Bilge Pump Question

sublauxation

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Oct 13, 2008
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1,317
I plan to add a second bilge pump to my aluminum boat. The 1000 gph pumps use a 3/4 inch hose and the 1250 gph pumps use a 1 1/8 hose. I currently have a 1 1/8 thru hull fitting left over from a livewell I no longer use, but it's about 8 feet from where the pump will be. Anybody have any thoughts on whether an 8 ft run of hose with the 1250 pump will work better or worse vs a 1000 gph pump with only a couple feet of hose? The outlet for the smaller pump would have to be about 6 inches higher than the existing thru hull for the larger pump. I hate to put new holes in the boat if I don't have to.
 

oops!

Supreme Mariner
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Oct 18, 2007
Messages
12,932
Re: Bilge Pump Question

8 feet is a lot of head pressure for the little pump.

i would go with a t and join the two into one out put line....

you will loose a little......but its better than cutting another hole in the hull
 

oops!

Supreme Mariner
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Oct 18, 2007
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12,932
Re: Bilge Pump Question

wait a minit.....

why are you adding a second pump?

are you leaking?

its best to fix the problem than rely on the little pumps.
 

series60

Chief Petty Officer
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Jan 4, 2010
Messages
420
Re: Bilge Pump Question

I plan to add a second bilge pump to my aluminum boat. The 1000 gph pumps use a 3/4 inch hose and the 1250 gph pumps use a 1 1/8 hose. I currently have a 1 1/8 thru hull fitting left over from a livewell I no longer use, but it's about 8 feet from where the pump will be. Anybody have any thoughts on whether an 8 ft run of hose with the 1250 pump will work better or worse vs a 1000 gph pump with only a couple feet of hose? The outlet for the smaller pump would have to be about 6 inches higher than the existing thru hull for the larger pump. I hate to put new holes in the boat if I don't have to.

Redundancy is always a good thing. I would just use your existing hole. 11/8" hose @ 8' won't make a big impact on flow IMHO. Is the second pump going to be automatic with the smaller pump on a switch?
 

Georgesalmon

Lieutenant Commander
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Apr 14, 2012
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1,793
Re: Bilge Pump Question

The real question is; how far "up" is it pumping"? From the waterline of the boat? The distance matters some but not as much as the height.
 

Home Cookin'

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May 26, 2009
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9,715
Re: Bilge Pump Question

you really can't run two pumps through the same hose. Asa back-up, where you might run them one at a time, OK.
 

sublauxation

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Re: Bilge Pump Question

Oops, No leaks but I want to make sure my backside is covered. When I removed most of the splashwell it leaves the back of the boat feeling awfully low and empty. In reality it's no different than the newer style boats. I haven't had any problems but I haven't been on waves much bigger than a foot since doing the renovations.

I looked this morning and the run may be more like 9 or 10 ft to the existing thru hull. That hole isn't very far off the water line, it's probably 12-14 inches above the pump. Then again it's also near the middle so with any water in the back it would have to pump higher. Any new hole I put closer to the pump location would likely have to be about 6-8 inches higher. Putting a new thru hull probably wouldn't be that big a deal but I don't want to put the 1 1/8 hole so I'd stick with the smaller 1000 gph pump.

I have an existing 600gph set on an auto switch, I was going to put the new, bigger one to a manual switch. Each will be on a separate battery.
 

sasto

Captain
Joined
Jun 1, 2010
Messages
3,918
Re: Bilge Pump Question

I see no problem with what you want to do. I have a much longer run of 5 bilge pump hoses on the 56'er I'm sitting on.


Good Luck, sublauxation
 

Maclin

Admiral
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May 27, 2007
Messages
6,761
Re: Bilge Pump Question

The pumps will have some head pressure specs relating to the run of hose after them and the rise, definitley do not exceed their specs or the actual rated gph will not be achieved.

I would not tee them together for the outlet. If one is not running then the water has one more place to go besides outside the boat.
 

rfdfirecaptain

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Aug 17, 2008
Messages
314
Re: Bilge Pump Question

I’m assuming this is not a huge boat. If you need that much bilge pumping capacity I have to wonder why. But the fact that you are willing to add an additional bilge pump just sounds like good “pre-planning”.

Bilge pumps are not pressure pumps they are volume pumps… high volume @ low pressure. Since the pumping pressure of a bilge pump is not adjustable by the user there are three primary concerns when installing this type of pump:

1. DIAMETER of discharge hose and all fittings. It’s simple. The smaller the hose the less volume capacity you have. Take a look at the size of the discharge fitting on your pump. For maximum discharge capacity make sure there are no choke points from the pump discharge all the way through to the end of the thru hull connection. A choke point is anything that is smaller than the size of the pump discharge fitting.

2. LENGTH of discharge hose. This is not “head pressure” as was suggested. Check your installation instructions. It may tell you what the maximum length discharge hose is x number of feet or inches. If you exceed the maximum length discharge hose (within reason) it will still pump water. Exceeding the maximum length only means you cannot get the rated capacity of the pump in GPH out at the other end.

3. ELEVATION of the thru hull connection. Water in any application that is being pushed upward has to overcome gravity. Likewise water falling utilizes gravity. This is known as “head pressure”. It’s how we get water pressure into municipal water systems. A one inch square column of water will exert a pressure of .434 at its base. A 6 inch rise (as you suggested) in a 1 1/8” hose, from the center of the pump discharge to the center of the thru hull connection would create a pressure loss of about .217psi. A loss of pressure will have some affect your GPH. Even though you have a low pressure pump .217 is really negligible. Think about it. What does a bilge pump actually do. It drafts water from a low point and lifts it to a higher point for discharge. Again check your instructions for maximum “lift”.

Each of these three are factors of “friction loss” and will affect your ability to pump at your pumps rated discharge capacity… 1000GPH or 1250GPH. So, to fully understand how these three things affect your pump discharge capacity you must understand friction loss. Without giving a long lesson on friction loss, just suffice it to say this. In a newly installed application, if you have a significant reduction in pressure or GPH, it was likely due to friction loss and not the malfunction of a brand new pump. Remember the pressure in a bilge pump is low anyway. Depending on how you overcome the aforementioned three things will determine not if, but rather how much decrease you may have in your GPH discharge.

Considering what information you included about the application I too see no problem with what you’re trying to do. But, if you’re that concerned, before you mount it hook it up in your backyard and play with. Observe any changes and then make your final decision.
 

rfdfirecaptain

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Aug 17, 2008
Messages
314
Re: Bilge Pump Question

Even though I don’t see where you mentioned teeing your discharge lines together I’m reading some discussion about it. Again… it’s simple math and one less hole in your hull. Just make sure the square area of the discharge hose you “marry into” has a square area equal to or greater than the sum of the discharge hoses from each of your bilge pumps. In this case a 1 3/8” discharge hose will work, although it wouldn’t hurt to upsize it to a 1.5”. Just be sure that you don’t have any “choke points” in this hose too. If you can find one, a “Y” would work better than a “T”.

The question I cannot answer is this. If one bilge pump is running and the other is not will the discharge water also leak out at the bilge pump that is not running. Based on my knowledge of the construction of bilge pumps I am pretty certain it will. You may be able to put a one way flow check valve (that opens with low pressure) in line to prevent it. Be sure you plan this out carefully if you must tee your lines.
 

Don S

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Aug 31, 2004
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62,321
Re: Bilge Pump Question

You never want 2 pumps tee'd together, most of the water will exit the pump that isn't running. Besides, one of the reasons for a second pump is safety, so if the hose fails on one pump, and you have both pumps hooked to the same hose you now have no pumps working.

Keep the systems completely separate. electrically and discharge water system.

I usually keep the smallest pump under the engine and with small hose, that way it pumps out most of the water with the auto float switch when the bow is high when getting on plane. A second larger pump is usually further forward in the bilge and won't fit under the engine. Which isn't a problem since it's for backup and emergency use only.

Even the ABYC has this to say on two pumps.

22.8.8 If the discharges of several pumps are manifolded to discharge through a single thru-hull fitting, the system shall be designed so that the operation of one pump will not back feed another pump, and the simultaneous operation of each pump will not diminish the pumping capacity of the system. A check valve shall not be used in the discharge manifold system.
 

MH Hawker

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Re: Bilge Pump Question

and you will need to add 2 check valves to the lines to pervent back flow.
 

Don S

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Re: Bilge Pump Question

and you will need to add 2 check valves to the lines to pervent back flow.

Don't you know, the ABYC even talked about check valves.


22.8.7.2 a vented loop or other means to prevent siphoning into the boat. A check valve shall not be used for this purpose.

22.8.9 A check valve may be used only when necessary to prevent an automatic bilge pump from cycling on and off due to back flow from the discharge line.
 
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