Flooding thru transom when in reverse

[73Chrysler105]

Re: Flooding thru transom when in reverse

Uhhmm, Boats don't turn themselves to junk, Abusive owners do!!!!

My boat is 50+ years old with the original transom! It's all about maintenance and care.

And how its built. My Chrysler Conqueror Would not have survived no matter how good you took care of of it because of the poor construction. Unless it was kept in a climate controlled warehouse and never put into the water or left out in the rain ever, aka museum show piece. The floor was not fiberglassed in neither was the transom or the stringers. everything was just tabbed in only not covered or capped. Water would go through the carpet soak the wood and then through to the foam and stringers. The motor mounts were hollow plywood boxes open to the bilge. All bad construction a throw away boat. Now I have seen some later models with much better construction I just got the one built at beer thirty on Friday afternoon.

 

[SMullenMaine]

Re: Flooding thru transom when in reverse

I took a picture of my almost-perfect boat....



And then I took the carpet up, cut out the floor... and took a few more of the carnage beneath. I love carpet!!!



It looks like everything forward of the middle of the fuel tank is pretty bad. They had only tabbed-in the stringers and the tops of them are almost completely gone... The bulkhead under the driver's seat appears to be gone as well... and the forward bulkhead (which is under the bow-rider section) appears compromised, but not horrible... LOL...

These pictures show a lot of the debris from the rotted floor... The foam was better than I expected... only the aft-port side seems to be saturated... but I know that I will have to take it all out to replace the stringers. I hope that I can keep the bulkhead at the forward end of the engine well... it seems very solid and the well was "well done"...

I'll know more soon... tomorrow is "decorating for Christmas" day so I don't think I'll get much done... Glad to have a warm garage with 15 degrees and 20mph winds outside!

 

[SMullenMaine]

Re: Flooding thru transom when in reverse

The floor was not fiberglassed in neither was the transom or the stringers. everything was just tabbed in only not covered or capped. Water would go through the carpet soak the wood and then through to the foam and stringers.

This is what Larson did with this boat too... only a light paint on the transom... 3" of glass at the bottom of the stringers... no cap or glass on the top half. The floor had a layer of glass, but they drilled through it to allow the foam to escape and it was clearly rotted around these holes.

 

[55evinrude]

Re: Flooding thru transom when in reverse

looking like your on the right track so far Steve! Man what a shame though the boat builders cut so many corners, like really how can they expect a transom not to rot when it just wood.... water is always sitting in the bilge. and the fact that the stringers are not encapsulated in fiberglass is just dumb!

Nathan

 

[1badbrd]

Re: Flooding thru transom when in reverse

what was alarming was how bad it was up near the bow. Curious if the boat was stored with the bow downwards and the water moved forward with gravity or just the amount of water over time found it way after rains stroms/wet body walking around the boat.

 

[Woodonglass]

Re: Flooding thru transom when in reverse

Prolly left on the trailer, @ what they thought was level. Always good to make sure plug is out and bow up, as you are now regretfully finding out.

 

[SMullenMaine]

Re: Flooding thru transom when in reverse

Just finished stripping most of the foam... nasty job! garden shovel, then chisels and scrapers.... The foam wasn't as wet as I had worried, but it was definitely soaked down low along the stringers. I was amazed that there was no glass on the outboard side of the stringers... and there doesn't appear to be any kind of bond between the bulkhead and the hull.



so I have a couple of questions...

Should I lift the boat off of the trailer before I remove & replace the stringers? Is the trailer deforming the shape?

It looks like the bulkhead was complete... the stringers were cut to fit from bulkhead to bulkhead... is this right? In which direction is the strength more important?

and... I left a 5" strip of the old floor that is in excellent shape and well attached to the hull... could I cut the new floor to fit within that frame and then butt-block/epoxy it into place?

and... the old floor was buckled by the force of the foam expanding beneath it... I don't like the foam concept much... could I add an additional bulkhead and only do enough foam to help dampen the hull sounds? ..leaving an air space under the floor?

Thanks all, Steve

 

[SMullenMaine]

Re: Flooding thru transom when in reverse

Prolly left on the trailer, @ what they thought was level. Always good to make sure plug is out and bow up, as you are now regretfully finding out.

This boat is strange to be sure... I have it on the trailer at the full reach of the tongue jack... when I took the fuel tank out, there was still 2" of water under it that couldn't get to the drain. If it were stored outside in a position that looked "normal", there would definitely be several inches of water in the bow that couldn't get out.

 

[tpenfield]

Re: Flooding thru transom when in reverse

This boat is strange to be sure... I have it on the trailer at the full reach of the tongue jack... when I took the fuel tank out, there was still 2" of water under it that couldn't get to the drain. If it were stored outside in a position that looked "normal", there would definitely be several inches of water in the bow that couldn't get out.

Yup . . . many boats are designed to rot out. The things that you have pointed out are all part of "the plan".

 

[jigngrub]

Re: Flooding thru transom when in reverse

Yup . . . many boats are designed to rot out. The things that you have pointed out are all part of "the plan".

It's a conspiracy eh penfield?

 

[1badbrd]

Re: Flooding thru transom when in reverse

I can’t comment on which way stringers and bulkheads should be handled but the foam is a necessary part of the boat more than sound purposes. The foam gives it more structural support to the boat and the floor along with floatation support.

 

[JASinIL2006]

Re: Flooding thru transom when in reverse

Steve, looks like you and I are in the same boat, so to speak. I'm also restoring a Larson bowrider. My transom was about as bad as yours. It was only covered with a coat of paint, no fiberglass, and I believe the two sheets of plywood were held together with staples only, no glue. I did catch a break, though, in that mine has fiberglass stringers, so there was no need to replace them.

One thing that makes no sense to me: the drain in the ski locker is such that it always holds a half inch of water - it is not possible for the locker to drain. Is yours set up like that? I'm thinking of adding enough glass to the floor of the locker so all the water will drain out.

Looks like you're making good progress. Are you going to re-carpet your floor or do something else.

Jim

 

[SMullenMaine]

Re: Flooding thru transom when in reverse

My boat is an 186 SEI as well...

I was planning to re-carpet... I really don't think that the carpet was to blame for the carnage... and I like the carpet. I plan to reconfigure the ski locker... maybe make a teak grate to fill that space and then continue down to the engine housing... I'm having trouble with the fuel gauge too so I want to make sure that I have access to that sensor.

The ski locker did appear to be the source of most of the trouble... I will definitely NOT re-carpet that...

My boat looks a lot better today after removing all of those rotten stringers... I'll reconfigure the bulkheads so that there aren't so many ways for water to pool.

Hope that your work is going well... I'm concerned about re-powering... I'm good at the structural stuff, but the engine holds a lot of mysteries for me.

Steve

 

[SMullenMaine]

Re: Flooding thru transom when in reverse

It looks like the stringers and bulkheads were slotted together... stringers high, bulkheads low... I'll re-make them as they were originally done.

I cut it all out today... I am in the granite-countertop biz and I'd highly recommend the tool we use for everything... diamond wheel with a flush-cut adapter on a 4" grinder... it allowed me to cut everything off almost flush with the floor and then clean up the remnants afterwards.

I'm building a cradle for the stern this afternoon... I can see that the trailer is deforming the hull so I want to lift it off before I replace the stringers.



Steve

 

[JASinIL2006]

Re: Flooding thru transom when in reverse

My boat is an 186 SEI as well...

I was planning to re-carpet... I really don't think that the carpet was to blame for the carnage... and I like the carpet. I plan to reconfigure the ski locker... maybe make a teak grate to fill that space and then continue down to the engine housing... I'm having trouble with the fuel gauge too so I want to make sure that I have access to that sensor.

The ski locker did appear to be the source of most of the trouble... I will definitely NOT re-carpet that...

My boat looks a lot better today after removing all of those rotten stringers... I'll reconfigure the bulkheads so that there aren't so many ways for water to pool.

Hope that your work is going well... I'm concerned about re-powering... I'm good at the structural stuff, but the engine holds a lot of mysteries for me.

Steve

Interesting... the transom core on my 186 SEI looked different than yours. Must have changed the design some when they went with the other stringer design?

I'm also a bit worried about getting the powertrain in and functional. I'm trying to take all of this one step at a time.

Good luck!

Jim

 

[jsturvey]

Re: Flooding thru transom when in reverse

My boat is an 186 SEI as well...

I'm concerned about re-powering... I'm good at the structural stuff, but the engine holds a lot of mysteries for me.

Steve

I would seriously consider a re-power since you are torn down this far. I don't know which drive system you boat uses, but I believe both MerCruiser and Volvo Penta have all the technical specs / dimensions on their websites. Hopefully that can shed a light on the engine mystery.

Good luck with the restoration.

 

[benjh1028]

Re: Flooding thru transom when in reverse

Just finished stripping most of the foam... nasty job! garden shovel, then chisels and scrapers.... The foam wasn't as wet as I had worried, but it was definitely soaked down low along the stringers. I was amazed that there was no glass on the outboard side of the stringers... and there doesn't appear to be any kind of bond between the bulkhead and the hull.

View attachment 177414View attachment 177415

so I have a couple of questions...

Should I lift the boat off of the trailer before I remove & replace the stringers? Is the trailer deforming the shape?

It looks like the bulkhead was complete... the stringers were cut to fit from bulkhead to bulkhead... is this right? In which direction is the strength more important?

and... I left a 5" strip of the old floor that is in excellent shape and well attached to the hull... could I cut the new floor to fit within that frame and then butt-block/epoxy it into place?

and... the old floor was buckled by the force of the foam expanding beneath it... I don't like the foam concept much... could I add an additional bulkhead and only do enough foam to help dampen the hull sounds? ..leaving an air space under the floor?

Thanks all, Steve

Steve,

Restored my 1995 Larson LXI214 last year. My issues were very similar to yours sans bulkhead. I must say I am also disappointed by the build quality - it was predisposed to rot.

Just wanted to pass along a conversation I had with a Larson employee who was on the line during the mid-90's. He told me that foam was absolutely necessary as it was considered a structural component of the boat. After re-plying my floor (I went synthetic Coosa board and Nida-bond stringers) there was a good bit of flex to it. Adding the foam made it feel as firm as concrete. No way the boat would be the same without the foam.

Also, I modified the ski locker drain so that all water had to drain to the bilge (another mfg flaw). Lastly, I went with Deckadence marine flooring. Simply laid it on the floor (no snaps or glue) and it has performed brilliantly.

Good luck - there is light at the end of the tunnel!

Ben

 

[SMullenMaine]

Re: Flooding thru transom when in reverse

Well... Progress!

I took a bit of a break for the holidays...

I had left a few inches of the floor boards in so that I would know the original level of the floors... I made templates for the bulkheads and put them in place with temporary support... then made templates for the stringers... I used strips of 1/4" birch ply and hot glue to make the templates... worked very well.


PB'd them into place with epoxy & cabosil... Tabbed them in with 6" and then 12" glass... painted it all with epoxy. I made a 3d template with the same wood strips for the floors....

I pre-cut the foam pour holes and then painted it all with epoxy a couple of times and then pb'd it down with epoxy coated decking screws. The foaming went much easier than I had expected although I got less volume than I expected... maybe my math was too optimistic.

I had not tabbed the floor to the hull because I wanted to see the foam expand to those extremities. Once it was done, I trimmed off the excess, dug out some of it and pb'd the joint. I dug out a half inch of each of the fill holes as well and filled them with pb.

I poured the foam during the Blizzard of 2013... 35" of snow that day in Portland Maine!!! It will be fun to remember while skiing this summer.

Thanks for all of your advice & support!

Steve

 

[Bondo]

Re: Flooding thru transom when in reverse

Ayuh,.... Sweet,... looks like yer havin' Fun,....

 

[dearmosd]

Re: Flooding thru transom when in reverse

Things are looking good. If time is on your side, use it and it will turn out looking better than new.