Dealer said to NOT use a transom saver when trailering

[walleyehed]

Re: Dealer said to NOT use a transom saver when trailering

In relation to the postion of the transom, where are you suggesting the trailer flexes????

 

[JasonJ]

Re: Dealer said to NOT use a transom saver when trailering

**Yawn**. There is only leverage if the load is not balanced. The greater length of the leg is only a factor if force is applied to the very end of it. Otherwise the pivot point sees equal load on each side. Like I said before, I don't think it is hurting anything to use one, I just don't feel it is necessary. Don't even start the physics class junk, it is easy to spout "facts" on a message forum. People assume too much when it comes to the education levels of others when on these forums. The simple fact of the matter is if the boat is healthy, properly built, strapped to the trailer properly, and the mechanism that is holding the motor is of the appropriate strength, a tansom saver is little more that a "peace of mind saver". If the whole shebang is dodgy, a transom saver certainly won't hurt. One example of someones two year old boat proves little when a lot of us see countless rigs being ran for years without the transom saver. I am ending my participation in this discussion with this statement: If you sleep better at night using a transom saver, then use it, regardless of what all the "experts" on some forum say. If you sleep fine without using one, well thats just fine as well.

 

[walleyehed]

Re: Dealer said to NOT use a transom saver when trailering

Yea, this topic is getting old....<br />Balance on a pivot point is just that...balance on ONE pivot point, sitting still.<br />The outboard has 3 torsional points, most of the people here only understand or except one of those 3 points, but as was mentioned above, "Regardless of what the so-called experts say".<br />So, in closing for me as well...TEAR'EM UP boys, I'm in the buisness of repair!<br /> In the interest of tonycliffy's post: Do as your dealer recommends and prepare for repair down the road.

 

[kd6nem]

Re: Dealer said to NOT use a transom saver when trailering

This must be the most beat to death topic ever on Iboats.<br /><br />Walleyehed, I'll bite on this one. "3 torsional points"? The normal up/down that most refer to is one. Another is the side to side used in steering? And the third I can imagine would be mostly while underway on the water- the result of torque and "P-factor". Also if one tire hits a chuck hole while the other doesn't. This last one, even the last two would seem relatively minor in terms of transom integrity. Am I even close to what you're thinking? By the way, I don't disagree with your technical statements here. <br /><br />JasonJ, I mostly agree with you also. But if it is so well balanced why does it bounce? It is somewhat balanced with regard to a symmetry about the pivot point, though there is still going to be a net rotational force being exerted. SOMETHING has to absorb that force. Some transoms are up to that task, others are not. And when resonance is occasionally introduced you get major problems in a hurry. And there is the hydraulics to consider as well. <br /><br />Anyway, while there is a big bunch of force pretty much continuously applied while in the water, the forces are significantly different in nature while on the trailer. The duration of the force, the potential accelleration of the motor against the mount, as well as the angle of force applied (vector) are different than when in the water. (Trailering is probably less in total torsional force, but much greater in sharpness/intensity) In the water you also have hydrodynamic resistance on the lower unit which dampens and offsets this torsion to some degree. The mount usually spreads this force out over a larger surface area when the LU is down in the water as well. The boat is primarily designed for that force to be utilized in the water- trailering is secondary. Sure, many boats never seem to suffer without a transom saver, but many do. I've never heard of a transom saver in good condition and properly installed doing anything except preventing damage, but I have seen damage when not used. But, to each their own....

 

[trebor135]

Re: Dealer said to NOT use a transom saver when trailering

Do they make a transom saver that will work with an Armstrong or Gil bracket, or is it necessary on this type of application?

 

[WillyBWright]

Re: Dealer said to NOT use a transom saver when trailering

Walleyehed, you've never seen metal flex? All trailers flex as they go down the road. ALL of them. Some a lot, some not so much. When they flex, that's when you have problems with transom savers on rigidly fixed motors. On boats without power trim, the motor is free to move with the subtle movements caused by a fairly rigid boat and a somewhat flexible trailer. Lock it down with hydraulics and the hydraulics, transom, and various motor pivot points are subject to stress. Remove that rigidity and the motor is free to move with the forces applied and the stress is all butt removed. Like I said, all you have to do is relieve the hydraulics to let things move. Simple 20 second procedure and nobody does it.

 

[BillP]

Re: Dealer said to NOT use a transom saver when trailering

I take the same position Jason says...use one if it makes you feel better. They are ok devices if you want to use them.<br /><br />Trailer flex has been mentioned...if your trailer doesn't flex during travel it is RARE. They all flex, some more, some less. Ask the guys who make them and ask the guys who deliver them. It isn't brand specific.<br /><br />Now, for those who are physics experts...I'd really appreciate some calculations on the forces of trailering VS jumping off ocean waves with a 200hp outboard.

 

[WillyBWright]

Re: Dealer said to NOT use a transom saver when trailering

I'm no Physicist, but I think it has more to do with the kind of shock. Hit a bump with a trailer and the shock is more like hitting a nail with a 1 pound metal hammer. Jump waves and it's more like hitting a nail with a 10 pound rubber mallet. Which one is going to drive the nail into the board? Although I'm sure the amount of stress from jumping waves is far greater, it isn't as instantaneous. The water cushions the shock.<br /><br />And you're absolutely right about trailer flex not being brand-specific. You'd think those big I-beam aluminum trailers they use under off-shore boats would be quite rigid. Towing them around a bumpy boatyard without a boat on and you wouldn't believe how much they flex.<br /><br />It's not so much lateral stress as longitudianl stress. When the trailer bows from hitting a bump or whatever, it pushes on that transom saver which in turn pushes on the gearcase. If the motor is rigidly fixed and not allowed to pivot, that's when the problems occur. And to think that all you need is a few twists on a valve with a common screwdriver to eliminate that.

 

[roscoe]

Re: Dealer said to NOT use a transom saver when trailering

But Willy, us some of us poor folks have tnt systems that don't have a manual release screw.

 

[tee-boy]

Re: Dealer said to NOT use a transom saver when trailering

You've got the same type of flex in a boat as you do with a trailer. The longitudal bending of a boat when it hits a wave is why we need longitudal runners (much more important than latitudal runners). Just ask the engineers who build these things for a living.

 

[WillyBWright]

Re: Dealer said to NOT use a transom saver when trailering

I'm going thru my memory banks and trying to think of a trim system without a manual release valve...not having much luck, but I think that's true with early OMC add-on systems. But I will certainly concede that Mercury's plastic release valves wouldn't stand-up to a lot of twisting and that's for sure.<br /><br />One reason for the stringers is certainly for the reason you say tee-boy. But you have pretty tall sides on the boat that do more for the boat than the 3 or 4 inches of a trailer frame does for the trailer. That's the point. The flex differential. Trailers flex alot and boats flex very little. When the trailer flexes more than the boat, that's when you get the stress on the transom transmitted by the transom saver to the gearcase which is hanging out there a ways and adding leverage to the effect.<br /><br />I guess what I'm trying to say is that transom savers are good things...if they're used correctly and properly maintained. On a lot of boats I've seen, that isn't the case and that's apparently been the experience of the dealer that sold tonycliffy's boat to him, at least with his particular package. The shock absorbing models are the way to go if you have a motor with trim and tilt and I'm sure one of those would serve Tony well. I will also say that when I'm done restoring my son's 11' MererCraft I'll get one or make one, but the motor doesn't have hydraulics. It may or not have shock absorbing capabilities, but for that boat it isn't a worry.

 

[roscoe]

Re: Dealer said to NOT use a transom saver when trailering

Willy fyi, I have a 1995 Force 70 hp, two wire external motor and a single ram. No manual release. The lack of a manual release on these motors has been a topic twice, that I know of. One was a fellow that could not raise his motor to trailer it home, left it at the ramp I think. The other was a guy that wanted to move his son's boat that was blocking the driveway.

 

[WillyBWright]

Re: Dealer said to NOT use a transom saver when trailering

You know, I've hardly ever seen one of those except at school. I don't know why, but it seems like there's precious few of those out there. It's almost like it jumps from 55 to 85 and I've never figured out why. Probably because Bayliner doesn't seem to use them. If I remember correctly the 70 is a 90 with a single carb? Frankly I wouldn't hesitate to put one on one of those on a Bayliner that's rated for the twin except for the Law. I have little doubt that the boat would handle it.<br /><br />Keep those Tombstone pizzas coming! I have one waiting for dinner tomorrow. Had a Palermo's last week. Sucked bigtime! So they use fake ingredients now that Kraft bought them out? Some upper management decisions really suck, don't they? We have a Kraft plant just two blocks from my house. They make Philly Cream Cheese and related dairy products. And I'm nowhere near Philadelphia. Same wonderful state as you. GO PACK!!! Favre Rules!