Fiberglass Repair help please!

[jmcknight]

Here is link to my Google doc outline, I tried to copy and paste but it screwed up the formatting. Once the outline is near completion and I won't have so much to edit, I'll post the outline besides just the link.

Google Doc Outline for boat repair

I will start off by saying, I have never even done ANY fiberglass work. I've been reading through a lot of stuff, but I figured getting some initial reactions would give me some direction, which is what I am lacking first and foremost at the moment. I have done some looking into getting another boat and just moving over the motor and outdrive, but not finding any newer style boats that I like, that are of Sea Ray quality. I am finding a few Bayliners, but friends are telling me that I am much better off repairing a Sea Ray than buying a Bayliner for the hull.

Back to the boat. I bought the boat for $100. The guy's daughter hit a marker with it, insurance company gave him money for it but told him he could keep it if he wanted to. He couldn't get anyone to give him much at the time, so 3 years later I was telling him about an S-10 I was working on and he said "you should buy my boat from me and fix it up." I asked him how much and he said "I'd take $100 just to get it out of the yard." So here I am with this boat with a big hole in it and a merc cruiser 3.0 that runs nice and the outdrive works.

nice boat for $100 huh?

well here comes the damage

 

[jmcknight]

Re: Fiberglass Repair help please!

This is the very bottom of the hull on the right of the hull. This "scrape" is probably 3 or so feet long

Another picture of the same, bottom of hull.

This is the right side of the boat right above the very bottom.

Galvanized Trailer! (esaily worth the $100 alone)

On the very bottom of the hull right below the damage that you can see, it looks like a metal marker was drug along the corner and messed it up pretty good, which is exactly what happened when the boat was nearly on it's side while they were trying to turn left sharply to miss the marker, which they were obviously not successful at.

I'll get more pictures in the daylight when I can, but hopefully this will get me started.

So basically, where I am right now = can I repair the boat without separating the top from the bottom, and do I need to repair the bottom of the hull from the inside.

Also, where is a good resource for purchasing the supplies and tools for fiberglass? I am not in a big hurry so definitely not wanting to buy stuff at local stores and spending more money.

 

[lowvlot]

Re: Fiberglass Repair help please!

You definatly have a project on your hands. I am sure some people will chime in here that are more knowledge than my self but I don't see any way you are going to this repair with out removing the cap. If the hull damage is through the hull you will need to repair it from the inside and outside. Alot of people on here have tons of knowledge and can help you through it. As far as where to get supplies, US composites.com Is where alot of iboaters go. Good luck and keep posting.

 

[jmcknight]

Re: Fiberglass Repair help please!

If the hull damage is through the hull you will need to repair it from the inside and outside.

Supposedly the boat didn't take any water on the way back to the dock, unless a little splashed into the gaping hole in the bow.

 

[lowvlot]

Re: Fiberglass Repair help please!

I would check it out very thoroughly. make sure it is not thin or week.

 

[ondarvr]

Re: Fiberglass Repair help please!

It can be fixed, but you will need to take the cap off, not only to do the repairs, but also to see just how much damage has been done. Gel coat will hide all the small fractures in the laminate and the only way to see them will be from the backside.

You'll need to get a little creative in recreating the shape of the destroyed areas, but it can be done.

 

[jmcknight]

Re: Fiberglass Repair help please!

Well, looks like I will remove the cap. Any recommendations on what to set the hull of the boat on? I will need to remove the boat from the trailer to fix the bottom of the hull.

 

[Yacht Dr.]

Re: Fiberglass Repair help please!

Hello jmcknight and welcome to Iboats..

The only small problem I see with this is going to be that port side chine damaged area.

From the pics it looks to be "oil canned" about 2'x3' at the chine hullside.

The hull deck joint damage can be done withought removing the cap..however the bottom damage must be done Inside and out Correctly.

In this case I would highly recommend you find a qualified glass guy to keep tabs on your repair If you choose to do this yourself.

Sorry ..

YD.

 

[jmcknight]

Re: Fiberglass Repair help please!

Thank you everyone for your input. I am starting again to lean back to try to find a boat this winter, I will just have to park the boat at in-laws house where they have a few acres and my wife won't be yelling at me to get "this piece of junk" out of her back yard.

I guess I am back to, is this the time and effort to fix, correctly?


Definitely no need for anyone to be sorry, I want to put my family in this boat, so obviously I don't want it done incorrectly.

 

[ezmobee]

Re: Fiberglass Repair help please!

I'd find a different hull for your good powerplant. That's a lower end SeaRay so it's not like some rare classic or something. You could double your money just parting out the windshield.

 

[jmcknight]

Re: Fiberglass Repair help please!

Well hopefully I'll be getting a hull this weekend, if they except my offer that is.

 

[erikgreen]

Re: Fiberglass Repair help please!

If it were me, I'd repair the hull. If the damage is not a lot more extensive than it looks, then it's repairable and can be made safe.

As has been mentioned though, if you got another good hull (be sure it's good and not waterlogged or anything) then you can swap your good powerplant into it. Be aware that after sitting a couple years the engine probably needs servicing and the outdrive certainly does.

As has been said, split the hull cap from the bottom. Set the cap on blocks or something to keep it from twisting out of flat. The cap can be repaired with a one-shot mold or, if you're really into sanding, by hand. The hull is actually easier to repair than the top using a simple mold, and the interior damage once assessed should be straightforward to repair.

In short, it's not too hard a fix to get a safe boat for use, but moderately harder to get it back to the original factory shiny look. You could compromise and do the lower hull work yourself, then have a glass shop do the visible upper curved part.

Make sure any new hull you get is about the same size and is set up for a sterndrive... you can't easily convert another power plant type to a sterndrive set-up. Also check the potential new hull for rot, water, etc.

Good luck,
Erik

 

[oops!]

Re: Fiberglass Repair help please!

that is just the kind of boat i love to buy !....

one that has been whacked and the motor and drive is fresh. lets just hope its been properly winterized.

before you start on the hull.....start it up on muffs (change all the fluids first, including the out drive) if its good, you just won a 7000 lottery.

give me a week with that boat and you will be grinning ear to ear.

as ondarvr and erikgreen said.....the proper way to do the repair is to pull the cap. yd is also correct in saying it CAN be repaired without pulling it, but chances are you will have a wobble in that area and you will inevitably end up glassing the cap and hull together if you leave it on.

make no bones about it.....each repair is an inside out repair.....that means you have to fix both the inside and then the outside. and yes.....your deck (floor) in the rear area has to be opened....dont be shy...take out enough as you need to get at the area unrestricted. you will also need to take out the foam in that area and replace it after the inside repair. and yes...the foam in that area is wet, it will never dry...i dont care how long you let it sit...dig it out and replace it.

ok....what to do.

start reading here.....the link in my sig has everything you need. even tho i cut my hull it does not matter the basic premise is the same, you are fixing a hole in the boat..

i would be using waxed cardboard or smooth arbourite for a mold for the outer areas. after the inside is done, finishing the outside is a snap.

bear in mind...if you part the boat out the way it is...its an easy 3 grand. but you wont replace it for that. so you are better off to fix it, use it, sell it after you have caught the restoration bug and buy another.

we can all help and will.

cheers
oops

 

[ezmobee]

Re: Fiberglass Repair help please!

Seriously, how is repairing this hull a smarter money move than swapping the running gear into another hull that he can probably pick up for a few hundred?

I can easily see how this kind of project boat would be ideal for the likes of erik and oops but for the rest of us? He's going to have some serious tear down to do just to access the damaged areas. So minimum we're talking a new deck, probably some foam, fiberglass supplies, etc.

 

[oops!]

Re: Fiberglass Repair help please!

EZ...

unless its spring and a frozen block is involved, it will be hard to find a good newer hull with a bad motor on the cheep.

in my experience, owners of a frozen block will tend to replace it (after some yelling, swearing, and crying).

for the op. anything other than the frozen block scenario will be taking a crap shoot on another hull.

but the boat is worth 4k just sitting there

 

[lonewolfed]

Re: Fiberglass Repair help please!

1) Buy the book "Runabout Restoration" and read up on boat building and fibergalss repair and mixing in it.

2) Fiberglasssite.com for glass. West Marine is decent for Epoxy Resin, wait for it to be on sale at $39.99 a gallon you will need at least three gallons for that mess.

3) You do need to repair the inside and outside, buy an angle grinder, a respirater (Sears or Home Depot about $35), and two or three tyvek body suits and gloves-fiberglass itches like mad when sanded and breathing it in is no joke!!!

4) I wouldn't split the cap off but the proper way would be to do this.

5) get at the repair from the inside however you can as mentioned

6) use fiberglass matt or roving on the inside after the grinding is done. Use wax paper on the outside between whatever you use to mold chopped glass and Epoxy mixed with thickener, see West System 404 thickener. Tape newspaper all over where you do not want covered-the book I mentioned will show you exactly how. Then layer layer layer the glass a git at a time grinding down the high spots as you build up. The final layer is best molded. I used a sanding attachment on my grinder to sand with.

7) start with very small batches of Epoxy until you get the mixing down. I wasted a lot by putting in too much hardener-it turns to hot jello very quickly if you over mix.

 

[oops!]

Re: Fiberglass Repair help please!

runabout renovation is a great book, it shows you that it can be done....but it lacks the specifics nessary to do that kind of work.....
things like how thick of glass do i need on a hull repair? how thick of glass on the deck?..poly vs epoxy vs ve resins. (check with the mfgr your boat might have ve resins.)
pt vs ext....ect...ect....ect.

i would still buy the book, but read here for the specifics.

 

[jmcknight]

Re: Fiberglass Repair help please!

Man, I thought I was done flip flopping between buying a new hull and fixing the one I have!

I had found a Larsons 1996 174 for $1200 (probably could get for $1000) but i'd have to drive 6 hours to get it and no trailer / no motor / outdrive

decent condition, interior is probably slightly better than mine.

It also has a cobra outdrive instead of alpha 1, so not certain that will fit.

I am having a hard time finding a '95 or newer hull w/o motor.

I did find a '93 sea ray 180 i think with trailer for $800 but interior needs a bunch of work.

Thank you everyone for your input, and definitely looking for more!

 

[erikgreen]

Re: Fiberglass Repair help please!

Yeah, you're not going to find many newer hulls with bad motors. Typically a hull newer than about 2000 or so with a bad motor gets a new one... those boats are still worth a bit, especially with a new motor, so it's worth doing.

The thing about any hull you buy is that there's a good reason it's not on the water being used. For your boat it was because of the damage. For an older hull without a motor it's likely because the hull itself isn't worth putting a running motor into. Why buy one of those if it's not worth it? If you are going to have to do repair work anyway, start with a hull that's worth fixing.

An older hull than a few years will likely have issues, usually waterlogging and rot - see hundreds of the threads here. The only hulls without rot are the ones without wood, and waterlogging can happen anyway (water soaks into the foam... heavy). The only older hulls (that you'd get for a reasonable price) are the ones with problems, usually half hidden. You might get lucky and find a freshly rebuilt hull with new stringers, transom, deck, etc but don't count on it.

Your boat needs work, but likely the damage you already know about is all that's wrong with it, and it's worth fixing.

The worst thing that can happen if you fix it and really screw it up badly is that the hull leaks on the one side and you have to do it again, or that it looks bad. Either way you can try again to get it right, or if you like the boat enough, pay someone else to fix it.

FYI, for a hull in the shape yours is in without a trailer or engine that works and with that hull damage I'd probably pay about $400-$700 depending on a more detailed inspection. I'd fix the damage, put in a good engine, and sell the thing for several thousand. Good newer hulls are still worth a bit.

Erik

 

[ezmobee]

Re: Fiberglass Repair help please!

I had found a Larsons 1996 174 for $1200 (probably could get for $1000) but i'd have to drive 6 hours to get it and no trailer / no motor / outdrive

I can't believe they'll get anywhere near that much for a boat with no running gear or trailer.

FYI, for a hull in the shape yours is in without a trailer or engine that works and with that hull damage I'd probably pay about $400-$700 depending on a more detailed inspection.

No way. That hull with that damage and no running gear in it is worthless. It's not like this is a boat that was in like new condition and just recently took a good whack. It's clearly been sitting out in the elements for a long time. It's going to need a LOT of work.

(FYI I have much respect for oops! and erik. They are two of the top fiberglass guys on this forum. I'm just hung up on the money aspect of this deal for some reason. Maybe it's cuz what I'D DO would be to swap that powertrain into an $800 aluminum Starcraft and have a really nice boat.)