Evinrude XP150 not accelerating

[MASTER Brian]

Re: Evinrude XP150 not accelerating

Ok, I have a manual and sitting here at the office, I'm looking through it. It says, "A (fuel)pump that is operating satisfactorily will deliver a good, constant flow of fuel from the line. If the amount of flow varies from pulse to pulse, the fuel pump is probably failing."<br /><br />When I checked the pump before, the fuel came out in spurts when I cranked over the engine, are they saying it should be a solid flow? <br /><br />I realize that since the compression on this cylinder is low, that might cause incorrect fuel delivery, but I want to know what to expect. As that would sort of make sense why it isn't running right. Granted I need to get that compression up and the head should be coming off tonight, just want to know what I'm looking for in the larger picture.

 

[MASTER Brian]

Re: Evinrude XP150 not accelerating

Well, I got the head pulled and sure enough there are pits on the head and piston on the #6 cylinder. The cylinder wall on this cylinder also has a gouge, so I'm sure it'll need to be bored out. The piston moves easily from side to side, so it would appear I lost a ring. The other two cylinders on this side look fine.<br /><br />What is the normal cause of the pitting? Is this normal for a ring?<br /><br />I am still thinking of doing this job myself, so would like to know what I'm up against.

 

[wilde1j]

Re: Evinrude XP150 not accelerating

Pitting is not normal. If the rings are gone, their metal may have beat up the head for that hole. If you've never rebuilt an outboard PH, you'll be ahead buying a rebuilt one and back in business quickly. Try to determine the cause of the failure ... rings breaking up are just a symptom.<br /><br />If you look thru an OEM shop manual, you'll know exactly what you're up against as a DIY project.

 

[MASTER Brian]

Re: Evinrude XP150 not accelerating

Originally posted by WildeOne:<br /> Pitting is not normal. If the rings are gone, their metal may have beat up the head for that hole. If you've never rebuilt an outboard PH, you'll be ahead buying a rebuilt one and back in business quickly. Try to determine the cause of the failure ... rings breaking up are just a symptom.<br /><br />If you look thru an OEM shop manual, you'll know exactly what you're up against as a DIY project.

Yeah, I know the pitting is not normal, I was asking what would normally cause this to occur. I realize it's from metal from the rings, but what would cause the rings to come apart? Lack of oil, age, etc.??? <br /><br />I figure I've put about 20 hours +/- on this engine since I bought the boat and I've probably gone through 3/4-1 gallon of oil. Not sure how many tanks of gas that would be, but I would guess 6+ 12 gallon tanks of fuel. <br /><br />As for doing the work myself, I've scanned through the manual and I still don't see where this is that much more difficult than rebuilding a modified 2-stroke jetski engine. There are obviously more linkages, instead of one Ign module there is one per cylinder and there are more carbs, but other than that I just don't see it. <br /><br />Am I wrong in thinking an engine is an engine once the other crap is out of the way? After all if I buy a rebuilt power head, all I gain is the bare bone basic engine itself anyway isn't it and I still have to hook everything else back up.<br /><br />Also, how much would a 150hp powerhead weigh approximately.

 

[MASTER Brian]

Re: Evinrude XP150 not accelerating

I am weighing my options here. I don't mind rebuilding it myself, which I prefer to do over spending $3500 for the local shop to do the job. But it looks like I'm looking at $1000 for parts + labor to have it machined. <br /><br />I found one source here that can get me a rebuilt P.H. for $2500 shipped. I also found another source that can get me one for $2300 shipped. The $2300 is if I ship them my motor fully dressed and they return the new one fully dressed. That seems like a pretty decent deal.<br /><br />Does anyone have any feedback about PowerHead Exchange out of Tampa, Florida?

 

[Tom Scully]

Re: Evinrude XP150 not accelerating

A friend had a 115 evinrude rebuilt and everything was as promised, It has been two years and the motor still run good. I have also heard some good things about them in general, in the past.

 

[wilde1j]

Re: Evinrude XP150 not accelerating

Dhadley can give you a rebuilder recommendation ... he's the board expert in that dept. BTW, a V6 PH is pretty heavy (I'm guessing ~ 200+ lbs.). You asked about what would cause rings in a single cylinder to fail. I would rule out oiling, since all the holes see the same mix. Something else metallic may have come apart (reeds, a bearing, etc?) and mechanically damaged the rings in that hole. Hard to really know until the whole block is stripped down. There's no magic to doing a rebuild, but you need to be organized (the reused rods, piston pins, bearings must go back where they came from and not intermixed. You need a big box of zip lock bags to store and label stuff. I've rebuilt motors many times, but if I were to need a PH now, I think I would use a rebuilder, just for the time and hassle elimination and the guarantee. The good ones know what's good practice and do tons of PH's and are very good at what they do. If you need all new pistons and rings, and a few other parts plus soft parts, you can easily exceed $1K in parts alone, plus the machine shop costs.

 

[MASTER Brian]

Re: Evinrude XP150 not accelerating

Originally posted by WildeOne:<br /> Dhadley can give you a rebuilder recommendation ... he's the board expert in that dept. BTW, a V6 PH is pretty heavy (I'm guessing ~ 200+ lbs.). You asked about what would cause rings in a single cylinder to fail. I would rule out oiling, since all the holes see the same mix. Something else metallic may have come apart (reeds, a bearing, etc?) and mechanically damaged the rings in that hole. Hard to really know until the whole block is stripped down. There's no magic to doing a rebuild, but you need to be organized (the reused rods, piston pins, bearings must go back where they came from and not intermixed. You need a big box of zip lock bags to store and label stuff. I've rebuilt motors many times, but if I were to need a PH now, I think I would use a rebuilder, just for the time and hassle elimination and the guarantee. The good ones know what's good practice and do tons of PH's and are very good at what they do. If you need all new pistons and rings, and a few other parts plus soft parts, you can easily exceed $1K in parts alone, plus the machine shop costs.

That's what I'm starting to think. I already have enough projects in front of me at this point. Part of me would love to rebuild it, just so I understand the motor more, but at the same time, it'd be nice to be back on the water in about 2 weeks, especially when the cost is under $1000 more.<br /><br />The guy I talked to at P.H.E. said that about that year they didn't de-chamfer the cylinders so the rings tended to catch. He also told me a few other things to look for, like what the pits looked like. I took some pics, but they didn't come out as good as I'd hoped. He said round pits would be a bearing, flat ones, the ring. The other thing he asked was whether that cylinder was cleaner than the rest, as that would suggest possible water intrusion. <br /><br />I'd have to pull the head back off to look into those things. He also asked if the rod was wet or dry, but obviously, I can't tell that until I dig deaper, which I won't do if I send it in. What does that tell? I can't recall, but he did tell me.<br /><br />Also, what are the reeds made of in these? I'm used to a "composite" reed. <br /><br />Once again thanks for the input...

 

[emdsapmgr]

Re: Evinrude XP150 not accelerating

Couple of failure modes. If the piston ring pin started to come out, it will cause a deep groove down the liner wall. If the pin comes out completely, it will find it's way into the combustion chamber and will beat the top of the piston and the head, causing the pits. Once the pin lets go, the ring can move and will turn and the ring end will catch the intake/exhaust opening and break, causing more debris to get into the combustion area. Also, on these engines it is not unusual to find a carbon ring buildup on the skirt of the piston. Once this carbon builds up (from the bad fuel of today) it will block the oil/fuel from cooling the skirt. Piston will get hot and start to stress the rings, causing them to break-hence more pits. The first failure is hard to prevent, but frequent use of engine tuner will avoid the latter issue. The pitted head must be replaced.

 

[MASTER Brian]

Re: Evinrude XP150 not accelerating

From that description, I almost wonder if the ring pin came loose. There is a groove, kind of cresent shaped, but not a lot of other major cylinder damage. The groove doesn't appear too deep and the pitting isn't as bad as I would think, only really along one side of the piston/head. <br /><br />If the ring pin came out, wouldn't the piston be able to be pulled out with the cylinder intact?<br /><br />Also, I was told the pits in the head don't cause any issues as long as the "high" spots are removed, so they don't contact the new piston. Is that not true? I was also told that on one of my ski's before as well...

 

[wilde1j]

Re: Evinrude XP150 not accelerating

I don't think that's so (about the pitting). I'm under the impression the rough spots can become hot enough to glow, causes pre-ignition.

 

[MASTER Brian]

Re: Evinrude XP150 not accelerating

Well, I got a chance to look again today and the pits are flat in shape. They do appear to be about the same thickness as a ring and the piston has side to side slop, and I can't feel any movement up and down.<br /><br />My understanding is the "flat" pits are from a ring, if from a bearing they would be round. I also understand that if the piston moves side to side, it's a ring, but up and down is a bearing. <br /><br />I was also told that if the piston was cleaner than the rest, that would be a sign of water intrusion. They all seemed to be about the same color, but then again, I did do a decarb.<br /><br />I also checked out the grove in the cylinder wall and it didn't appear to be as bad as I originally thought and I think it's only due to a section of the ring catching.

 

[MASTER Brian]

Re: Evinrude XP150 not accelerating

If my memory serves me correctly the good heads are casting#'s 332544 and 332545. Good luck. [/QB]

My heads are 332545, if memory serves me correct.

 

[MASTER Brian]

Re: Evinrude XP150 not accelerating

BTW...I started a new thread about the rebuild process as I felt any discussions pertaining to that would be better suited in another thread.<br />Here is that link.... Rebuilding Power Head<br /><br />Thanks to everyone who replied here!!