than a 13' Whaler. A 20' Whaler would be a different story.<br /><br />In August of 1967 a squall line crossed Lake Michigan and caught a huge fleet of amatuer salmon fishermen off the Michigan shore. (I can't say they were surprised, because the USCG flew their chopper around begging them to seek cover and they ignored it). Several hundred boats foundered and several dozen "fishermen" perished. Three (3) boats successfully weathered the storm... That's right. They were all Boston Whaler 16s. They were the only Whalers out there.<br /><br />'Nuff said??<br />JB

 

[herb]

Re: Bayliner construction How safe??

If you foam filled a bayliner would it be any better in anyway?Yes I know it will still be a Bayliner,just curious.<br /><br /> Thanks,Joe

 

[mbb]

Re: Bayliner construction How safe??

OK, I cant resist anymore. I dont think Bayliner is no worse than most of the rest of the mass marketed boating mfgs at any give year in history. They developed the bad rap mainly due to topside visible looong cracks in gelcoat, and colored gelcoat that faded out in only 1 yr. Now, I will guarantee you that the boats are entry-level and poorly designed, and once you experience a similar well designed high quality boat, you would view them for what they are. But, the majority of owners really are satisfied, most dont know any better, and yes, Bayliner did produce some excellent boats too by chance. <br /><br />I once owned a '91 Trophy 2002 walkaround, bought not for fishing but just for fooling around with the wife & kids, bay and barrier island type stuff. The Trophy line is said to be higher quality than the runabout/cruiser line due to intended offshore use. To put it bluntly, a 12 yr old could have designed a better boat. It handled poorly, was hard to get on plane (stern heavy) and would drop off suddenly, ridiculous small livewell that wouldnt prime, absurdly small shallow fishboxes with 1/4" dia drains (dead insects would plug them up) and a pump so small it took 15 min to pump them out, (have to put a plug in the other because they share the pump), slipperiest non-skid deck that a bare foot ever stepped on, mucho gelcoat cracking along curved chines, some scary looking gelcoat cracks on aft bottom, fishboxes filled with washdown/rain water because even though the lid had channel around it, the scupper hole was above the level of the deck, Cheap brittle plastic interior side panels (next to helm seats) cracked around screws, built in tackle trays flooded with rainwater, and couldnt be removed to dump it out, bilge pump innaccessible, low bow freeboard could dip in 2'seas, hull was holed above waterline by minor impact, anchor locker lid (semi removable) would come off easily, anchor locker open to inside of cabin (wet rope in locker would cause mildew in the cabin). In short, the boat was a poorly designed piece of $%^& that is one of the best selling fishing boats there is over the last 10 yrs, Go figure. I kept mine less than 9 months, till I found a sucker to buy it.

 

[sony2001]

Re: Bayliner construction How safe??

Walkingfish, you'll be going fairly far out to sea, I guess you have been there before, you can judge if the Bayliner can take it, but I would never do it on a regular basis unless I had a kicker of 10 hp to bring me home when the engine fails and it will.<br /><br />------------------

 

[walkingfish]

Re: Bayliner construction How safe??

Thanks so far guys,<br />Your input has been well recieved,<br /><br />Sony what do you mean by "it will fail"?<br /><br />Is that just because the motor is a force?<br /><br />I know of some old (up to 20 years) mercs and johnstones still alive and kicking, is this motor not of at least that type of quality?<br /><br />After all it is 12 years old and has been checked out ( as much as you can without pulling it apart ) compressions etc are all good. Surely it can be in the same league as these ancient motors?<br /><br />Page62,<br />I have had the local Fibreglass guys around and they have poked and prodded at the transom and floor and cant detect any signs of rot, but they did say that someone has wrenched the crap out of the bolts holding the motor to the transom and this has caused the gelcoat to crack, would this be common? <br /><br />By the way i really do appreciate the fact that you guys are honest in your opinions and are willing to share them,<br />Cheers!!<br />Brad

 

[ODDD1]

Re: Bayliner construction How safe??

I'm with you, mbb........you swear those bayliner small craft designers grew dope....for no additional [or little ] expense, and a little forethought the boats could have been MUCH better......

 

[page62]

Re: Bayliner construction How safe??

I'm very relieved to hear you don't have rot. That's one thing we can check off the list.<br /><br />Cracked gelcoat isn't going to significantly affect the transom, as long as the cracks are above the waterline. But how significant are these cracks? Is the underlying fiberglass damaged too?<br /><br />Force engines can either be very bad or very good, depending on which day of the week they were made. I have a 1985 Force 50 that runs just fine, and I actually had 2 boat mechanics tell me they're "good engines." (I swear!)<br /><br />The reason somebody suggested a "kicker" motor is because you're going offshore, and you should have a backup powerplant.<br /><br />Finally, a question. What sorts of boats do others own in your end of the world? (Pun intended.) Are Bayliner Capris commonly used to go offshore? Or are Whalers, Makos, Trophys and that sort more common? (The Capri really is intended to be a lake boat, not an offshore boat.)

 

[page62]

Re: Bayliner construction How safe??

By the way, I should mention that I LIKE Bayliners. Our 1985 Capri 1400 has provided hours of trouble-free enjoyment! <br /><br />Bayliners definitely provide good value for the money. Part of their bad reputation is due to the fact that they're popular among first-type buyers -- who know nothing about boats and tend to abuse them, unwittingly or not.

 

[sony2001]

Re: Bayliner construction How safe??

Walkingfish, no its not because its a Force. For a time I was a commercial bush pilot. There are certain combinations of man and machine that set up the first factor of the number required for an accident! We would load up to maximum take off weight, fill out the papers necessary, then top up the tanks with the "Granny Gas". Cheap insurance to one day be a grand father.<br /><br />------------------

 

[trophyman]

Re: Bayliner construction How safe??

I have a '96 Trophy with a Force Motor that is treating me well. I put little hours on it and use it in the Bay. But you get what you pay for, and Bayliners are a good value. And as many have said, Force motors and Bayliner boats are marketed to relative newcomers to the boating experience and tend to be neglected and abused. I've been reading this board for about a month now and have not seen anything posted about Grady White boats. Why do you think that is?

 

[JB]

Re: Bayliner construction How safe??

Hey, Trophyman. Grady Whites are first class boats that present few problems, so problems don't show up here. As good as they are, they don't seem to generate the glassy-eyed fanaticism that Whalers do, so they don't show up here.<br /><br />Bon Voyage.<br />JB