Evinrude 5hp no water from telltale

[Vic.S]

Re: Evinrude 5hp no water from telltale

. As far as a thermostat, I don't see one and I don't think this engine has one. Can you describe to me what the "water jacket cover" is??

I am not super familiar with that motor, but a water jacket cover is a plate on the side of the motor.

If you go to the parts website BRP -- Parts Catalogs you will be able to look at exploded diagrams for the motor.

You will discover that there there is no thermostat nor water jacket cover plates on the side of the engine.


Are you sure that the water tube is fitting correctly into the water pump when the gearcase assembly is refitted?
Are you sure that the water tube is not blocked?
Are you sure it is fitted correctly along with its grommet at the top of the exhaust housing.

You may have to remove the cylinder head and inspect the water channels if the engine is overheating.

 

[14 foot Starcraft]

Re: Evinrude 5hp no water from telltale

is the water pump keyway good?

 

[Vic.S]

Re: Evinrude 5hp no water from telltale

is the water pump keyway good?

Is the key in position???

 

[lisfisher]

Re: Evinrude 5hp no water from telltale

Water pump keyway is good, brand new, I confirmed that the impeller is not slipping as the driveshaft turns

posted by Vic:
"Are you sure that the water tube is fitting correctly into the water pump when the gearcase assembly is refitted?" -yes, had the LU on and off about 8 times already, took extra care to make sure it was fitting properly.

"Are you sure that the water tube is not blocked?" Positive- removed entire tube from engine, blew through it, etc, no clogs.

"Are you sure it is fitted correctly along with its grommet at the top of the exhaust housing?".- Not certian, but it's just a squareish rubber grommet with grooves that slide into place in the slot, with the top of the intake tube's leading into the cooling channel. The grommet only goes one way, so it seems.

"You may have to remove the cylinder head and inspect the water channels if the engine is overheating".- I have already removed the powerhead { would this be the same thing as the cylider head?? ** via about 8 or so bolts from underneath the bottom of the engine.

 

[lisfisher]

Re: Evinrude 5hp no water from telltale

As I said, I have already removed the powerhead. What I can see in there are these channels, which I assume are the water passage channels. There is no visible debris within the channels or either end of the telltale hole. Is there anywhere else in the head that could potentially be blocked?? Maybe somewhere beyond these cooling channels? The only other thing I can see underneath the powerhead are 3 very small holes, about the thickness of a toothpick, that seem be situated in a direction toward the piston / cylinder area.

 

[lisfisher]

Re: Evinrude 5hp no water from telltale

What gets me is that this motor probably doesn't have more than 30 hours on it. Everything looks relatively new and clean.

 

[lisfisher]

Re: Evinrude 5hp no water from telltale

I do see a water cover in the schematics on the evinrude website. Part# 5030147 "water cover". Can't seem to locate it on the engine though. Hate to take it off just yet, that will mean ordering another gasket and waiting 5 more days when it may not even be needed.

 

[nwcove]

Re: Evinrude 5hp no water from telltale

i have a 4.5 that acted somewhat like you describe. it had a weak telltale at trolling speed, but didnt run hot. anything above idle it would stop peeing, and blow hot air, with a shot of steam now and then and start to get hot until i went back to idle. compression tested fine ( cold motor). turned out to be the head gasket. it wasnt letting water into the cyls, but it was allowing exhaust to enter the water jacket.

 

[lisfisher]

Re: Evinrude 5hp no water from telltale

Update: I ran a garden hose into the end of the water intake tube, no water came out of the telltale hole. Not sure how it would because the end of the garden hose is 5 times the diameter of the end of the intake tube, so i'm losing pressure all over the place. Anyway, I backflushed again, ran it and began to get water out of the telltale BUT only when about half throttle or higher in forward gear. Once I let off on the throttle, or at idle or reverse, no water, just some steam.

 

[Vic.S]

Re: Evinrude 5hp no water from telltale

"You may have to remove the cylinder head and inspect the water channels if the engine is overheating".- I have already removed the powerhead { would this be the same thing as the cylider head?? ** via about 8 or so bolts from underneath the bottom of the engine.

No cylinder head is just the bit called cylinder head in the schematic. It has the spark plug screwd into it.

But I an pretty sure you should see water from the telltale regardless of any blockages in the powerhead.
It really seems that for some reason the pump is not pumping any water up there.

Something silly wrong somewhere that we are all overlooking

Have you tried submerging the lower unit in a bucket and spinning the drive shaft with an electric drill/

 

[lisfisher]

Re: Evinrude 5hp no water from telltale

Haven't tried that trick yet but I do believe you are right- the pump for some reason just isn't getting the volume of water that the powerhead needs. One thing I just noticed : I just took the pump apart again, the impeller is not sitting cempletely flush with the metal wear plate, there is about a 1/16 of an inch between the bottom of the impeller and the metal plate. Doesn't seem right to me. When I initially took this apart for the first time, there was a small o-ring seal that sat on top of the metal wear plate, over the driveshaft. The impeller key sits just above this o-ring, BUT, I just looked at the schematics and there is NO o-ring shown in that location. Maybe this would explain why I have a 1/16" gap between the impeller bottom and the plate. Maybe the mechanic that initially put a new impeller in put it there by mistake. Or maybe it in fact should be there but for some reason the schematics don't show it. Interesting.

 

[Vic.S]

Re: Evinrude 5hp no water from telltale

Ah. If you are saying that there is a 1/16"gap between the pump impeller and the bottom plate you have found the problem.

The vanes of the impeller must seal against both the bottom plate and inside the top of the pump housing. It is a positive displacement pump. There must be leakage past the vanes. Assuming you have the correct impeller for the engine I would deduce that the wrong pump housing has been fitted previously. Or you have been supplied with the wrong impeller.

Do you realise what time of the night it is here?

 

[oldboat1]

Re: Evinrude 5hp no water from telltale

Update: I ran a garden hose into the end of the water intake tube, no water came out of the telltale hole. Not sure how it would because the end of the garden hose is 5 times the diameter of the end of the intake tube, so i'm losing pressure all over the place. Anyway, I backflushed again, ran it and began to get water out of the telltale BUT only when about half throttle or higher in forward gear. Once I let off on the throttle, or at idle or reverse, no water, just some steam.

forcing water up from the bottom is good for both testing and flushing, but need a reasonably tight fit around the water tube -- rig something using misc. hoses, water, fuel, whatever you have. If you have one of those quick release hose hookups for use in the garden, maybe use the small male end to step down the hose diameter, and connect from there to the water tube. Anyway, it's a good method. (I use a manual transfer pump rather than a hose.) Additionally, it's standard to pull the head cover -- where the spark plugs are, as somebody pointed out, not the powerhead itself. The purpose is to see whether and where the water is flowing (or not). There is often corrosion in the water jackets, particularly if running in salt water -- and maybe some other debris (can be about anything, including remnants of mud wasp nests.) With the head cover off, you can make sure the passages are cleared.

But I agree with Vic.S above. There is something crazy going on with the impeller assembly, and may not be the correct impeller or housing.

btw -- not convinced from your description that the motor is overheating, at least at the point you tested it. Ten seconds is a long time to hold your hand on an overheating engine(!)

 

[lisfisher]

Re: Evinrude 5hp no water from telltale

The 1/16" gap is being caused by this tiny rubber o-ring that sits at the point of the bottom of the driveshaft and on top of the metal plate. I really don't know if it's supposed to be there, although in doing an internet image search on outboard motor water pumps, I did see a couple pics of other brand engines that had this o-ring sitting on top of the plate over the driveshaft. The pump housing itself is original though, and is the correct one.Also, the impeller is the correct one. The one the mechanic had ordered and installed and also the one I ordered from evinrude as well, both impellers were a match.

The overheating...yeah I honestly don't know if that would be considered overheating. It gets hot to the touch but not like an extreme hot.

 

[lisfisher]

Re: Evinrude 5hp no water from telltale

Update: I removed the o-ring seal from the top of the plate, slid the impeller back down and it sits nice and flush against the plate, BUT, this concerns me because if the o-ring does not belong there, then where exactly does it go?? I'm thinking that the mechanic put it there in error, due to many of these that ARE supposed to be there on the larger engines. Perhaps he just assumed it was supposed to be there.

 

[lisfisher]

Re: Evinrude 5hp no water from telltale

Just talked to a techie at evinrude- according to him the o-ring is NOT supposed to be there. Will reassemble without it later today and post my findings. Crossing my fingers!

UGH! Reassembled, ran in the drum and same thing- water comes out at higher rpm's in forward gear, but nothing at lower speeds, idle, or reverse, just steam. AHHHH!!!

 

[Vic.S]

Re: Evinrude 5hp no water from telltale

There is something fundamentally wrong.

The impeller vanes should seal against the bottom plate and against the inside top of the hosing and the tips should seal against the side of the housing all the way round. If there are any gaps it wont pump.

I don't understand how the 1/16" gap can be caused by the O ring. If the impeller fits the housing correctly there will be no space for an O ring unless there is a recess for it to sit in.

If there is no water from the telltale it indicates that the pump is not pumping water. If it is not then the engine will overheat.

Forward neutral or reverse gear should not affect the water flow at all.

 

[lisfisher]

Re: Evinrude 5hp no water from telltale

Metal plate sat on gasket and housing. O-ring slid over the driveshaft, and down to top of metal plate. Impeller slid down shaft and would not fully seat flush against the wear plate, o-ring was in the way and the bottom of the impeller is not recessed to allow for the space. When I removed the o-ring it then sat nice and flush. Either way it did not fix the issue.Thought for sure that was the problem, oh well. I'm fresh out of ideas here!!

 

[Vic.S]

Re: Evinrude 5hp no water from telltale

Metal plate sat on gasket and housing. O-ring slid over the driveshaft, and down to top of metal plate. Impeller slid down shaft and would not fully seat flush against the wear plate, o-ring was in the way and the bottom of the impeller is not recessed to allow for the space. When I removed the o-ring it then sat nice and flush. Either way it did not fix the issue.Thought for sure that was the problem, oh well. I'm fresh out of ideas here!!

Having removed the O ring and slid the impeller down the shaft there must now be a 1/16" gap above the impeller in the top of the housing. This gap just is not right wherever it is. It really seems that its not the correct impeller for the housing. One of them must be the wrong part.


Is there a metal cup lining the inside of the pump housing?

 

[lisfisher]

Re: Evinrude 5hp no water from telltale

No, I was thinking of that but there is no metal cup in the rebuild kit nor in the schematics. The impeller that the mechanic ordered when he worked on it is the exact same one that I ordered last week. Maybe some kind of strange part# change that evinrude did not update? I'm running out of ideas. Pulled the cylinder head off tonight, gasket is like new, no tears or signs of seepage. No debris in the small holes either. MUST be something simple with that dang water pump.