Did I buy the wrong trailer

[Johnny Be Cool]

I have a 1990 Regal Ambassador 233 XL Cabin Cruiser.

I am borrowing a friends 20' Tahoe trailer that is used for a Bass Boat.
I just bought a Continental trailer. It measures 24' from ball to the rear cross member. The width between the fenders is 60".

I don't know but after I got it home and started to really look at things, it looks too narrow or is that an optical illusion.

The seller said he had a 24' Cabin Cruiser on it. He bought the Boat and trailer, kept the trailer, motor & outdrive, the boat was trashed.

I really don't care for the poles sticking up, I rebuilding the 2 x 4's that are carpeted and bolt horizontal on top of the poles, the 2x4's are 3' in the rear and 1 1/2' in the front.

The boat is suppose to rest on the center of the frame rollers and the 2x4's keep it for balance.

My concern is this, is it too narrow and the boat will tip over or am I being too cautious. I could add bunk rails.

Here's a picture of my boat and the new trailer (1986).

What do you think?

 

[nlain]

Re: Did I buy the wrong trailer

I would put bunks under that boat, you have to hit dead center to get it to rest on the rollers, it will also lean to one side or the other unless the side boards are a form fit. You need bunks to hold the load.

 

[Frank Acampora]

Re: Did I buy the wrong trailer

I would not say you bought the wrong trailer, but I think you could have done better. You have some work to do on it. The trailer is rugged--all channel iron construction--but now, with a 24 foot boat on a 24 foot trailer (from ball) you are still going to have a good bit of overhang at the stern. Remember that the winch post will take at lease a foot.

Replace those round posts that were designed to hold bunks. Since the trailer is generic in design, you have the option to install what you want, where you want, to best fit your hull. If it were my trailer and boat, I would install a combination of rollers and bunks with the bunks under the strakes. I would seriously think about extending the tongue about two feet so the hull stern would be close to the rear roller and bunks (if you install them.) for proper support

All in all, it really depends upon whether you are going to store the boat on the trailer or only use it to get the boat to its slip. You didn't really say the expected use.

The trailer is 6 feet between the rails which makes it close to 8 feet at the fenders--the usual legal size. If you tip over that trailer and hull, you are going WAY too fast.

 

[Johnny Be Cool]

Re: Did I buy the wrong trailer

I was thinking the same thing. Where can I get some good prices on bunk braces. What type would you use. If you notice in the picture, the cross members are straight not vee'd as in most V- Hull trailers.

The trailer has a GVWR 5900 lbs.
Cross members are 4" C channel and main frame is 5", it tilts and has a 2 5/16 ball, so I guess it's a pretty stout trailer.

I was mostly concerned about tipping sidways on the wheels. The outter ends of the fenders to one side to another is 6'5". My boats beam is 8'4" and weighs 4000 lbs.

Any need for concern or I'm I being a too cautious.

 

[Frank Acampora]

Re: Did I buy the wrong trailer

Ahh! I misread the width as 6 feet instead of 60 inches. But no, I still don't think it is too bad. Sure, with the narrow beam and height you will need to be careful, but I think at reasonable speeds you will be OK.

If I were on my home computer, I could show you my smaller 15 foot rig. It is only about 5 feet from wheel to wheel and the boat is about 7 at the widest. It also does not have dropped center members so the hull sits high. She trailers OK--a little lean on the corners but never anything scary. Of course, we are comparing a little boat to a fairly large one. But you as the driver need to feel out the handling.

There is always the option of stiffening the spring rate if you feel there is too much lean.

 

[Johnny Be Cool]

Re: Did I buy the wrong trailer

Frank,

That's good to hear. I've been looking on line and in my area for months for a trailer. I thought in my hast that I bought the wrong size trailer. I was so concerned on length. Watch as the seaon comes to an end there be trailers for sale all over the place. That's how things usally work with me.

Did you install the bunks or did it come with the trailer.
Do you think I need (4) 2x4's lying flat or (2) 2x6's standing up.

Also once I get the boat on the trailer, how does one measure the correct height. I figure all of the weight is on the keel rollers and if you just push the boards up to the hull, it still isn't taking the weight off of the keel rollers.

 

[Dave1251]

Re: Did I buy the wrong trailer

I do not think that I you can get this set up to work. The boat needs to be supported by the bunks, not the rollers. The boat will need to sit high enough to clear the trailer fenders.

You will also have too much boat hanging of the back with no support. Tongue weight will also be an issue.

 

[sasto]

Re: Did I buy the wrong trailer

I just completed a tow from NJ to FL with the same size boat and trailer. The 1974 Penn Yan hung over the back by a good 4 feet. She has a beam of 9 feet (I know it was illegal without permit). I moved her foreward 18 inches and she had to much tounge weight and swayed dramatically. Moved her back and she rode fine. I hope others find your trailer acceptable too.

 

[Bondo]

Re: Did I buy the wrong trailer

I figure all of the weight is on the keel rollers and if you just push the boards up to the hull, it still isn't taking the weight off of the keel rollers.

Ayuh,.... That ain't quite Right,... I setup trailers to carry the weight on the bunks,...
Those rollers won't hold that kinda weight, without bendin' their axles...
I like 70% on the bunks,+ 30%, Tops, on the rollers...

If the bunks are 2x6, they can overhang the frame,+ still carry the weight, to help lengthen the wagon overall too..
The deepness of the hull will determine whether you use 2x4s, or 2x6s, or 2x8s, or whatevers...
And of course the brackets choosen...
You might conside 4 runs of bunks, instead of 2 as well...

Also,... Are you sayin' it's 6', 5" Inside the fenders, or outside,..??
Inside is No Problem, outside, that's danm Narrow...

The axle truck is gonna need to be moved back too,... Way back...

Ayuh,...
That looks like a decent wagon to Start with, but she needs abit of refittin' to haul that barge.....

Btw,.... Could you resize those pictures dwn to iboats' standard forum size of 480x640,..??
I HATE havin' to sidescroll to post answers,.....

 

[gozierdt]

Re: Did I buy the wrong trailer

How wide is the trailer that you show the boat sitting on? That's about the narrowest trailer I'd think of for that boat. If the boat beam is 8'6", then that red trailer looks to be about the same, or a bit narrower, maybe 8'. The wheels on your trailer will be one foot inside the beam of your boat on each side. One thing you could think about doing is installing new, wider, axles, (or having a good welder cut your axles in the middle and lengthen them appropiately) and having a good certified welder put on a 5" depth frame on each side of the trailer to widen the spring perch spacing to match the wider axles. You don't say what state you are in, but all the one's I'm aware of allow you to go to either 8' or 8' 6" max width.

Also, Bondo is right about the bunks. For that boat, I'd plan four bunks, two longer ones (10' or so, depending on where the crossmembers are) outside the inner run or strakes on the hull, two shorter ones further out near the chines- maybe 5' long. Adjust them so the majority of the weight is on the bunks as Bondo suggests.

 

[JimS123]

Re: Did I buy the wrong trailer

FYI, opinions from the web...

http://www.thuletrailers.com/advice-a-guidance/boat-trailers

http://www.ehow.com/how_6467533_adjust-boat-trailer-bunks.html

 

[Johnny Be Cool]

Re: Did I buy the wrong trailer

I'm getting a little freaked by your reply's.

The red borrowed trailer is a Q8 Tahoe, it has a bed frame 6'-5" across.
The Galvanized trailer (just bought) has a bed frame width of 5'
The outside fender to fender on the Galv. measurement is 6'5".

Yes, the boat will stick out a bit and will sit a little higher due to the cross member being straight.

I was thinking of spanning 4 cross members (8'-5") or 5 cross members (11'-3") with 2x6 bunks, that's using one on each side, using 12" swivel bolster brackets.

From the center of the Keel and 2ft. out comes pretty close to the fender, because of that I was thinking of taking the poles that are originally on the Galv. trailer there putting 2 on each side of the end w/ 4' 2x4 for additional balance support.

I really don't have the money to chop and rebuild. It is a strong trailer, 4" C-Channel for cross member and 5" C-channel frame, 24' from ball to rear.

I'm very concerned for the first time putting the boat on the trailer, because everything is a guesstimate. I don't know if the boat tip over when I pulled out of water. I hoping the 2 poles on each end will aid. Then once out of water I can strap the boat and make adjustments.

Any thoughts?????

 

[Johnny Be Cool]

Re: Did I buy the wrong trailer

Bond-O,
In response to your questions, The bed frame width is 5' (Inside Dia).

Your saying to use (4) bunks. 2x6's like this------
___________
________
________
___________ Rear

Also, are you saying to move the wheel assembly further back.
How far before the last frame rail?

Attached are pictures showing the underneath. Sorry I don't know how to resize.
The borrowed trailer (Tahoe) is 6'5" inside fender to fender. The Galv. Trailer is 6'5" outside fender to fender.

 

[reelfishin]

Re: Did I buy the wrong trailer

Anything can be made to work.
The problem will be launching the boat on that trailer.
The boat will sit so high you may have problems finding a ramp deep enough to float the thing off.

If you do modify it to work, I'd do at least one set of 2x6 bunks at the stern, overhanging just past the transom, I'd also consider maybe a second set for stability run parallel to the first pair to spread out the weight a bit.
Some sort of guide ons will also make life easier.
You may still end up with a rig that's nearly impossible to launch at all but the very deepest ramps.

That trailer also looks pretty light duty to me, those clamp on bunk poles aren't meant to hold a really heavy boat and the rollers look small to me.
The last tandem axle bunk trailer I had here under a 22' boat had 12" bunk rollers, four rear bunks and two support bunks up front, along with a 70" wide V cross member frame with four 14" wheels.
I would think that a V framed trailer with a pair of drop axles with brakes would be ideal for your boat. Maybe you can set that trailer up and sell it for profit or trade it for one that's better suited?

 

[Johnny Be Cool]

Re: Did I buy the wrong trailer

reelfishin,
That was some very good advise. Thank You!
I'm kinda in a jam right now. The person whom I'm borrowing the red trailer from needs it back and I can't afford to buy another trailer and then later sell this one.
I know I could modify it and I guess I'll have to drive deep into the water to launch it, but my biggest concern is width. I was so excited about finding a trailer that length that I could afford that I over looked the width when the seller said he had a 24 Cabin Cruiser on it. Who knows if he was telling the truth.

I'm worried that once I get the boat on the trailer, that it might tip over. I've been up all night since getting this trailer trying to justify keeping the trailer.

I live in the hills of Arkansas, on a whindy, dirt, uneven 3 mile road to the house. I feel if the boat gets on an uneven plane that it could easliy tip over, or is it that I'm too inexperience and really have nothing to worry about, just be smart when towing it.

What about what Bond-O said, moving the wheels further back. How far back?

If the majority on this site says don't use it, then I won't. I don't want my inexperience to cause a major accident and again, am I a worry wort?

I see your from NJ, that's my home state. I miss the ocean, but I like the smooth lakes & mountains out here. I moved here few years ago and never regretted it.

 

[JimS123]

Re: Did I buy the wrong trailer

Its going to sit high, that's a given. I have run trailers just like that, but not with a boat that big or heavy. I wouldn't personally be afraid of launching that rig at the ramps I use, but since I haven't seen your ramps and have no idea how deep or steep they are, I can't say if you will have a problem or not.

I will say, though, that unless you use the rollers they way they are intended, you WILL have launching problems.

I'd go with the 2x6 approach, positioned vertically. I'd also replace all the rollers with hard poly Stoltz rollers. The black rubber ones offer a lot more friction because they compress more under the weight.

 

[Johnny Be Cool]

Re: Did I buy the wrong trailer

Yes, I understand.

How do you feel about the wheel carriage being moved or not. If moved back how far?

As for the bunks, how much do I let them overhang the last cross member.

Still need to be addressed.
How does one feel about the boat tipping over after its on the trailer. What I'm getting at is that the wheel spacing (end to end 6'-5") could be too narrow. It's like an Elephant skating on a single blade. Do you think I'll be OK. I'd like someone with experience tell me instead of finding out first hand.

The Lakes around here "Table Rock (near Branson, Missiouri) and Bull Shouls lake are both built by the Army Corp of Engineers, I've had 2 boats prior and all of the ramps are well built with a lot of drop off.

 

[JimS123]

Re: Did I buy the wrong trailer

From the pictures its not evident how easily the wheel carriage can be moved. I will go under the assumption that it can.

The proper way to set up a trailer is to position the boat properly on the frame first, then move the wheels as necessary to get the proper tongue weight (5-10% of the total load). With a tandem trailer, its safe to go on the lower end of the range. My tandem's tongue weight is only about 4% and it runs true up to 65 mph. You want the boat supported right, thus you don't move the boat to get the tongue weight.

I personally think the transom should be located right on the rearmost roller for proper support. (Ask me how I know.....LOL.... I once put a hook in my hull when I didnt!) You posted the length of the trailer, but not the boat. So, maybe if you set it up like I said you might need a longer tongue.

Take measurements on the hull to get an idea of the deadrise, so when you install the bunks you will have an idea where to set them. Put them maybe an inch too low at first, so you can winch the boat on the trailer while it runs on the rollers. I'd position them only an inch or 2 past the last crosmember, since the boat won't be sticking out much further anyway. Also, position them out as far as possible from the keel, to afford the best stability. If you have an appropriately located sponson, put the bunks slightly inboard to help with centering when loading.

When you first load the boat and pull up on the ramp, the boat may be leaning a bit. Be prepared to stop and raise the bunks till they firmly contact the hull. I'd use a pair of sacissors jacks and just go back and forth from one side to the other till the boat is level.

Finally, check the tongue weight and adjust the wheels for or aft as necesary. The last time I did one I merely supported the back of the frame with jackstands, then raised the front with jacks till the springs started to decompress. Then, remove the bolts holding the axle assembly and move it to the next hole. Might have to move it more than once till you get the right weight.

I don't really see wheel spacing as an issue. The trailer is not going to tip over. The main concern is whether the hull will clear the fenders. Go back to your deadrise measurements, put a straight edge along the roller line and then be sure the hull will be high enough above the fenders.

One last caveat......just be sure the capacity of the trailer and the tires exceed your boat's weight.

 

[Johnny Be Cool]

Re: Did I buy the wrong trailer

JimS123,
Very well written and I understand. I appreciate your concern in helping me. For a 23' boat it's pretty fat, a 1990 Regal 233 XL Ambassador. It was a little intimidating to me. I see if I use logic, spread the weight on the bed frame and balance the tounge weight, I see that I could put some use to this trailer.

I'll go on line to order new keel rollers, I like the ideal of replacing the rubber ones. I'll also get several 12" bolster bunk braces, I believe I'll have 9" up from the frame to the boat and additional 4" on the frame.
I'll use 2x6's and let 2 of them hang about 8" from the last crossmember (transom).
I'll also use the existing poles, but put 2 on each rear end for balance spanned with a 4' 2x4.
Last I believe is the tounge weight and maybe move the wheels back.

I appreciate everyone's time, Thank You!
I am very appreciative to have a website as iboats, I would of been lost and maybe would of made some careless mistakes.

If anything else, I'll drop a line. Good Day!

 

[Bondo]

Re: Did I buy the wrong trailer

Last I believe is the tounge weight and maybe move the wheels back.

Ayuh,... you want between 10%, and 15% of the total weight on the hitch...