Electric Guitars

QC

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Mar 22, 2005
Messages
22,783
Re: Electric Guitars

Strings that come stock on some Squiers that I've played were just horrible and sticky (probably due to the condition in which the guitar was kept)
Yeah, come to think of it, the strings did totally suck. I've been having a lot of fun with mine since I changed them . . .
 

Kiwi Phil

Commander
Joined
Jun 23, 2003
Messages
2,182
Re: Electric Guitars

Puddle-Jumper.
Printed off your 1st Q and took it to Haydens teacher.
He's been teaching for 45yrs, and a good muscian.

Answer:

Dead simple.
What does the kid want?
Kids won't use what they don't like, nor will they learn music they don't like.
If the kid will take my advice, then I always suggest an acoustic to start.
They just pick it up and play....biggest problem is getting them to tune it.
When they hit a certain level, if they haven't given up (can't recall what it is....think it was a 'grade') they start wanting different tones/noise/action so then they move on to the electric.
For an electric, again, what does the kid want.
For a budget, I always recommend Fenders "Squier Strat" in the 'pack' (guitar/amp/leads and more)
Big range of colours.
I keep 2 here for kids that turn up off the school bus and forget their guitar etc.
I will play some Hotel California on one (which he did) and then play it on my old expensive Fender, and you won't know the difference.....and i didn't.

Cheers
Phillip
 

jay_merrill

Vice Admiral
Joined
Dec 5, 2007
Messages
5,653
Re: Electric Guitars

Another good point about body size on acoustics. For smaller kids, that could be an issue. Don't forget, however, that there are lots of different styles of acoustic guitar bodies. I learned to play on A Gibson B25, which has a much smaller body than the "D" (dreadnought) models made by both Gibson and most other manufacturers.

Another choice is an Ovation guitar. I've never been thrilled with the tonal quality of most Ovations, but they make a number of models with very thin bodies, and the action tends to be better than most acoustics.
 

NSBCraig

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Aug 21, 2007
Messages
1,907
Re: Electric Guitars

Seriously why do people keep going on about acoustics?

Threads about buying an electric guitar for his son.

There is NO reason at all that someone should start on an acoustic.

Just like there's no reason he should learn to play the Mel Bay way.

I just don't get why people cloud threads with nonsense that is completely off topic.

If a teacher tells you he should learn on acoustic it's cause that's the stuff the teacher knows and he/she wants to look good. NOT that it would in any way be BETTER for the student.

Find a teacher who knows how to play the music your son likes and ask him. Just because someone teaches doesn't mean he knows all about it, it only means they know what they teach.

Remember most modern music (although true also with all the old blues and rock) is not even played in standard tuning or tuned to A-440 (which if you play any old classical pieces is completely wrong also).

None of the chords you play on acoustic are used and do not translate at all.

So really the only reason your saying start on acoustic is cause it will be harder!:eek:

I guess if you could find a young kid that would rather hang out with a bunch of old guys who have been playing forever and want to explain to him what real music is.

Don't know where you find them all I run across is kids wanting to jam out and play some cool stuff that will impress their friends and girls and then they can play in a band. You know FUN!

As he grows he can then learn to play an acoustic if he feels like it. (took me 23 years of playing to want a hollow body Epiphone Dot and I think I really only bought it cause John Lennon used to play one, looks cool hanging on the wall though)

But again there is no reason at all that a kid should start on an acoustic guitar that has anything to do with the kid in question if he would have wanted one his dad would be asking about one.
 

NSBCraig

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Aug 21, 2007
Messages
1,907
Re: Electric Guitars

I hope I'm not just getting people mad here, cause it's not my intent at all.

This is just a topic I know a very large deal about and I hate to see people give the wrong advice on something that has been such a large part of my life.

Bad advice can be the difference between someone having a life of enjoyment or just not trying.




With that said..... back when I was a little kid in the 70's Leo Fender sold Fender to CBS. It's why pre-CBS guitars are worth big $$$. CBS ruined the company, both guitars and amps (fender amps are the basis for Marshall (Jim Marshall couldn't afford to sell Fender amps in his music store because of taxes and tariffs so he copied the Bassman with what parts were available and made the Marshall halfstack (used 12" speakers cause it was a bass amp) and also Mesa Boogie). Pre-CBS Fender was a great innovative company.

Leo went on to make G & L guitars and continued to evolve the design of the electric guitar.

Fender has not they have become a trademark to be marketed.

Why am I going on.... a Squier strat is a cheap reproduction of a cheap reproduction of a design that is over 50 years old and has designs incorporated into it for marketing novelty and no other reason. Leo gave up on the bridge design a long time ago for reasons. Not one other manufacturer uses it. Just the nostalgia marketed nothing like the original company Fender.

How can you recommend that???

Do ANY of the guys in the bands he listens to use that?

Doubt it.

I just hate seeing this turn into more a wishlist or whatever

It should be about a bunch of informed people helping to hook up what's probably a pretty cool kid up with something he'd really like for christmas.

I'm sorry but suggesting things like don't buy him what he'd like buy him an acoustic or some piece of crap that plugs into a computer or buy any form of floating bridge be it thrown out tech or still around tech from the 70's (Floyd Rose) it just ain't right.
 

jay_merrill

Vice Admiral
Joined
Dec 5, 2007
Messages
5,653
Re: Electric Guitars

The problem with your posts is that you are acting as if your opinions are the only ones that are valid. Others, who have also played for many years and know instruments well, are merely making suggestions. They are offering alternatives for the OP to accept or discard, as he likes. My guess is that he is a big boy and is perfectly capable of doing so.

By the way, as for your comment about acoustic players using amps, the guy that I provided a link for (Monte Montgomery), is an acoustic/electric player and was listed as one of the top 50 guitar players in the world by Guitar Player magazine. Interestingly enough, if the guy has a flaw as a player, it is that he often falls into the trap of overplaying the instrument - a characteristic that is most often seen in electric guitar players of the metal/shred generation. Monte was an electric player before going all acoustic/electric ... maybe he should have learned on an acoustic first.
 

Howard Sterndrive

Rear Admiral
Joined
Nov 5, 2008
Messages
4,603
Re: Electric Guitars

my setup... entire rig under $500.. Crate amp is the Bayliner of music.... low cost, functional and the victim of much undue criticism
Guitar $29 online
Amp $335 eBay
Effects unit $120 pawn shop


I made a youtube clip of one of the sounds it makes.... the Vox tonelab is very versatile but also complex to learn... I found 1 or 2 settings I liked and modified them a bit.
Unfortunately the microphone on my digital camera is the size of the head of a pin....so the sound is not very good

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ApbS8I-gUV0

the amp also sounds great with an acoustic...
it is also very loud at 200 watts and two 12" speakers in stereo
 

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QC

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Mar 22, 2005
Messages
22,783
Re: Electric Guitars

Dead simple.
What does the kid want?
I think this is the most important post here. BTW, Phill's Hayden is now addicted to Guitars. I am very impressed with how he has saved and selected what he wanted. His first had to have? Strat. Gorgeous red one at that. ;)
 

avenger79

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
May 5, 2008
Messages
1,792
Re: Electric Guitars

probelm with getting him an electric is to enjoy it he needs an amp/chord/electricity/ etc. an acoustic can be played anywhere anytime. That said most kids prefer elec. they can play rock better on them.

If I was to choose one (and I did when I bought one for my nephew) I would go with a squire telecaster. It is a Korean made Fender product. Tele because it's a hard tail. Easier to tune then the tremolo of the strat.
another good choice would be the epiphone SG. very cool low level Gibson again hardtail.
Both are great beginner guitars that you can play for a very long time. I even know a couple guys who play them in bands.
Very inexpensive as well which is good. Under $200.
 

NSBCraig

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Aug 21, 2007
Messages
1,907
Re: Electric Guitars

Hey Jay don't see why you think I think your opinions don't matter?

But seriously on almost every thread that someone starts on this forum they first get a bunch of replies for more info. Some not at all in a nice manner.

How many questions were asked about about this kid?

But how many posts were made saying don't buy him something he wants buy something different.

It's like a guy asking about a boat to fish offshore and telling him don't do that buy a pontoon boat that's what you should have.

Now sure i386 and I bumped heads cause I think he misunderstood that I was only talking about a first guitar but were on the same page now.

Not only is there truly no real reason that a student should start on an acoustic there are many more for starting on an electric. First starters it's easier. Why should it not be easy again??? It's fun! Want to get a kid into learning the guitar? Teach him how to play a couple power chord jams unplugged, (why can't I play my guitar without an amp?) and then plug him into a real amp aka at least a high quality halfstack (me I use 4 4x12 Carvin cabinets with my rack outputing 400 watts to each cabinet) and let um' rock out!

Now that you got them hooked beyond belief, they'll do anything the can to get them a cool sounding amp and they will practice.

Step two all he needs to know still is how to strum basic power chords and how to tune that baby up. Hook him up with 5 minutes a jam time with a band.

He can learn all the rest later, you know hey if I add this finger it's a n A chord or if I only play these it's an E.

Learning while having fun..... the way the legends did it.
 

Raghauler

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Sep 5, 2001
Messages
161
Re: Electric Guitars

I'm a 46 year-old who has been playing since I was 14. There have been some interesting statements that I don't necessarily agree with, but opinion in subjective. I would like to add some things that I have learned over the years.

I think that low action (small clearance between the strings and frets) is often overrated. While it may be easier to finger a chord on a guitar with low action, it can lead to string buzz, where the strings vibrate against the remaining frets between the fingers and bridge. Most blues and rock players with experience that I know find a balance between action and the ability to avoid fret buzz while bending notes... and things like neck curvature, fret-board radius, and lots of other technical setup can be incorporated to address these issues, but alas, this is about a beginner and his guitar.

If the kid is interested in an electric, I agree that you should start there. Interest leads to more of the same in the eyes of the student. It's how I started, and several years later - after I realized I was barely competent on an acoustic (they are very different instruments in my view) - I pursued that, returning to my love of electrics after several years.

My first guitar: I have always been a tinkerer, so starting out with a $10 electric no-name Strat copy, I learned relatively quickly to become my own guitar technician. That said, I don't recommend it, but that first guitar was pretty functional, and I gave it to a nephew years later to learn on (he lost interest and his mother tossed it out... disappointing). My first amp was an old stereo amplifier wired to a 12" RCA speaker salvaged from a monophonic record player from the fifties. Sounded like crap to everyone else in the house, but not to me. Pure gold. And all this equipment cost me... $10.

Regarding tremolos, I always had them, used them semi-frequently, and never had issues with keeping the guitar tuned if I didn?t go crazy with them. I still use them sparingly, but like them. A hard bridge is easier for the new student to tune, but I wouldn?t avoid tremolos either. Good tuning hardware at the machine-head is easily as important regarding keeping the thing in tune.

The first new electric I bought was an '85 Fender Squier Stratocaster, which was Fender's new model line made either in Korea or Japan. At the time, all Strats and Tele's where American made (No Mexicans), but you couldn?t buy and American Fender in ?85 because the Corona factory was under construction and the old plant was closed. Years later, Squier became the ?low end? Fender line, but I still think they make a great product for the price. My old Squier (aside from the original crappy electronics) is one of the best set-up Strats I have ever played, including my MIA (Made In America) Strat that is my pride and joy to play. I also own several other pricy guitars, but the cheapy?s always turned me on, because I always manage to tune them up and make them sound good, with few exceptions.

There are lots of inexpensive guitar builders out there, and each has a certain reputation for quality, but what I find is that it comes down to the individual axe. Pick up two ?identical? Epiphones (basically the Squier of Gibson, so-to-speak) each with new strings, and one often sounds flat while the other sings. Again, it comes down to the set-up, and with mass-produced guitars, that varies with each instrument. Check intonation by plucking an open string and again at the 12th fret? they should sound the same.

If it were me, I would consider any electric guitar in the $150 ? 250 range that your son likes the looks of. From there, compare between what?s available and what sounds good to you.

The guitar packs are OK (Guitar and Amp packaged together with strings, cord, strap, etc.), but as far as inexpensive amps are concerned, I have always liked practice amps (10W to 15 W) by Peavey and Crate? The guitar snobs always heckle me for this, but these amps really are reliable and decent sounding products for the most part, perfect for the beginner. Pedals, effects, plug-ins? the options are endless, and in the guitar world, most of us get something we call GAS (Guitar Acquisition Syndrome). It?s a disease, much like my diagnosed BAS (Boat Acquisition Syndrome), but that?s a different thread.

There are several hundred more things I could suggest, but you don?t really need to hear it all. Find out what you son thinks is cool, and go with that. If he sticks with it, be prepared for the worst if he catches a wicked case of GAS.
 

jay_merrill

Vice Admiral
Joined
Dec 5, 2007
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Re: Electric Guitars

Raghauler, great post. I think it offers some good advice that the OP can use.
 
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