Chevy 350 rod knock - blown engine ??

[roscoe]

HI guys, a little story, then a question or two.<br />Any opinions or insight welcome.<br /><br />I'm kindof in the dark when it comes to the inner workings of car engines.<br /><br />Dad drives a 1993 full sized Chevy van, 350 engine.<br />He was on his way to Canada yesterday and got about 200 miles into the trip.<br />He glanced at the gauges and noticed the oil pressure was near zero. Temp gauge was normal. He pulled over and had the van towed 40 miles to my house.<br /><br />Today we started it up and the gauge registered some oil pressure and the engine has a mild knock, and seems to be a bit down on power ( hard for me to tell as I haven't driven it in 2 years).<br /><br />He drove it 4 miles to the Chevy dealer and had them take a look at it.<br />Within 10 minutes, they came back and told him he lost a rod bearing and that the engine was shot. Need to replace the engine.<br /><br />How did they diagnose this so fast, without opening it up?<br />Shouldn't they drop the oil pan and inspect the extent of the damage before asking for $4000 for a new engine?<br /><br />Can't you drop the pan and replace the bad bearing from the underside without replacing the engine?<br /><br />*** 1 week ago he had the intake manifold gasket replaced.<br />I noticed there is a lot of liquid gasket all over the intake area.<br />Anyone want to bet the guy dropped some globs of gasket into the block and they plugged up the oil pump?<br /><br />This afternoon, he took it to another dealer and they came back with the same diagnosis and solution. <br /><br />Anyway, the motor is shot and there is a huge van with a turtle top sitting in my driveway. (and 2 parents in my house !! )<br /><br />I happened to know of a Safari van for sale by a guy at work so we will be taking it for a ride in the morning. 2000 GMC Safari All-wheel-drive passenger van, 106,000 miles, tow package, asking $5200.

 

[michael-lagrange]

Re: Chevy 350 rod knock - blown engine ??

oil pressure creats a thin layer of oil between the rod bearing and crank shaft so the loss of pressure thus the loss of oil in the bearing resulted in a spun bearing wich probably ruined the crank shaft as well. why did he lose pressure? gasket sealer could very well be the cause. get a pro to remove the oil pan and check the screen on the oil pump if has gasket sealer all over it the guy who put the manifold together would be hereing from me with a liability claim. if you go that rout make sure the pro that inspects the screen or you be there with him take pictures and document every thing you can.<br /> How ever when repairs are done on an engine sluge particals can get broke lose and work there way into the oil system,after repairs like that the oil should be changed and changed again with new filter at 20 miles or so to make sure those lose particals have been removed.<br />I thnk this problem could have been avoided if you had used a good mechanic to start with.

 

[craze1cars]

Re: Chevy 350 rod knock - blown engine ??

A few thoughts...<br /><br />1. Intake manifold replaced 1 week ago, then the motor fails. That is too conincidental. As hammertime mentions you need to well document the tear-down of the motor with an independent appraiser to prove your case. May be pricy. but a few hundred bucks to hire an appraiser to do a tear-down may be an option if you feel it's worth it. Have you even bothered to contact the intake manifold mechanic? Was this one of the dealers you've visited? A simple phone call to the intake mechanic with an explanation of your suspicions can tell you a lot about the state of mind he's in. Legitimate mechanics and shop owners have insurance to cover them for these types of mistakes...if he freely volunteers to turn this into his own insurance company for investigation it's worth considering before you just give up and buy another van. But if it was done by a back-yard type of guy, you probably will be spinning your wheels and will get nowhere unless you want to take him to small claims court.<br /><br />2. Why go to 2 dealers for assessment and quotes? That's probably the most expensive way to replace/rebuild an engine. 350's are a dime a dozen. You have many alternatives....longblock, shortblock (assuming heads are still good), installing a reman motor bought from a local parts store, having this motor rebuilt by a local engine rebuilder, having the engine replaced with a used engine from a salvage yard (many salvage yards these days will offer full warranties on their low-mileage motors that rival that of rebuilds), and....most expensively...you can get a GM reman motor installed at a dealer.<br /><br />I see no reason this 350 can't be put back on the road with a very solid motor for under $2,000 with some of the other alternatives. Shop around for a better price. Much of this shopping can be done with a phonebook...EVERYONE knows exactly what they will charge to rebuild or replace a 350 in a full size Chevy van, and will quote you an honest price range over the phone, with few surprises.<br /><br />Good luck!

 

[rottenray6402]

Re: Chevy 350 rod knock - blown engine ??

Roscoe, how many miles are on the 350? You said it's in a 93 so chances are quite a few. If the original mechanic doesn't stand behind the repair (providing it was his fault) and the engine has 100K plus miles on it you may want to look at a reman versus redoing this engine. When you get into rebuilding a high mileage engine you need to replace almost everything to make sure you get your moneys worth. By the time all of the lifters, cam, timing chain, oil pump, etc are replaced it is usually more cost efficent to drop a reman in. Also much less labor cost.

 

[ndemge]

Re: Chevy 350 rod knock - blown engine ??

I rebuilt the 350 in my '71 van a few years back...<br /><br />by the time I was done with EVERYTHING, I was about $200 away from the price of a reman engine. 6 weeks spent from the time we yanked the engine, tore it down, sent to machine shop, re-assemble and install... 6 very long weeks with MANY hours involved.<br /><br />I'd go with the route stated above, have the engine looked at with a camera rolling the entire time. If you find the gasket stuff, go on from there, if not, drop a new one in and hit the road.

 

[roscoe]

Re: Chevy 350 rod knock - blown engine ??

Thanks for the replies.<br />I agree with your insight and advice.<br /><br />Dad is OLD, and doesn't have a feel for dealing with these situations. He doesn't understand anything the mechanics tell him, and his ignorance is obvious, so he is vulnerable.<br />He also has no stomach for conflict.<br /><br />Gasket mechanic is some small service garage he uses 250 miles away from where he is now. <br />Dad is on his way to Canada for a month, and is not gonna wait around for a rebuild, and doesn't really want to stick the money into a new engine for a 14 year old vehicle with 139,000 miles.<br /><br />The reason he took it to a second dealership, was that he couldn't believe they were able to fully diagnose the problem in under 10 minutes, just by listening to it. Both dealers only charged him 15 minutes labor on the invoice, so it didn't take long.<br /><br />So we took the Safari for a spin an hour ago, and dad actually seemed to like it. Took it to my mechanic to have major systems checked out. If all is ok, dad will buy it (cause mom told him to ) . Then we will spend a day or two going over it to make sure all is well, and they will be on their way. <br /><br />Seems like a wonderful way for me to spend my holiday weekend.

 

[rottenray6402]

Re: Chevy 350 rod knock - blown engine ??

Best of luck to your parents, it is kind of heart tugging when your parents get to that age and you really want to choke the jerks that would take advantage of older people like that. I was in the auto repair business quite some time ago and it seems that replacing the 93 is probably the smart thing to do. It would seem the all wheel drive Safari will be a bonus in your climate. Probably a little better gas mileage also.

 

[JB]

Re: Chevy 350 rod knock - blown engine ??

The origin of the term "Hot Rod" comes from rod failures in model T Ford engines that had been modified beyond the bottom end ability to bear the stress. <br /><br />Just a bit of historical trivia.

 

[BoatBuoy]

Re: Chevy 350 rod knock - blown engine ??

I know it's not what you wanted to do with your weekend, but at some point, you'll wish for more of those times..... but they won't be there.

 

[roscoe]

Re: Chevy 350 rod knock - blown engine ??

Interesting JB.<br /><br />I know BoatBuoy. I wanted to go fishing, as this is a 4 day weekend for me, and I will only get 2 of these this year. And usually only get one day off at a time.<br />I asked them to go with me and they both had a list of reasons why they did not want to go. They think I should be working on my house. Argggg. So now I will sit and watch dad read the paper, and mom talk on the phone and putz around in my house.

 

[roscoe]

Re: Chevy 350 rod knock - blown engine ??

OK, bought the Safari van, had seller repair the heater/defroster/vent diverter motor and we picked it up from the dealer this morning. Installed new trailer pigtail, removed seats, inspected everything, had dad read the manual. <br /><br />I think he really likes it.<br />I know he likes the visability advantage over the full sized conversion he had.<br /><br />Put the receiver hitch in, bought him some new footmats, and a new serpentine to put in the toolbox - just in case.<br /><br />Not sure if they will be leaving on Saturday or early Sunday morning, but everything has gone as smoothly as you could ever expect.<br /><br />Now, what to do with the old one. Maybe I will list it in the thrifties classifieds.