Don't raise the minimum wage!!!

[RubberFrog]

Re: Don't raise the minimum wage!!!

Got that right Frog, How about we legislate a new car every year, a $250.000 home for everyone, let's not stop there, a new Lear in every hanger, a 150" Yacht, 4 cars per household...... WE can make flippin' burgers pay!!!!!!!.... Socialism for all!!!!!!!, that’s what this country needs.

You say really dumb things. AND you have a very difficult time comprehending the message in a post.

Let quote my earlier post to clarify for you:

To be fair, bleeding liberal logic is to give everyone welfare and a life of leisure.

I was very clear, to all but the imbecillic, that I wasn't suggesting a life of leisure. I spoke only of basic needs- food and shelter. Let me point out that part for you also.

This is America and if someone is willing to work all day they ought to be able to take care of their family. We're not talking about fancy cars and gold watches here. We're talking about food and shelter. Is that too much to ask in your America?

Does that help?

 

[RubberFrog]

Re: Don't raise the minimum wage!!!

Maybe someone could find and repost the thread "americans with no abilities act".

Perfect for this topic.

OK, gotta go back to my job, in the business I built, by myself, with no money or credit to start with, and no help from anyone.

-Alden the "greedy" republican

I'll bet you pay more than minimum wage so you don't count 8)

 

[waterinthefuel]

Re: Don't raise the minimum wage!!!

Please read this.

http://www.epionline.org/study_detail.cfm?sid=98

It's a study on the effect of a minimum wage increase. Please read it.

A quote from that site:

Conclusion

These findings provide consistent evidence that minimum wage increases result in a significant decline in retail and small business employment. This finding is robust across several model specifications. Furthermore, these findings refute many of the claims raised in the FPI study so often cited in favor of minimum wage increases at the state and federal levels.

 

[18rabbit]

Re: Don't raise the minimum wage!!!

Please read this.

http://www.epionline.org/study_detail.cfm?sid=98

It's a study on the effect of a minimum wage increase. Please read it.

A quote from that site:

Conclusion

These findings provide consistent evidence that minimum wage increases result in a significant decline in retail and small business employment. This finding is robust across several model specifications. Furthermore, these findings refute many of the claims raised in the FPI study so often cited in favor of minimum wage increases at the state and federal levels.

Also from that report:

Specifically, a 10 percent increase in the minimum wage is associated with a 0.9 to 1.1 percent decline in retail employment and a 0.8 to 1.2 percent reduction in small business employment.

So, as per that report, increasing the min wage is just what is needed to drive the illegal aliens back across the border.

 

[treedancer]

Re: Don't raise the minimum wage!!!

Thanks frog it think maybe you might have clarified this part of his post for him also.

Quote custombycrunch(call me crunch)
Txswinner said:

“crunch you are out of your mind. Your statements are just not true.”
I said:
"Want to point out what I'm out of my mind about?"

He is too cowardly to reply.

 

[crunch]

Re: Don't raise the minimum wage!!!

You say really dumb things. AND you have a very difficult time comprehending the message in a post.

What, you don't get sarcasm when you read it?

Let me try this, raise minimum wage, prices go up and the minimum wagers are right back where they were..... raise it again, prices go up, minimum wagers are right back where they started. With me so far?

The only winner here is big Government..... they get to tax at the same rates the higher and higher wages.

Got it now?.... you say the dumbest things. :} 8)

 

[crunch]

Re: Don't raise the minimum wage!!!

Thanks frog it think maybe you might have clarified this part of his post for him also.

Quote custombycrunch(call me crunch)
Txswinner said:

“crunch you are out of your mind. Your statements are just not true.”
I said:
"Want to point out what I'm out of my mind about?"

He is too cowardly to reply.

Tree, that's real clear, and none of your biz.... keep it that way.

 

[woodrat]

Re: Don't raise the minimum wage!!!

"Oh gosh, the liberals are clueless. Don't you know that raising the minumum wage will just increase prices for everybody? Who makes minimum wage? High school kids flipping burgers!! I don't want to pay more for everything I buy to put a few more bucks in the pocket of an irresponsible, pimple faced kid who will simply blow the money on junk.
"

This is pure, un-adulterated BS. You must come from lucky circumstances to not even KNOW anyone who works a minimum wage job. If you did KNOW anyone like that, you would never post such nonsense. My rural county has lots of people trying to pay bills and rent and so forth on minimum wage. They are not pimply faced teenagers or illegal immigrants. They are people with kids to feed and clothe, cars to maintain so that they can get to work, and rent or a mortgage on an old mobile home to pay.

Yes indeed, get a clue.

"This is America and if someone is willing to work all day they ought to be able to take care of their family. We're not talking about fancy cars and gold watches here. We're talking about food and shelter. Is that too much to ask in your America?"

I think that the answer to that is YES, Rubber Frog. And you can see by custom's reply that they DO think that raising the minimum wage every few years is the same thing as handing out new Caddies and gold watches.


Hey Boomyal;

Don't you know that you are breakin' the law, hiring under the table like that? A while back custom was suggesting that employers who break employment laws should be sent to JAIL.... or maybe he meant only SOME employers who break CERTAIN employment laws. This moral relativism is so hard to keep up with... :/

 

[woodrat]

Re: Don't raise the minimum wage!!!

You know, this conservative economic thought would be a little easier to take seriously if you guys really had a more comprehensive view of the situation. What are people at the minimum wage level supposed to do when the price of housing increases by 10-20% per year in some places and the price of gas and diesel doubles in the space of 18 months, yet their wage stays flat? Do we just ship them off to a camp somewhere or what?

I was lucky enough to have parents that gave a **** and made me take hard classes in HS, plus I took some vocational classes and had a family with a lot of small business people in it. So I am self employed at a variety of different jobs and I do what it takes to pay my bills. Not everyone has a background like mine. Some have much better ones, some much worse. But I still think that if someone is willing to work a 40 hour week, they shouldn't have to be on foodstamps and they should be able to pay their bills and live indoors. Minimum wage as it is doesn't take care of that. And no small business is going to be helped by having employees who are worried about feeding their kids, or paying their electric bill.

 

[crunch]

Re: Don't raise the minimum wage!!!

You know, this conservative economic thought would be a little easier to take seriously if you guys really had a more comprehensive view of the situation. What are people at the minimum wage level supposed to do when the price of housing increases by 10-20% per year in some places and the price of gas and diesel doubles in the space of 18 months, yet their wage stays flat? Do we just ship them off to a camp somewhere or what?

I know if I wasn't making enough to live on in my current job, I'd go out and find one that payed a bit more.... not sit on my ask and hope the Government comes through for me........ gesssss, you guys are pathetic.... this is a market driven economy, if you don’t like it move to a communist country and get out of my wallet !

 

[RubberFrog]

Re: Don't raise the minimum wage!!!

I know if I wasn't making enough to live on in my current job, I'd go out and find one that payed a bit more.... not sit on my ask and hope the Government comes through for me........ gesssss, you guys are pathetic.... this is a market driven economy, if you don’t like it move to a communist country and get out of my wallet !

You sidestepped the majprity of my reply to you and then you came back with this.

It's not always as easy as finding a job that pays better for someone without skills.

I'll bet now you'll say "get some training." Oops, can't get any training because a certain party keeps cutting financial aid.

Before you get bent out of shape due to your misunderstanding of financial aid, most financial aid comes in the form of loans.

We have money to loan the whole world but not our own citizens?

 

[crunch]

Re: Don't raise the minimum wage!!!

I know if I wasn't making enough to live on in my current job, I'd go out and find one that payed a bit more.... not sit on my ask and hope the Government comes through for me........ gesssss, you guys are pathetic.... this is a market driven economy, if you don’t like it move to a communist country and get out of my wallet !

You sidestepped the majprity of my reply to you and then you came back with this.

It's not always as easy as finding a job that pays better for someone without skills.

I'll bet now you'll say "get some training." Oops, can't get any training because a certain party keeps cutting financial aid.

Before you get bent out of shape due to your misunderstanding of financial aid, most financial aid comes in the form of loans.

We have money to loan the whole world but not our own citizens?

Frog, the people you are talking about are the ones that partied hardy all through school, came out without even the basic skills to survive in this country, and you want me to pay for their screw up.... and I'll have to as the socialist party is in control of Congress.

That really hoovers.

 

[BoatBuoy]

Re: Don't raise the minimum wage!!!

Please read this.

http://www.epionline.org/study_detail.cfm?sid=98

It's a study on the effect of a minimum wage increase. Please read it.

A quote from that site:

Conclusion

These findings provide consistent evidence that minimum wage increases result in a significant decline in retail and small business employment. This finding is robust across several model specifications. Furthermore, these findings refute many of the claims raised in the FPI study so often cited in favor of minimum wage increases at the state and federal levels.

Do your research, man. What you quoted is from a lobbyst. Now there's a source for facts.

The Employment Policies Institute is one of several front groups created by Berman & Co., a Washington, DC public affairs firm owned by Rick Berman, who lobbies for the restaurant, hotel, alcoholic beverage and tobacco industries.
http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Employment_Policies_Institute

 

[RubberFrog]

Re: Don't raise the minimum wage!!!

Frog, the people you are talking about are the ones that partied hardy all through school, came out without even the basic skills to survive in this country, and you want me to pay for their screw up.... and I'll have to as the socialist party is in control of Congress.

That really hoovers.

More of the same rhetoric?

Please cite your source for the cause of poverty. I never realized that all poverty was caused from partying.

Did you pay cash for your college education? My wife and I used student loans- and paid them back with interest.

I guarantee you that we pay more in taxes and give more charitably than you. Sorry we made you pay for it.

Try to think it through a little more.

 

[CJY]

Re: Don't raise the minimum wage!!!

RF, do you feel like you are banging your head against the wall yet?

 

[crunch]

Re: Don't raise the minimum wage!!!

I can only talk from personal experience Frog. When I see some cashier at the checkout pull a calculator to add 10+12, I have to assume they didn't pick up the skills needed to survive, and throwing money at them to further their vast education probably isn't the answer.

As far as college, my family was very poor. I started work at 12 years of age after school working for ranchers... tending stock, changing irrigation pipes in their pastures, bucking hay in the summers.... after I took care of our stock.

Got my first real job at min. wage pumping gas.... needed more so I went into construction right at the bottom and worked my way up.

Studied hard, all on my own and got a contractors license. Nobody gave me any hand outs or cheap loans.... I did it myself for myself with one he11 of a lot of hard work.

The minimum wagers of today have the same opportunities as I did or even more. If they are too lazy to get off their butts and make something of themselves, they deserve to be right where they are.

I guarantee you that we pay more in taxes and give more charitably than you.

Now that really is a dumb statement.

 

[waterinthefuel]

Re: Don't raise the minimum wage!!!

Ok, not happy with that proof? How about an article from CATO!!!

http://www.cato.org/pubs/regulation/reg18n1c.html

Our conclusion is simple and direct: to the extent that increased minimums raise the cost of hiring low-productivity workers, fewer of those workers will be employed. Note, however, that our finding of greater job losses for teenagers is due to the fact that a large fraction of teenagers have low wages, and it is not because the teenagers who earn low wages are necessarily more likely to lose their jobs than are the adults who also earn low wages. Teenagers constituted only 32 percent of those earning $4.25 or less in the year before the 1990-91 increases. Hispanic workers constituted 20 percent, blacks 16 percent, and adult women without a high school degree 12 percent of this low-wage population. We have not asked whether increased minimums reduce the employment of low-wage teenagers more or less than the employment of low-wage adults. The question of which workers earning low wages are most harmed by increased minimums is more subtle and demands further research.


Who is the CATO institute you ask?


The Cato Institute is a libertarian think tank headquartered in Washington, D.C.

The Institute's stated mission is "to broaden the parameters of public policy debate to allow consideration of the traditional American principles of limited government, individual liberty, free markets, and peace" by seeking greater involvement of the "lay public in questions of public policy and the role of government."

 

[oddjob]

Re: Don't raise the minimum wage!!!

8)

 

[Drowned Rat]

Re: Don't raise the minimum wage!!!

Well, I'm as greedy and republican as they come I guess, but I do agree that minimum wage jobs are not reserved for teenagers. I also know that 1, ($10,712 a year before taxes) 2, or even 3 minimum wage jobs in a family is not enough to support it'self. Can anyone here imagine working 8 hours a day for $206 a week? That barely pays for my new boat.d Sorry, that greedy republican surfacing again. Is that a "clue" that they should get an education and a higher paying job? Maybe, but somebody has to do these jobs. It's a rediculous notion, but what if everyone with a min. wage job went on strike? What would you be willing to pay for their services then? Burger flippers aren't the only ones making min. wage. You may see unemployment jump a little at first, but it will even out over time.

 

[RubberFrog]

Re: Don't raise the minimum wage!!!

... The minimum wagers of today have the same opportunities as I did or even more. If they are too lazy to get off their butts and make something of themselves, they deserve to be right where they are.

Yoy are too be lauded for your hardwork. Congrats.

I think perhaps our fundamental disagreement lies in the fact I don't believe people have the same opportunities that you and I had. Construction jobs don't pay much more than mimimum wage now days. I got my start working with my hands as well. Have you looked at the pay for a labor job these days?

I don't think that everybody that is poor is lazy. Employers can fire you for being lazy and/or not doing your job. If you show up to work and work hard, you should be able to provide food and shelter for yourself.

If the only way a small business can afford to stay in business is by underpaying there workers than perhaps they don't have a viable business model?

I could make a LOT more money if only I could get slave labor. After all, if those slaves weren't so lazy and ignorant, they wouldn't be in this cycle of slavery and poverty in the first place.

...
I guarantee you that we pay more in taxes and give more charitably than you.

Now that really is a dumb statement.

You're right. That was a dumb thing for me to say.