boat prices 2007

EricD

Cadet
Joined
Feb 20, 2008
Messages
20
I'm new to new-boat-buying so I'm not sure how to proceed. I have a little lund and it's time to get a more reliable safer boat for grandkids. I'm looking at a 2007 lend Explorer with a 90 HP Merc 4 stroke but I have no idea what to offer for it. It's basic with no trolling motor or depth finder but it's new and has full warranty. Since there are no MSRPs published and I don't want to insult the dealer because I believe a good relationship is important between customer and dealer, I'm curious if anyone has an idea on a reasonable offer. Thanks for any help. I'd hate to make a mistake in the either direction.
 

Silvertip

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Sep 22, 2003
Messages
28,771
Re: boat prices 2007

You start the process by asking "how much!". You respond "ouch" and walk away. Then start your research. The internet is your friend here. Do a search for "Boats For Sale" or "Boat Dealers". Most dealers have a "Used Inventory" or "Non-Current" category on their web site. Non-current, which is what you are looking at, means the boat is new, but last years model. Dealers don't typically list current year prices in internet ads but they do list non-current. You can also research boats and prices right here on iBoats. Click the BOAT CLASSIFIEDS button at the top of every iBoats page. Drill down to find the boat you are interested in. If you see an ad with no price, e-mail them. I recently bought a new pontoon and had dealers in three states working with me. You don't even have to leave home. When you make price comparisons, make sure you compare the packages line-item for line-item. It doesn't take long to change a package price by a $1,000 or more just by adding a few inconsequential accessories you can add yourself for just a few bucks.
 

dcg9381

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Aug 26, 2007
Messages
308
Re: boat prices 2007

I'm always curious about this:
Why do so many people buy new boats off the lot of some dealer?
Nothing that I know of depreciates like a boat in the first couple of years - why not buy a used boat, even one 1-2 years old, have it inspected professionally and save yourself a ton of money?

I'm pretty mechanically inclined, so I buy used stuff all the time. I've got a 98 Glastron (yea, that's a little old) - it's original price was right at $50k with a trailer. It had 119 hours on it when I bought it. It sold for about 25% of original price... IT'd be cheaper to operate an aircraft... :)


If I was buying a new boat, I'd treat it like I do when if new car shopping - figure out what you want, call or fax several dealers asking for quotes... You might post in the manufacturer specific forum to find what other parties are paying for similiar boats.
 

EricD

Cadet
Joined
Feb 20, 2008
Messages
20
Re: boat prices 2007

I'm always curious about this:
Why do so many people buy new boats off the lot of some dealer?
Nothing that I know of depreciates like a boat in the first couple of years - why not buy a used boat, even one 1-2 years old, have it inspected professionally and save yourself a ton of money?

This is a good question because I never buy new cars for just that reason but so much can go wrong with a boat, especially a motor, and it's hard to test drive a used boat. A five year motor warranty gives some pretty good piece of mind and boats hold their value around here that it's hard to find a 3 year old boat for much less than 95% if it's new value.
 

dcg9381

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Aug 26, 2007
Messages
308
Re: boat prices 2007

This is a good question because I never buy new cars for just that reason but so much can go wrong with a boat, especially a motor, and it's hard to test drive a used boat. A five year motor warranty gives some pretty good piece of mind and boats hold their value around here that it's hard to find a 3 year old boat for much less than 95% if it's new value.


Just for reference - the process of checking out a boat motor is largely the same as checking out a auto motor.. Namely compression and/or leak down tests. Newer EFI motors can give you the number of run time hours - and you can extrapolate engine life from how much wear has been put on the motor. Maintenance receipts - all the same stuff applies to boats.

If it's hard to test drive a new boat, I'm not aware of it.. Then again, I'm in Texas. When dealing with individuals, I simply go look at it, if I'm considering buying it I tell them I need a test drive. I've never been turned down.

The alternate solution is to have it "checked out" by a marine repair facility - they can water test it for you.. And water testing is important to make sure it's propped right and tell if it's down on power via GPS, RPM, and prop slip.
Most individuals go for this option also - as they're advertising it in "good" shape - if you decide not to buy it you're providing them with independent "proof" that the boat is in good shape.

I've never bought used from a dealer, but I'd work a purchase agreement pending a successful water test (in writing).

Don't buy without a test ride.
 

Silvertip

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Sep 22, 2003
Messages
28,771
Re: boat prices 2007

Purchased carefully, new boats do not have to depreciate much at all. Depreciation is the amount you initially paid minus what you sold it for in the end. Not what some used boat book told you. In other words, pay through the nose full retail and sell it cheap means the cost of ownership is extremely high. Other factors are how the rig was taken care of. A dirty, beat up boat will not bring anywhere near the money a well cared for one will. I just sold my three year old boat (purchased new) for exactly what I had in it. Depreciation = zero. Did I find a sucker? Absolutely not -- I found someone that recognized a very clean very well equipped and very cared for boat for a very fair price. I wish I would have had about five more. I bought it as a "no pre-rig boat". I bought the engine separately from another dealer at a great price. I did the installation of the various accessories myself and saved a bundle that way plus I got the models I wanted -- not what the dealer wanted me to take. On a strictly dollars and cents basis, one can buy a new non-current boat much cheaper than the exact same model in the current year. Or looking at it another way, you could upgrade one model level buy buying a new non-current version of a lesser model. There is nothing wrong with buying new. Warranty is just one advantage. Certain people want and can afford new and someone that doesn't understand that should not criticize them for that. They might ask you why you would buy someone elses problem. Many people simply don't know how to research and they have limited negotiating skills. Sales people (I call them order takers because they don't actually sell any more) can spot these people a mile away and can tell when they don't have a clue about the boat or pricing. Then they stick them with a bunch of worthless accessories and the person walks away thinking wow, I got all this stuff thrown in. No, you didn't. Buy smart, take care of what you buy, then sell smart and depreciation takes care of itself.
 

Navy Jr.

Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Sep 14, 2007
Messages
738
Re: boat prices 2007

There is nothing wrong with buying new. Warranty is just one advantage. Certain people want and can afford new and someone that doesn't understand that should not criticize them for that./QUOTE]

I'm a newbie boater and I decided that since I could afford it, I wanted to buy new just because I didn't want the hassle of trying to fix someone else's problem(s). Not looking forward to birthday next month. Will be 60.

I actually did look into buying a slightly used boat, but the boats my wife and I were interested in are very popular models and rarely come up for sale. I could find really old versions (not interested at all), or models a few years old (but owners could not verify maintenance), but nothing only a year or two old.

You know, though, there's really more to it than what others have said so far. The reason I waited so many years to buy a boat is that new boats these days are finally where they need to be to make me really interested. We ordered a new Lund 1750 Fisherman with a Merc 115 4-stroker. The boat quality these days is pretty good. I toured the Lund factory in New York Mills, MN last fall. Quite impressed with the I-beam construction and how the transom is knee-braced to said beams. Also impressed with the newer Integrated Power Strake (IPS2) hull design. And I was really impressed with the size of the boat. The tinnies have a much broader beam than they did when I first looked at them 20 years ago. This one is almost 8 feet wide.

The seats are more comfortable, you can get air-ride pedestals, the electronics are much improved, and well, the new boats these days just look better.

Motors have come a long way, too. They're more efficient, more economical, more friendly to the environment, and much more reliable (that is, if they are properly maintained).

And, finally, trailers are better, or at least that's my opinion. Nowadays you can get them delivered with swing-away tongues, disc brakes with electric lock-out, LED lights and Bearing Buddies.

The boat we ordered comes with a lifetime warranty on certain parts of the hull and on all of the decking material. And that lifetime warranty is transferable, which says a lot about current boat quality. There's a 3-year bow-to-stern warranty for everything else. On top of that, Merc has a promotion that includes a 5-year warranty.

One thing I didn't mention about the new boats made these days, of course, is that they are much more expensive than new boats of years ago. One can only imagine what they will cost 10 years from now...
 

Campylobacter

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Aug 4, 2007
Messages
503
Re: boat prices 2007

Do some online research. You obviously have are fairly internet savvy. Check out Ebay and boattrader, a lot of dealers use these sites advertise new "old" stock. At first you will be amazed at the difference in prices, you'll see a several thousand dollar range. Some dealers advertise real prices and some just hope. Find the lowest prices and work from there. I think you should get a pretty good deal on last years boat and the season hasn't started yet.

One thing about boats depreciating so much the first year, these depreciations are based on the MSRP. Nobody pays this, most of these boats were sold new at deep discounts anyway. When I was looking I never found a decent used boat for 25% off the real prices, more like 5% for the first 3 years. I finally just bought a new boat. Got some peace of mind that the motor wasn't abused.
 

Silvertip

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Sep 22, 2003
Messages
28,771
Re: boat prices 2007

I agree and I might add one more thing -- you get a lot more for your money. People often say they don't build cars like they used to. My response to them is thank God for that.
 

PhatboyC

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Sep 28, 2007
Messages
258
Re: boat prices 2007

one can buy a new non-current boat much cheaper than the exact same model in the current year.

Yep, that's what I did. I bought an 06 in 07 right before the 08 came out. I know I got a good deal when I saw plenty of used 04 and 05 with 50+ hours asking the same price I paid new! You just have to do your homework and not be in a hurry to buy. Plus I got a better financing rate through the dealer then directly at the bank.

If you get a good deal when new. Maintained your boat through the years. The resale value will be quite fair.
 

dcg9381

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Aug 26, 2007
Messages
308
Re: boat prices 2007

Being able to buy a new boat, new motor, new accessories and sell it for what you've got into it (0 loss) is definitely the exception, not the rule. Factor in the taxes you paid on it - labor, and accessories, I'll bet it's a loss.. But still, if that was the rule - I think a lot more people would own boats.

Well cared for boats certainly do retain value for the right buyer. I think that's why you see a huge variation in prices. The boat I have (1998, 23 feet) I've seen prices anywhere from $15k to $38k. The high end is usually a dealer.

I do agree that boat construction has come a long way - boats without wood and modern EFI systems that do self-diagnostics are all huge pluses in my book... Pick the setup that's right for you.. And if you're keeping it for a long time, depreciation really isn't as issue as much as peace of mind and good ownership hours are.
 

5150abf

Vice Admiral
Joined
Aug 12, 2007
Messages
5,808
Re: boat prices 2007

If you are buying a boat now you should be able to get a killer deal.
The new boat market is really off this year across the board.
I build pontoons and normally this time of year we are running 28 a day and 20 every other Saturday, right now we are running 20 per day 4 days a week and it isn't picking up much at all.
I have heard some of our competition is down to 10 a day 4 days a week.
So if you are looking for new you are in the drivers seat, like others have said, take your time and don't be afraid to walk out the door if you don't get your deal.
Good luck
 

EricD

Cadet
Joined
Feb 20, 2008
Messages
20
Re: boat prices 2007

If you are buying a boat now you should be able to get a killer deal.
The new boat market is really off this year across the board.
I build pontoons and normally this time of year we are running 28 a day and 20 every other Saturday, right now we are running 20 per day 4 days a week and it isn't picking up much at all.
I have heard some of our competition is down to 10 a day 4 days a week.
So if you are looking for new you are in the drivers seat, like others have said, take your time and don't be afraid to walk out the door if you don't get your deal.
Good luck
I've heard this but it's hard to know what a good offer is. Everyone is very secretive about boat prices. With cars and motorcycles, you can find out the MSRP and perhaps even the dealer invoice. Boats are another matter. Is there a general rule of thumb as to how far one can deal down from a sticker price?
 

billybones

Seaman
Joined
Jun 20, 2006
Messages
64
Re: boat prices 2007

Ericd, I am sort of where you are at. Well not grandkids yet, yikes! give me a couple of years. I'm Looking at bass boats. I am torn between value of resale on a new boat and is this the last boat for a good long time. Good long time means little in resale thought I think. If I go new 10 years is a long time. Till I resell. 10 years old today and 10 years later on a well maintianed boat may not matter all that much. Unlike cars like you said no one sells a 4 yr old boat much. I am more weary of the 4yr old one. than a well kept 10 yr old one with papers and such.. How long do you want it. how well will you keep it? As far as offers go. lowball as best you can. remember it ain't yours till its paid for. THEY want to sell it to you. Your not asking for it. THEY are selling it to you.. its not personal just business. 75% of current prices on a new boat would be a good starting point.. They will laugh. but it is a starting point. Tip is right. start low let them walk it up.
 
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PhatboyC

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Sep 28, 2007
Messages
258
Re: boat prices 2007

Yep start low. They will try to make you feel stupid just to see your reaction. Then make sure you have your poker face on and look confident. When it stalls leave the dealer your phone number and leave. He will call you back with a better offer if their hungry. Meanwhile you go to a different dealer to do the same routine. After you have them give you their lowest price and they think you'll sign right now, make them add some accessories or you walk.
 

woodee148

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Feb 13, 2008
Messages
178
Re: boat prices 2007

These guys are right, for an example the Msrp on my boat (when it came out in 07) was 44750, I ended up paying 29245 (+taxes and trailer). we also got them to throw in 5 life coats, bumper buoys, anchor and rope + emergency kit, flares and throw line. It's all cheap quality stuff but at least i have it all for now. In saying all that, I don't think they would have gone that low Feb of 07 but it does give you an idea of dealer price vs msrp
 

Navy Jr.

Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Sep 14, 2007
Messages
738
Re: boat prices 2007

These guys are right, for an example the Msrp on my boat (when it came out in 07) was 44750, I ended up paying 29245 (+taxes and trailer).

Wow, that's one hull of a deal!!
 

RotaryRacer

Lieutenant
Joined
Jul 18, 2004
Messages
1,361
Re: boat prices 2007

I know someone that just bought an 07 Four Winns that would have an MSRP over $40k for $26.6K (+taxes).

Now is the time to buy last years models.

The typical fear of a depreciation hit is already taken care of. The dealer breaks even on the deal and you get a great deal....win-win.
 
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