Did I do the right thing?

[cheburashka]

Re: Did I do the right thing?

I have to agree with you there, sometimes a good whooping is all that works.
If they don't learn with the first one, keep it up, sooner or later they get the message. Sometimes the dumber ones take a few good beatings before they learn.

More "psychobabble" here I guess, but what I've read, and seen, is that abuse begets abuse. The guys who do this kind of thing--beating up on women and children--were almost always beaten up on a regular basis by their parents. Sometimes a beating knocks some sense into you, but I think more often than not, it knocks the sense out of you.

If beating a kid up made him smarter, you'd think a lot of these kids would be rocket scientists by now instead of wife abusers or child abusers.

 

[jkust]

Re: Did I do the right thing?

In this sue happy world, I wouldn't have gotten involved. If he was beating her in public I would have simply called the cops.

Think of it like this.... what if you hit the guy and he fell back and broke his neck. Now he's in a wheelchair and looking for a paycheck.... see where this is going?

Unfortunatly ethics and the law diverge manytimes. Sure you did the right thing ethically but the legal consequenses of a broken neck could have been huge.

 

[QC]

Re: Did I do the right thing?

While there is obviously some truth to your comments cheburashka, the risk is using that as an excuse for doing nothing in a similar situation as that faced by the OP. I personally cheer how in this example the OP fell on the side of doing something. Regardless of the cause and effect, weaker innocents should always be protected and stronger bad guys must be confronted. The thought of standing by while someone is beaten is little different than letting a man bleed to death while worrying about personal legal risk. Both are examples of a heartless society that I want no part of.

 

[j_martin]

Re: Did I do the right thing?

It's interesting to me that in the story of the good Samaritan, the Priest that passed by was the religeous upper crust, and the Levite was a combination of religeous and political upper crust. Neither would have done anything that would be illegal. The Samaritan had no obligation to help the victim, but his compassion compelled him to do it. Considering the legal tennor of the day, it was probably actually illegal for him to touch the victim. He helped the victim at his own expense, expecting nothing in return, and probably risking persecution in the process. He is the one Jesus praised.

All it takes for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing.

my 02
John

 

[BoatBuoy]

Re: Did I do the right thing?

QC, I don't think anyone here would take issue with how gallant and noble it is to defend those suffering. After all, the folks suffering during/after Katrina were well taken care of, right? The OP was actually dealing with self-defense after a point, and I doubt anyone has issues with that either.

But right now, this thread has migrated (as usual) from those issues to the issue of beating someone to make them stop beating someone, which makes complete sense, right?

 

[QC]

Re: Did I do the right thing?

I understand the migration of the thread and the irony of beating someone to make them stop beating . . . Some here have been critical of the OPs decision to get involved at all, and has lead to the "Psychobabble" on both sides. I stand by my comments.

Note to all: I know that I am engaged in this debate and may be crossing the line into what some may think is becoming, or has been, contentious. I wouldn't necessarily say that, but I am not the Supreme Being even in my own home Please keep this discussion as civil as possible or it will be gone.

 

[KRH1326]

Re: Did I do the right thing?

You did the ONLY thing to do.

Been involved in a similar but different situation. Girl and and jerk did side back up and pressed charges on my bud. ( He got to the guy first ). Cop was too smart and KNEW what the score was. He PURPOSELY filed his reports, fingerprinted and mug shot my bro , took all of his statements on the ENTIRE episode, then very coyly realized that he had forgotten to read my bud his rights.

This could have gone real bad for my bud. He tooled the clown real good. But justice seems to find a way.... sometimes.

You did the right, and honorable thing.

 

[Bob_VT]

Re: Did I do the right thing?

Mrs. Bob_VT here. Bob pointed this out to me as I work at our local women's shelter.
First of all good on the original poster for stepping and making it plain that domestic violence is not ok. I'm sorry that it got physical but can't fault you for returning a punch thrown at you!

Some have pointed out that once the batterer is released the victim is very likely in further danger. You're correct in saying that, however as long as she's with that guy she's in danger. At least someone has shown her that it is not ok that she's being beaten. Most victims have been almost brainwashed by their batterer that no one cares what happens to them, they are worthless, that it is normal in a relationship and that it is her fault.

Some have pointed out that she will probably go back and statistics say they are very likely right about that. It takes an average of 7 to 10 attempts for a victim to leave a batterer before they make it out for good. Maybe this is the time she leaves once and for all and the OP helped her to do it. It is probably the most difficult part of my job that a woman we help get a TRO, shelter until it is served, work with to find options for housing/work/support and then decides to go back. Chances are we will help them again in the future and maybe that will be the time they really leave. So that's why we keep trying to help, so that victims will keep trying to leave. I won't bore you all with the cycle of domestic violence or the laundry list of why she stays with him. I will say that if you can do something to support a victim, even something that seems small like listening you may be part of what helps her get the courage to leave once and for all.

As far as pressing charges on domestic assault, it may not be her choice. Here in Vermont it is the state that presses charges not the victim. If the police have a prosecuteable case it goes forward whether the victim wants it to or not. YMMV in other states.

Thanks to the OP for helping out and thanks to all of you for letting me hop up on my soap box!

 

[cheburashka]

Re: Did I do the right thing?

While there is obviously some truth to your comments cheburashka, the risk is using that as an excuse for doing nothing in a similar situation as that faced by the OP. I personally cheer how in this example the OP fell on the side of doing something. Regardless of the cause and effect, weaker innocents should always be protected and stronger bad guys must be confronted. The thought of standing by while someone is beaten is little different than letting a man bleed to death while worrying about personal legal risk. Both are examples of a heartless society that I want no part of.

I think the OP did exactly as he should have. He intervened and he didn't throw the first punch. That's exactly how the situation should have been handled. My beef is with people who think they can remedy a long-standing situation of domestic violence by beating the crap out of the abuser. The OP successfully derailed a nasty situation, and did so in a way that kept him relatively safe from any legal action, and should be congratulated for it. However, comparing his example to some of the others that have been brought up does him a disservice.

 

[QC]

Re: Did I do the right thing?

Agreed ^^^^^^ I guess BoatBuoy was right in noting my confusion. My concern is that some will use the baseless more violence will never stop violence as an excuse to do nothing. Your distinction is important although painful stimuli can work wonders . . .

 

[Grant Brown]

Re: Did I do the right thing?

There have been studies done that suggest abusers who get away with it in public, view the indifference of the witnesses as approval. The then continue or escalate the abuse.

All it takes is one person to simply say something for some of these guys to get the message that society doesn't think it's ok.

I once interrupted a rape in progress and beat the @$$hole half to death. He was in the hospital for more than a week. The cops interviewed me and off the record told me that they were glad (they knew him). I think the report was that I hit him and then he fell down some stairs (true) which resulted in this other injuries.

I am sure that he, and this guy will think twice before threatening a woman in public again.

I believe that as a man, I have a honor duty to protect those who are weaker.

 

[TilliamWe]

Re: Did I do the right thing?

I think the OP did exactly as he should have. He intervened and he didn't throw the first punch.

Whoa, hold on there. Both you and Mrs BobVT have said that he didn't throw the first punch. But from what I read, he DID throw the first punch. I don't think that carp means anything anyway, it's not always the person that throws first that starts a fight.
If I am wrong, someone, original poster, please clarify for me. As I have said twice now, I still support his actions, and would back him up in any criminal or civil proceeding, to the best extent of my ability.

 

[Bart Sr.]

Re: Did I do the right thing?

Whoa, hold on there. Both you and Mrs BobVT have said that he didn't throw the first punch. But from what I read, he DID throw the first punch. I don't think that carp means anything anyway, it's not always the person that throws first that starts a fight.
If I am wrong, someone, original poster, please clarify for me. As I have said twice now, I still support his actions, and would back him up in any criminal or civil proceeding, to the best extent of my ability.

He didn't throw the first punch.He landed the first punch in self defense.

The situation was diffused so all is well.

 

[TilliamWe]

Re: Did I do the right thing?

Gotcha, I re-read his post and I misunderstood about the waiting to throw a punch part. (Either way, was okay in my book.)

 

[jay_merrill]

Re: Did I do the right thing?

Lots of opinions here, but there is a bottom line. When you find yourself witnessing an assault, or one that is about to happen, you have to make a split second decision. You don't always have the luxury of time to engage in attempts to defuse the situation, call the police or engage in a bunch of mental gymnastics about a potential lawsuit, etc.

So, you act or you don't. Its just that simple.

 

[Thad]

Re: Did I do the right thing?

Lots of opinions here, but there is a bottom line. When you find yourself witnessing an assault, or one that is about to happen, you have to make a split second decision. You don't always have the luxury of time to engage in attempts to defuse the situation, call the police or engage in a bunch of mental gymnastics about a potential lawsuit, etc.

So, you act or you don't. Its just that simple.

Well said. Like I said earlier, he acted without regard to his own personal safety. That in and of itself is heroic and a good deed. We are all, as members of a civilized society, charged with protecting and caring the weak. Whether we like it or not. You do have the right to ignore that responsibility, but then who is wrong? The abuser or the one who lets it go?

Again, I support his actions 100%. And if any legal action were to follow, I would donate to his defense fund.

 

[Tacklewasher]

Re: Did I do the right thing?

Thanks to Mrs. Bob_VT for posting. Insight like yours is helpful and thank you for doing the work you do. It is very much needed and probably pretty thankless. I know I could not do it (I'd get too pissed at the women who go back to get beaten up again).

With regards to the OP. Other guy threw a punch, he responded by decking him (I read that as one punch returned that landed well) and showed tremendous restraint in not kicking the you know what out of him.

Very good on you. You did the right thing and I doubt anyone could suggest what you did broke the law given what you described.

 

[HappierWet]

Re: Did I do the right thing?

I think the important part of this is that the op hit the guy once and it was over.....It wasn't a matter of kicking the crap out him or making it some kind of teaching tool. It was the bare minimum of required force to defuse the situation. Do we really need to go into the what if this or what if that scenarios? I would have done the same thing but, honestly, probably with less restraint.
As far as good conscience goes til there is a gun or knife in the mix you just won't know. BUT, That poor SOB better use it and not just wave it around, cause at the point it comes out he has ability and intent to cause great bodily injury and the rules change. BIG TIME.

 

[captharv]

Re: Did I do the right thing?

I applaud you for your actions.
Howver, would I have done the same thing? No.
For many reasons, I would not have interveined in that situation. I am only 5-7 and not a fighter. The parties involved are not people I know. In many domestic situations, they turn onto the do-gooder. Both of them against you, and even if you win its 2 stories against your one. I spent a part of my earlier years doing in home electronic repairs, and learned fast to stay out of the domestic squabbles.
If She REALLY wanted to get away from him, there are many organizations which would have helped, and probably have sent him to jail.
I would have called 911 and reported it and stated that if the law did not get there soon, the situation would escalate into injury or worse. This is their job. Then placed my self at a respectable distance, and monitored until the law showed up.
Its a fact that more cops are injured responding to a domestic call than anything else? Thats why they usually send more than 1 cop. One cop to quell the problem, and the other(s) to protect the cop.

 

[cheburashka]

Re: Did I do the right thing?

It's hard to say what I would have done in that situation. I'm no fighter, but I don't think I'd be able to watch something like that going on. Part of me thinks that I'd still step between them. My thought is that if this guy did hit me, at lease someone would be able to press charges against him even if his girlfriend won't.