Cabin Cruiser advise anyone?

alexr254

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Jun 21, 2011
Messages
262
Re: Cabin Cruiser advise anyone?

Boat looks really nice! I am sure whatever you decide on you will LOVE IT.

Maybe mention that the season is basically over, boat will need to be winterized very soon, maybe that will shave off a few bucks for you. Especially in MAINE :p
 

JoLin

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Aug 18, 2007
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Re: Cabin Cruiser advise anyone?

That Bayliner is underpowered for its size and has only one engine. Also, do you know what hull 'deadrise' is, and how it relates to seaworthiness in rough, choppy water?

Considering how you said you wanted to use the boat, it's a curious choice. Stay within sight of land...

My .02
 
Joined
Apr 29, 2010
Messages
27
Re: Cabin Cruiser advise anyone?

I would assume you mean it's ability to cut through waves? I did look at this, I found a comparable hull design (its a 97 I believe) doing just that. Looks rather fun if you ask me lol. 0:47, 1:21, and 2:00 seem to show that it cuts through wake ok. If I tried this with my 16' bow rider, I'd probably end up IN the water or redline the engine lol. It's not a wine ride, but it's not going to swamp it either. I dont know if this engine is small for the boat or not, but the smaller the engine, the less weight I need to tow. And if it gets at least 35 in calm water with the 3 of us on the sea trial, I'd be happy with that. I dont expect a cruiser to be a speed demon like my 16' screamer for its size that does about 45 on a bad day. Its ALL engine pretty much lol. Going to be giving it to the parents once I replace it with something larger. They'll turn it into a trolling vessel for togue probably.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bh-_ojJ6UQI&feature=related

I am looking at several of these 2355's another one I am considering is an older, but larger engine version:

http://www.pontesmarine.com/boatsforsale/boatsForSale.cfm?id=23FT_BAYLINER_CEIRA&ct=2

The only hesitations I have with this is that it's from a boat dealer. The 94 is from a private owner and likely will be more honest about the boat than the dealer will be. There are also some 2355's in NH that I am scheduled to look at on Fri should I need to. They seem to be pretty common boats in this area for some reason and are fairly affordable.
 

Tetondan37

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Jul 31, 2011
Messages
35
Re: Cabin Cruiser advise anyone?

I have a 1986 28? Bayliner with a 10 foot beam and twin outdrives. I totally love it.

I trailer it about 100 miles to get to the lake. I don?t have a slip so the boat comes home after every trip. My drive includes a crossing the Continental Divide which is about a 3000 foot elevation gain and loss each direction. Launching is pretty easy. The ramp is at a nice angle; too shallow could be an issue. I think my draft is about 3 to 3.5 feet.

I have a Ford Excursion turbo diesel (3/4 ton). If I didn?t have so many kids I would have a one ton truck, but the Excursion does just fine. I wouldn?t dare try towing with anything less. You may not need a diesel, but my V10 got 5mpg pulling the boat. Wyoming requires a $50 annual permit to pull oversize and banners on the boat and truck.

The trailer (tripple axle) can be expensive to maintain.

Good luck with your boat purchase.
 

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JoLin

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Re: Cabin Cruiser advise anyone?

I would assume you mean it's ability to cut through waves? I did look at this, I found a comparable hull design (its a 97 I believe) doing just that. Looks rather fun if you ask me lol. 0:47, 1:21, and 2:00 seem to show that it cuts through wake ok. If I tried this with my 16' bow rider, I'd probably end up IN the water or redline the engine lol. It's not a wine ride, but it's not going to swamp it either. I dont know if this engine is small for the boat or not, but the smaller the engine, the less weight I need to tow. And if it gets at least 35 in calm water with the 3 of us on the sea trial, I'd be happy with that. I dont expect a cruiser to be a speed demon like my 16' screamer for its size that does about 45 on a bad day. Its ALL engine pretty much lol. Going to be giving it to the parents once I replace it with something larger. They'll turn it into a trolling vessel for togue probably.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bh-_ojJ6UQI&feature=related

Yup- does a great job of jumping foot-high wakes in 3" of chop. Impressive. :rolleyes:

You're the one who came here for advice. Thing is, most of us spend a lot of time choosing boats based on how well they satisfy our BOATING requirements. That Bayliner is fine for protected bays and lakes, and it does a great job of meeting your trailering requirements.

Good luck. Stay safe.
 

Philster

Captain
Joined
Sep 15, 2009
Messages
3,344
Re: Cabin Cruiser advise anyone?

My issue here, from watching the new kid post, is that he has the same disease that many others have when they try to convince themselves (and at some point convince others), or presents the same symptons: He likes fishing... fishing for answers that fit what he has imagined.

The chances of new kid thinking objectively are slim and none. Emotions are running high, and he is imagining various things that make him happy, and he pictures anything from a 23' boat to a near 29' boat doing it.

Owners can be slimier than marinas. Neither is slimier by nature. Just take a step back, remove emotion from all this, and practice skepticism -- it can only save you grief. The people here can help, and you know they're helping when it starts to sound harsh. The seller will tell you everything you need to hear to make you buy.
 
Joined
Apr 29, 2010
Messages
27
Re: Cabin Cruiser advise anyone?

IDK Philster, seems to me I've done quite a bit of modification to the boat searching I've been doing as a result of people commenting here. Before this thread I was thinking that I would be able to trailer a 27-29' boat (keep in mind I have been trailering a 36' camper which is pretty close to how much this little 23' hull weights). I did not know the weights of boats of these sizes or the types of vehicle required to tow them. I also did not know the drafts of these boats. Hence I asked here. I thought they would be 5-6' drafts but I was really surprised when I saw people say that they were somewhere around 2.5-3.5' which tells me that I can not only use it on the coast here, but in my own lake as well. Once I learned the type of boat I could tow, I subsequently changed the hull designs I was looking at and found a decent make/model to fit what I really want (a trailerable cabin cruiser). It's much smaller than other express cruisers, but it has all the amenities I wanted along with a decent (not perfect) hull design and its going to be quite easy to haul with my vehicle since it's very comparable to my camper in weight and its even shorter than the camper and not nearly as tall.

It also sounds to me like someone here thinks that just because water has salt in it, that it's automatically going to have like 20' swells. I suppose it is my fault for them not understanding what "island hoping" is. You dont go to different islands, get off, and jump around on them. It's a term used in stripper fishing here where you troll around different islands during the day. Thus the term island hoping. Some of these islands also have public mooring for weekend camping on a boat. So whoever it was, obviously had never been around a rocky coastline such as the coast of Maine. For example, when you launch to go "island hoping" as I do plan on doing, you generally travel 10 to 20 miles off the shore of the LAUNCH. This doesnt mean 20 miles out into open ocean. Have a look at the coast around maine and you will quickly realize that you'd have to go out at least 100+ miles in order to be in real seas. The coast of maine is extremely jagged, very littered with island, and has a gazillion bays with 1000's of islands within those bays. The coast here in maine is NOTHING like for example, the northwest or the california coast or even the florida/gulf of mexico where if you go even a mile out, swells can be 2 stories high or something ridiculous like that.

Look at the difference in terrain compared to even only 400 miles south of here in NJ.

http://tinyurl.com/mainecoastline
http://tinyurl.com/coastlineofnj

Notice how many obstacles are in the way to slow down any high seas and break them apart. This type of coastline is awesome for fishing as well as imho, express cruisers. Swells in the maine coastline I showed above are typically 1-3'. Venture out past the rocky coastline and you're going to get into much larger seas. But if you attempt the same distance in NJ for example, the seas are going to be so big that your boat is traveling vertically rather than horizontally.

If you look at that map of maine you'll see that I kinda centered it around Ellsworth, ME. This is because I actually live on graham lake. It's roughly 8 miles to the coast from here. So I am situated in some fairly interesting geographical areas that could really cater to express cruisers. And the fact that it does could be a sign of why I've been finding so many 2355's in my area for cheap. They are simply everywhere I look. Seems to be a very popular boat in this area and I bet it's because of the coastline geography.
 

25thmustang

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Mar 20, 2008
Messages
1,849
Re: Cabin Cruiser advise anyone?

It does sound like your narrowing your search down after research.

Get out on one of those 23-24 boats and see if the size works. Get a couple of people below decks and see if the room is enough. Stand in the head, lay in the aft cabin, get a feel for it. If the size works, it's easily trailerable.

As for the video of one cutting through wakes, keep in mind, this style and size of boat will pound, no matter what a video shows. It will "cut" through some stuff, but for the most part on choppy days with 2' waves or higher it's not going to perform all that great. Sounds like your coastline won't have you out in nasty water though, so it may still be the right boat.
 

26aftcab454

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
May 12, 2009
Messages
1,510
Re: Cabin Cruiser advise anyone?

I would assume you mean it's ability to cut through waves? I did look at this, I found a comparable hull design (its a 97 I believe) doing just that. Looks rather fun if you ask me lol. 0:47, 1:21, and 2:00 seem to show that it cuts through wake ok. If I tried this with my 16' bow rider, I'd probably end up IN the water or redline the engine lol. It's not a wine ride, but it's not going to swamp it either. I dont know if this engine is small for the boat or not, but the smaller the engine, the less weight I need to tow. And if it gets at least 35 in calm water with the 3 of us on the sea trial, I'd be happy with that. I dont expect a cruiser to be a speed demon like my 16' screamer for its size that does about 45 on a bad day. Its ALL engine pretty much lol. Going to be giving it to the parents once I replace it with something larger. They'll turn it into a trolling vessel for togue probably.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bh-_ojJ6UQI&feature=related

I am looking at several of these 2355's another one I am considering is an older, but larger engine version:

http://www.pontesmarine.com/boatsforsale/boatsForSale.cfm?id=23FT_BAYLINER_CEIRA&ct=2

The only hesitations I have with this is that it's from a boat dealer. The 94 is from a private owner and likely will be more honest about the boat than the dealer will be. There are also some 2355's in NH that I am scheduled to look at on Fri should I need to. They seem to be pretty common boats in this area for some reason and are fairly affordable.

New Kid--You have high aspirations . A 23 ft cruiser with a 210hp v-6 is way underpowered. Also a boat jumping a boat wake is one thing and running thru 2-3 ft choppy waves is a whole different story.
I wish you luck but think you'll be disappointed in the performance. it may be great for putting around in smooth water but will be a very rough ride in "sporty water".
 
Joined
Apr 29, 2010
Messages
27
Re: Cabin Cruiser advise anyone?

Rough ride is expected in any kind of boat anyway imho. I'm use to a bumpy ride to begin with heh. I did picked it up yesterday after test driving it around the lake some. I was satisfied with it's cruising speed. It's no speed demon, but it handled decent and the engine was extremely quiet, no shaking, shimmer, idled fine, started even better. I got there before the guy and he said the key was in the boat if I wanted to turn it on. I decided I'd let him turn it on, so I waited for him to get there. He pushed the throttle forward once, back to idle, and it started just fine. The engine compartment as well as the engine looked pristine compared to others I'd looked at. The engine was not the original that came with the boat. It was actually a new in the crate engine that he installed 4 years ago. He picked a smaller engine for the better gas economy according to him. I dont know about that but it sure does run nice. It also towed just as easily as my 16' and handled WAY better than my 36' camper trailer. No fishtail at all even at 70mph. But I will say this, my little jeep looks like a freakin lawnmower compared to the boat itself when its hooked up heh. I also need to clean off the green crap from the bottom of the boat. Sebago lake is infested with invasive plants and it really gunks up the bottom of the boat pretty bad. My lake doesnt have any of this stuff yet so I'm definitely cleaning it before I drop it in here later tonight.

These are photos of it in my dads yard on the way home.
 

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JoLin

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Re: Cabin Cruiser advise anyone?

ROFLMAO- you went from first request for advice (from the folks here who obviously don't have a clue) to purchase of a 17 y.o. Bayliner in only 4 days, and without benefit of a professional mechanical inspection or hull survey. That's impressive!

I agree, the boat is a fine accessory for your Jeep...

:facepalm:
 

alexr254

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Jun 21, 2011
Messages
262
Re: Cabin Cruiser advise anyone?

Grats on your purchase! Sometimes you just need to go with your gut feeling.
 

BTMCB

Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Sep 15, 2009
Messages
761
Re: Cabin Cruiser advise anyone?

Honey, I shrunk the jeep........

Congrats, good luck and be safe.
 

haulnazz15

Captain
Joined
Mar 9, 2009
Messages
3,720
Re: Cabin Cruiser advise anyone?

Muriatic acid works well for getting the scum off. You can find it readily at any pool supply store.
 
Joined
Apr 29, 2010
Messages
27
Re: Cabin Cruiser advise anyone?

ROFLMAO- you went from first request for advice (from the folks here who obviously don't have a clue) to purchase of a 17 y.o. Bayliner in only 4 days, and without benefit of a professional mechanical inspection or hull survey. That's impressive!

I agree, the boat is a fine accessory for your Jeep...

:facepalm:

It's not exactly a 100K boat either. No need for all the fuss on a cheap boat such as this, its pocket change. If it needs stuff (which as far as I can tell after having it out on my lake all day today it does not need anything yet), then I can just dump more into it. My main concerns were the weight of such a boat, and it's draft. Nothing more really. So far, it fits just fine on my dock and rides great on the lake. Its not a speed demon, 30 tops with 5 adults (might be the prop causing it because of incorrect pitch or somethin, but I dont care about top end speed anyways, I can always change the prop next year if need be), but then again, its not suppose to be a speedy boat in the first place. The bulk of it's time will be spent running a kicker motor anyways. I plan to go island hoping with it which means I'll be doing a whole whopping 1.5-2.5 mph depending upon what I'm trolling for. I will be taking it out around the islands this weekend and we'll see just how "rough" it is in 1-3' seas. I dont expect it to be any worse than taking my 16' out there which I have done. The only difference, I wont come back looking like I just road the log flume 50x in a row. Do I expect it to be a smooth ride? Absolutely not. Whats the fun in that? And if the motor dies (I highly doubt it, but hey who knows right). Then I'll just be sitting out there until my dad can pick me up in my old boat which runs like a top. No big deal really, just a major inconvenience. If a 16' open bow can ride around in the seas I plan to be visiting, I am sure that this should be just fine.
 

alexr254

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Jun 21, 2011
Messages
262
Re: Cabin Cruiser advise anyone?

If its pocket change for you, can you get me one too?? Shouldnt feel a thing :rolleyes:

I am all for smoothness of the ride, i see no fun in getting tossed around like a rag doll. But this proves everyone has their own prefference.

You know your area well enough, you have your new boat. Hope it all works out and be safe :)
 

Solittle

Fleet Admiral
Joined
Apr 28, 2002
Messages
7,518
Re: Cabin Cruiser advise anyone?

Years back I had a 27.5' Bayliner Victoria with a huge flybridge. It sat on a 35' triple axle trailer with brakes and it scared the crap out of me going down the road. In addition it was a single screw Volvo 350 cn which was grossly underpowered. It needed a 454 ci or twins.
 
Joined
Apr 29, 2010
Messages
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Re: Cabin Cruiser advise anyone?

Well its been a week now and I have been able to take this thing out to the coast finally. I was rather surprised at how soft it was compared to what I had heard here. I was expecting it to be like an amusement park ride, but to the contrary it was very soft. I would not say smooth though. I consider smooth glass water where theres no chop at all and you can drink wine off the bow. I would call it a soft ride, not a rough ride like I expected. Even though the bow would slam into the waves, you really couldnt feel the smashing of water although you sure could see it come flying out the sides sending spray like 20' off the sides. Pretty cool to watch actually. It was more of a soft push forward when you hit a swell. Seas were about 3.5' when I got to the outter edges of the coastal islands where it was the coolest ride ever. But inside the bay, rather boring if you ask me. Ran very smooth right over the bay chop. The wife did get seasick though, that was rather amusing hehe. But she gets sick even on our small lake hahaha. I didnt catch a damn thing, but the ride itself was pretty nice. I went out around the islands which is about a 50 mile round trip and it used about 1/4 of a tank according to the gauge. But I think its either got a bigger tank than its suppose to have or the gauge doesnt work right. Supposedly it has a 55Gallon tank. When I went to fill it, it was at about 1/2 tank and it took 43 gallons. When I re-filled it again after we took it out, I dumped the 3 5gallon cans I had in the back into it (15 gallons) and the gauge read full tank again up from just above 3/4 tank. So I dont know what to think about that. I think maybe the gauge is wrong or it has a bigger tank than its suppose to have. So it seems to me the whole trip took 15 gallons and we were out for about 5 hours. Although a lot of the time was spent just drifting bouncing bait off the bottom lol.

So the next thing I will be doing is running it dry here at home just to see how much it actually takes when I fill it again. I'm going to check the gauge as it's being filled to see if it's reading correctly or not. Then after that test, I'm going to do overnight on some of the public mooring bouys around the islands. All in all, I think this is the boat size I was looking for. It trailers great, and goes where I want it to go. Trailoring this thing was actually easier than my 16' boat. With the 16, I cannot drive it up onto the trailer because it'll always come out crooked. I have to keep it shallow enough so that it doesnt float off alignment which means I have to crank it up. But this one has driving guides so I could put it in deeper without it floating away and I was able to load and unload it alone. Course, I didnt have a choice either, wife is kinda picky about helping lol. All she will do is hold the rope pretty much lol. I was able to get the trailer close enough to the dock to walk into the boat, out onto the bow and jump down to tie it off after driving it onto the trailer. Climbed back up and over the bow, back to the back, onto the dock, and drove it out. Pretty simple.
 

Scott Danforth

Grumpy Vintage Moderator still playing with boats
Staff member
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Jul 23, 2011
Messages
50,301
Re: Cabin Cruiser advise anyone?

gas gauges are usually only an approximation because the fuel tanks are usually not rectangular in size, ,the boat never sits level, and the gauge and sender are usually not calibrated to the shape of the tank until you get into the newer J1939 (canbus) gauges
 

The Famous Grouse

Petty Officer 1st Class
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Sep 26, 2008
Messages
291
Re: Cabin Cruiser advise anyone?

I just looked at the door in my jeep and it has a tow capacity of 7,200lbs and a tongue weight of 1080lbs (It's a V8 5.7L 2007 Limited edition). It's not a light vehicle by any means compared to the older cherokees. It weights 4705lbs, fairly close to most modern trucks which are about 5000-5500lbs unless its some ungodly huge truck. Does anyone have any ideas on something that would fit this range? I would like to at least be able to haul it around without having to ask my dad to haul it with his Peterbilt.

You have to consider the whole package when you get up into something this size. You don't want to be towing right at the max because no matter what Jeep says, that vehicle was not designed for SUSTAINED towing at that weight level. Yes, it has the power needed to move that weight, but the cooling, transmission, and braking systems will be under TREMENDOUS strain.

Keep in mind, boat weights are quoted as "dry" weights. Meaning the boat with no fuel or water on board, no persoal gear, or anything. Obviously, for a real life towing situation this is not realistic. Fuel weighs (to use a round figure) 7 pounds per gallon. Using that figure, it would not be unusual to have 500 pounds of fuel on board that has to be added to the stated weight.

Next, you have to add the weight of a trailer. This is NOT insignificant when you're talking about a steel double or triple axle trailer. It would not be unusual for a trailer to add 2000++ pounds to the equation.

IMO, given your needs and you experience, I think you should consider scaling down to a small cruiser in the 24 foot range with an 8 foot beam and keep it to a single engine. That will keep you down somewhere in the 5-6k weight range which when other factors are added in should still make the boat towable.

Grouse
 
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