busted by marine patrol

deejaycee_2000

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Mar 28, 2006
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Re: busted by marine patrol

I know in the US there are alot of rules on the water, but luckily here in South Africa we can get away with anything ..... we do have water cops here but the problem is they must catch me first ..... if they can't keep up how can they give you a ticket? Right? ....... they only have a 4.2 meter inflatable with a 50hp 4-stroke yamaha on it ...
 

Chunder06

Petty Officer 2nd Class
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Apr 17, 2006
Messages
124
Re: busted by marine patrol

I'll bet their UHF radio is faster than yours, plus you can't stay on the water all day.....here in southern Oz the water police have 16ft inflatables withe twin 150hp yamies...try to out run that little lot.o:)
 

deejaycee_2000

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Re: busted by marine patrol

16ft with 2x 150's? That sounds like something that I would do ... can that be legal in Australia?
 

Chunder06

Petty Officer 2nd Class
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Re: busted by marine patrol

deejaycee_2000 said:
16ft with 2x 150's? That sounds like something that I would do ... can that be legal in Australia?
Their the police and its legal, They ride them like a motor bike, all go not for show, they are onto you in a flash, they are made of ridig plastic with an inflatable outer, they look like those sprint boats with roll bars and their comms and radar are attached LOW is 16 ft overall about 18FT
 

deejaycee_2000

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Re: busted by marine patrol

Nice, would love to take it for a spin ... we built something similar a while ago for a fisherman, probably a poacher here, but was 26 ft with 2 x 300hp HPDi's on ... never had a ride on it though ..... bet it would give your cops a run for their money ... that is what it was designed to do ....
 

Chunder06

Petty Officer 2nd Class
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Apr 17, 2006
Messages
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Re: busted by marine patrol

We had a professional abalone poacher who operated from main land Oz, he had a ocean racer built which out run every thing, they eventually caught him, that boat is now used by the marine police, so what goes around comes around.
 

hidust

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Apr 5, 2006
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Re: busted by marine patrol

You would think with everthing that goes on in the water they would be able to find many more interesting things to give tickets for.

I would be interested to know if the boat you were passing complained....
 

JasonJ

Rear Admiral
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Aug 20, 2001
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Re: busted by marine patrol

The boat being passed doesn't have to complain. All the officer has to do is articulate that based on his training and experience (a rookie fresh out of academy has more training and experience than a civilian) the boat doing the passing is being operated in an unsafe manner. The easiest way to not get tickets is to not drive unsafely. All that boat had to do is make a turn, and the boat doing the passing would be screwed. There are a lot of boaters out there that only look ahead, they never look behind them or to the sides. This is why the ticket was issued, there was little reaction gap left if that boat decided to make a sudden turn. We've all seen it, a boat cruising along makes a sudden turn for no apparant reason. That is why I stay away from other boats, and I never pass other boats. People are too unpredictable on the water.
 

gunmaker

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Apr 15, 2006
Messages
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Re: busted by marine patrol

Were you out on Winnie?
We were out there on the 4th of July weekend and that's just a rat race. They seem to frown on alot more there than they do on the other lakes. Maybe your overtake speed was ALOT more than you needed and they thought you could of slowed a little. By the way that's the last Winnie will see of us. Squam or Newfound is alot less traveled.
 

bjcsc

Lieutenant Commander
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Jun 1, 2006
Messages
1,805
Re: busted by marine patrol

The standard for a conviction is "proof beyond a reasonable doubt", which is relatively high, but does not rise to the level of absolute proof that some of you apparently believe must be met.

According to their (NH) statutes, these cases are considered civil cases and not criminal cases. Thus the standard is "preponderance of the evidence" and very easy for even a rookie prosecutor to meet.

Not only that, but he has the law and published rules against him. Check out NH's boating laws here: http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rules/saf-c400.html

Here are the pertinent sections to this case:

Saf-C 404.12 Operational Rules for Crossing Boat Wakes and Conduct Near Other Vessels.
(a) No boat operator shall allow his or her boat to cross the wake of another boat, or cross its own wake, in a way that causes the vessel to become airborne. For the purposes of this section, "airborne" means that the boat's hull completely leaves the water.
(b) An operator shall slow to headway speed when crossing the wake of another vessel when within 150 feet of another vessel.
(c) No boat operator shall operate his/her vessel in a manner that is unsafe, including the following types of conduct:
(1) Challenging other boaters by heading directly at a vessel and then swerving at the last minute to avoid collision;
(2) Weaving through congested boat traffic at greater than headway speed;
(3) Operating while his/her vision is obstructed; and
(4) Other types of operation that are intended to create erratic operational patterns so that other boaters cannot determine the course or heading of the vessel.
(d) Notwithstanding anything in this section to the contrary, this section shall not apply to the following:


APPENDIX II
Recommended Uniform Fine Schedule.

(2) $68.00 fine for a conviction of violating:
a. RSA 270:26,III, attaching boat to buoy or navigational aid;
b. RSA 270:ll and Saf-C 403.01, insufficient personal floatation devices;
c. RSA 270:11 and Saf-C 403.13, failure to display proper lighting;
d. RSA 270-D:2,VI, passage at less than 150 feet;
e. RSA 270:31, diving without or improper display of divers flag;
f. RSA 270:30-a, transporting child under 5 in a boat without the child wearing a floatation device;
g. RSA 270-D:3, water ski violations;
h. RSA 270-D:5, overloading;
i. RSA 270:74, improper operation of jet ski; or
j. RSA 270:32-a, dive flag infringement.


RSA 270-D2:http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/html/XXII/270-D/270-D-2.htm

270-D:2 General Rules for Vessels Operating on Water. –
VI. (a) To provide full visibility and control and to prevent their wake from being thrown into or causing excessive rocking to other boats, barges, water skiers, aquaplanes or other boats, rafts or floats, all vessels shall maintain headway speed when within 150 feet from:
(1) Rafts, floats, swimmers.
(2) Permitted swimming areas.
(3) Shore.
(4) Docks.
(5) Mooring fields.
(6) Other vessels.

This would be a slam dunk if I were prosecuting it...

Pay the $68 and be more careful!
 

KRS

Banned
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May 15, 2004
Messages
2,383
Re: busted by marine patrol

ZmOz said:
KRS said:
I still don't believe the officer will have to define a distance with a number.

When driving in the rain, you can get a speeding ticket even if you are under the max posted limit because you may be driving over the speed considered "safe for the conditions". This example, and the case of the boater's ticket above... are both subjective and it'll probably stick in court.

Again, I don't think you'll win if you go to court.

Like I said above, the officer still has to specify exactly what was unsafe, with proof. He can't just say "it was unsafe" and that's the end of it. Whether it's based on distance or anything else doesn't really matter. If it turns out the original poster was being safe, the officer is going to have a hard time explaining himself. If the original poster was doing something that is obviously unsafe, then yes, he's wasting his time in court. If he doesn't think he was doing anything wrong, it's his duty to fight it.

No... he won't. His interpretation of what was safe at that moment will suffice for the judge.
 

gonefishie

Commander
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Re: busted by marine patrol

This is just like the time when I skid on ice and slid of the road, hit a tree, damaged my front pumper and hood. While waiting for the tow truck to come, a county sherrif drove by, stopped and gave me a ticket for "unsafe speed". How does he know? he didn't witness the slide off. I was going down a downhill curve pack with ice on Thanksgiving eve, I could have been crawling and still wreck. The copy of the ticket was barely legible and I didn't think it was an actual ticket so I didn't pay any attention to it. There wasn't any explaination why I got the ticket or told of court date. Several months later, I got a notice from the BMV that I had an outstanding ticket and if not pay ASAP, my driver license will be suspended. I had to skip school, drove to the other side of Indianapolis to pay the ticket at the BMV. I couldn't mail-in because the mail wouldn't make it there in time. There weren't anything I could do but forced out the donuts money. By reading some of the laws above, I've realized I've broken a few boating laws. I've got to keep those in mind when I fish a tournament.
 

dtherrien

Petty Officer 1st Class
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Jun 9, 2005
Messages
213
Re: busted by marine patrol

I ran into the same situation last year on Winnipisauke.
I passed the marine patrol, then he pulled me over for passing to close at planning speed. He said the same thing...at least 150ft. I argued with him about it saying i was at least 150ft from him. I made it a point to him that i was good at judging distance....being a hunter my whole life and a builder for more than half of my life. He let me off....but only after saying i was about 135ft.
 

KRS

Banned
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Re: busted by marine patrol

If you slid off the road, then you were driving too fast for the conditions = speeding.
 

gonefishie

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Re: busted by marine patrol

If you slid off the road, then you were driving too fast for the conditions = speeding

Have you ever driven downhill on ice KRS?????? It doesn't matter what speed, once you start sliding there isn't a doggone thing you can do about it.
 

KRS

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Re: busted by marine patrol

Lived in Idaho for 13 years, and done that a few times :$
 

rickdb1boat

Supreme Mariner
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Jan 23, 2002
Messages
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Re: busted by marine patrol

I have to agree that you will probably lose this one. We all know they are all in cahoots together. If the cop wants a conviction, he will talk to the prosecutor, who in turn will talk to the judge and you're done. But I would make them work for it and not just pay the fine. They get off too easy in most cases......Take it all the way......
 

Terry Olson

Chief Petty Officer
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Aug 20, 2005
Messages
415
Re: busted by marine patrol

No doubt about it - the cop, the prosecutor, and the judge all conspire to impose the government's insatiable desire for revenues on the innocent citizen.

Join us in a place we call "reality", if just for a moment.

The cops make the same money whether they write tickets or not. Quotas are against most department's policies and in violation of state law in some places. Why endure rude and sometimes violent encounters to write a ticket they don't have to? Because it's their job.

The prosecutor's job is to present the case for the government. Of course they talk to the Cops - They have all of the evidence the prosecutor relies on to make the case. Ever heard of the defendant providing the government's evidence?

The judges are independent for the most part. You can't think of this like an episode of Quincy where they all sit around eating pizza and drinking beer together after work. That just isn't what happens. Most judges, with some exceptions, are former DEFENSE ATTORNEYS, while few are former prosecutors. If they have a bias do you think it's in favor of the prosecution or the defense? Beyond this, most judges, again with a few exceptions, view themselves as being "above" cops. Cops are "blue collar laborers" in their eyes while they consider themselves and their colleagues in the legal profession as "educated intellectuals". Again, there are some exceptions, but not many.

I believe in the rare conspiracy, but the only way for a conspiracy to exist is when all of the participants are willing either to directly participate or to at least quietly tolerate others' participation. For this conspiracy theory to be viable every cop, every prosecutor, and every judge would have to either directly participate or condone the others' activities by not saying anything about them. We're talking about tens of thousands, maybe hundreds of thousands of people nation wide.

Is this likely?

I mean no offense, but it gets old.
 

deejaycee_2000

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Mar 28, 2006
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3,447
Re: busted by marine patrol

Damn you guys have alot of rules on the water in the US one of these days they are gonna set up speed traps on the water .... they will probably give me the death penalty there for the way I drive ......
 

ZmOz

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Re: busted by marine patrol

KRS said:
If you slid off the road, then you were driving too fast for the conditions = speeding.

I bet I'm not the only one here that's glad you're not a cop.
 
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