Frustration Questions

[wadeseward]

I have a 63 Johnson 40 HP, I recently got the leg assembly unseized and was able to start the motor. I am having some back fire issue's as well as some things I am unsure if they are supposed to happen. The motor has been sitting for a few years, have done some carb work etc the unit ran for a few minutes than I shut it down until hopefully these questions are answered.

First of all on the above pic, is water supposed to come out this vent or just exhaust? I was getting lots of smoke before I could get it to run and when it finally idled for a period of time I was getting water.

Next pic is how much oil i Had in my pail in order to run the motor, if this is normal they must have had some different laws back in 63.

Next question is other than a blown gasket why would I be getting extreme backfire in the Leaf assembly. On the Close up pic if you can see the metal looks blown or dented outward due to the force of the backfire. Why am I getting backfire, plugs are new, gas as well.

I have also included a Pic of my new Boat

I got it cheap and have really no experience with boats, I learn as I go, Also I have purchased a parts manual but do not have a repair as I am unsure of which one to get there seems to be a few.

Thanks and sorry for the long wind.
Wade

 

[steppinstone]

Re: Frustration Questions

Did you separate the leg when you got it free ? If so did you put new gaskets in also your water pick up tube is it connected by looking in your barrel it looks like to much oil to me did you drain your lower unit and see water ? Did you clean and adjust your points and gap your plugs ? Did you put the right fuel and oil mixture?

 

[wadeseward]

Re: Frustration Questions

The leg was rusted solid, I replaced the lower leg bearings with new. I could not get the large roller bearing out of the leg so I soaked with anything I could find till it can free small roller bearings as well. Replace lube/oil seal on top as well. The water pump hoses are back were they should be (double rubber off water pump meets double tubes). The lower lower leg has gear oil and so far has not been leaking. The exhaust comes out of were? on my leg? If it is below the little tube than the reason for so much oil on the top of the bucket could be because my float was extremely out of wack, forgot about that before putting it as well as the starter back on and then off again.. Plugs are gapped to .030 (Autolite) and the fuel mix is 25 to 1. Good spark and the clear fuel bowl stays full after start up as well as the bulb on the tank line.

One more thing is I had to make a stop collar on the linkage that runs from the carb was getting a bit of run time then finally figuired out that whoever had the motor before didn't put that peice back on. I think I have that aspect figuired out.

Any more questions let me know I appreciate the help

 

[wadeseward]

Re: Frustration Questions

1 more thing- will clean the points any idea what the gapping should be?

 

[jonesg]

Re: Frustration Questions

you need the model number to get the right service manual.

www.outboardbooks.com

 

[sheboyganjohn]

Re: Frustration Questions

Points gap is 0.020"

 

[tx1961whaler]

Re: Frustration Questions

To answer some questions:
The oil in the water is normal.
Some water is supposed to come out of the exhaust relief hole (the accordion looking thing). That lets you know the water pump is working.
The backfire could be the result of a sheared flywheel key. This happens if the flywheel is not torqued down enough (105 ft-lbs (?) ). It can also be caused by swapping the plug wires.
Points 0.020"

 

[samo_ott]

Re: Frustration Questions

Is it a true backfire or a lean engine 'sneeze' which can be adjusted out on the low idle adjustment screw?

 

[wadeseward]

Re: Frustration Questions

The backfire came through the gasket on the leaf assembly and caused some minor damage. When trying to start I had to put the "Choke On" until it had a mini backfire then put it to automatic choke after that to get it to run. I need to get a couple of gaskets for the leaf assembly anyways so While waiting I will do the carb again. Carb does have a cork float am I better off trying to find a new one. Thanks for the answers good to know that water is supposed to come out of the accordian thing. Will double check that I don't have a sheared pin and go from there. Will let you know how it goes.

Thanks WS

 

[Chris1956]

Re: Frustration Questions

That upper exhaust vent will only spit water, when the thermostat opens. It is not a telltale. A backfire could be the result of overadvanced timing. Recehck the point gap and idle timing. A service manual is a real good idea

 

[wadeseward]

Re: Frustration Questions

Finally got back to being able to work on my motor. I got a manual and parts book, Took the flywheel off and gapped the points to .020, went to start the motor after reassembly and had a lower piston full of gas mix. Ordered a new fuel pump kit. After putting the kit in I tried the engine last night in a large bucket of water and to my disbelief it ran. Could a backfire have been the result of a bad diaphram gasket in the fuel pump letting too much fuel into the lower cylinder? I have yet to get the boat to a water body, hopefully tonight. I have one more concern, when the engine is running I assumed to shut it down I would turn the key to the off position, however the engine keeps running I have to close the choke to shut it down, what am I missing?

Johnson 40hp
1963 electric start.

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: Frustration Questions

you may have the wrong ignition switch. look at the wiring diagram in manual. i believe it is a 5 prong switch, plus choke button.

 

[Chris1956]

Re: Frustration Questions

The two wires that lead from the ign coils under the flywheel need to be connected together to kill the spark. See if your ign switch has two terminals marked "M". If not, you have the wrong ign switch.

 

[wadeseward]

Re: Frustration Questions

I will check the the box that holds my ignition as well as check my wiring diagram in my manual. just took it for granted that "off meant off". there is a dial on my controls tha says "idle stop"??

 

[Chris1956]

Re: Frustration Questions

Idle stop is the mechanical stop for idle speed. The ignition key should be used to kill the motor.

 

[wadeseward]

Re: Frustration Questions

Got to Playing around again today and still Cannot get the engine to quit when the key is turned to off. I have taken some pics of what I have going on hopefully with them I can explain the trouble I'm having as My manual is not all that helpful in regards to key switch and kill switch. I am guessing that my box that the wires go to is missing something.

1st. This is the key assembly that I have I tried to get the letters the best I could They are starting at the top of the circle and moving clock wise- "ST", "IGN", "ACC", "BAT".

2ND. is a picture of what I call the junction box Lid, The wires themself were not wired the way this shows when I got the boat that is the second pic (the way it was originally)

I undid the red wires and extented the white wire from the motor put it on the the left hand bolt that is in the middle (2 bolts/Connections) and then put the white wire from the key switch wire onto the "ST" prong on my key switch,(Green wire on Bat) White wire with Blue connector is from motor, white with black goes to key.

. The engine would not turn over unless I put the red wire that is grounded to the junction box back to the connector that has the white wire from the motor.(Used clamp) Motor would then run but not kill with key switch

All this and the motor still will not quit when key is turned to OFF.

. Reading in my manual there was originally supposed to be a connector that had the 2-Blackm, 1-brown wire from the motor attach to the same on the key side (Also shown on junction box diagram lid). I do not have anything that these wires would be needed for, not temp sensor or tach. Sorry this is so pic heavy but maybe I can solve this, I'm sure its an easy fix but can't get my mind around it. Have searched the forum just can't seem to find anyone with the same exact problem. I also hooked an ohm meter to the kill switch and pushed it in with a screw driver, it jupms up half way through then goes to null after it pushed in.
More general pics in next post.

 

[wadeseward]

Re: Frustration Questions

Couple more pics

 

[samo_ott]

Re: Frustration Questions

The pics are small but it does not appear to be the correct ignition switch. As mentioned above, it should have 2 'M' terminals on it and then the key is turned to the off position the two wires are shorted out to stop the engine, these wires go to the 2 coils under the flywheel.

 

[samo_ott]

Re: Frustration Questions

Here is the wiring diagram for an earlier 40 but it should be very similar if not the same.

 

[wadeseward]

Re: Frustration Questions

Possiblity???

Would it work if I put the black wires from each cylinder so that they are attached to a spring button similar to what you used as a horn button that is grounded and when pushed, grounds out the wires so the engine will shut down. I don't have thw "M" on my ignition switch. Just want to make sure that I won't fry anything by doing this.

Thanks for all the help. Hopefully this will work and I can be fishing...Finally