Haut vs Big Oil

[Haut Medoc]

Re: Haut vs Big Oil

When it comes to punctuation, etc. is an abbreviation.......
Therefore needs a . at it's end..........​

 

[QC]

Re: Haut vs Big Oil

P.S When it comes to punctuation etc the word American is spelt with a capitol A.

Yeah!! And don't let your Pommy butt forget it . . .

New angle alert! New angle alert!

OK, Blo du Haut and Z, I have a new twist to this different prices in different countries and taxes etc. thing. Bear with me here . . . OK, so the "free" market along with taxes has established that fuel (diesel and gasoline for this discussion) commands over 8 US Dollars per US gallon in the UK. It also has determined that CA pays more than AZ, and everybody pays more than FL. If you had a true monopoly you would "price to what the market will bear". Whether you have a monopoly or not, that is standard stuff. Sooooooo, some young up and comer Jr. Blo Haut exec is sitting in his office and a light goes on. "Those flippin' Red Coat bastuds will pay $8. Even their commercial diesel customers pay near that, so let's just jack it up to equal that." But the difference is tax you say "So what?" Jr. says, "the market can obviously support it, Look there's is proof right there." So the senior guy says, "well let's not jump that far, we'll start by charging CA prices everywhere in the US."

Now, I ask, what other reason other than fair competition would cause that conversation and the resulting pricing not to have happened already?

 

[OldMercsRule]

Re: Haut vs Big Oil

You make it sound like anyone can just pick a job and sign up for it.

Read my words not my mind. Life is not easy.

It doesn't work that way in the real world. Most people are stuck where they are, not by choice.

You may corsider yourself to be Cornservative, but your thinking is very much like a Democrat victim.

Especially those making minimum wage.

Ya know ZmOz, I guess you are right: we just can't do anything on our own anymore without the government doing everything for us. Why are you and your friends such victims? You want the whole world to stop just so you and your friend get cheap gas so you can drive a big truck to work and to the hostbital every week, and your friend can keep his minimum wage job with a distant commute?

 

[burroak]

Re: Haut vs Big Oil

When it comes to punctuation, etc. is an abbreviation.......
Therefore needs a . at it's end..........​

My post has nothing to do with your quote. I just wanted to make sure that you were tagged with this reply.

Just to get you up to speed and get some rudimentary information in regards to the pricing of gasoline, go to www.energy.gov.on.ca, click on Gas and Oil then click on Frequently Asked Questions. It is written from the Canadian perspective but is applicable to the U. S. This will give you a thoughtful foundation without heat and liberal jingoism.

As I said on another thread, unless you get some sound information and can respond to it , you will just be considered a garrulous old dude running loose on a boating forum.

 

[Haut Medoc]

Re: Haut vs Big Oil

Yeah!! And don't let your Pommy butt forget it . . .

New angle alert! New angle alert!

OK, Blo du Haut and Z, I have a new twist to this different prices in different countries and taxes etc. thing. Bear with me here . . . OK, so the "free" market along with taxes has established that fuel (diesel and gasoline for this discussion) commands over 8 US Dollars per US gallon in the UK. It also has determined that CA pays more than AZ, and everybody pays more than FL. If you had a true monopoly you would "price to what the market will bear". Whether you have a monopoly or not, that is standard stuff. Sooooooo, some young up and comer Jr. Blo Haut exec is sitting in his office and a light goes on. "Those flippin' Red Coat bastuds will pay $8. Even their commercial diesel customers pay near that, so let's just jack it up to equal that." But the difference is tax you say "So what?" Jr. says, "the market can obviously support it, Look there's is proof right there." So the senior guy says, "well let's not jump that far, we'll start by charging CA prices everywhere in the US."

Now, I ask, what other reason other than fair competition would cause that conversation and the resulting pricing not to have happened already?

They are working up to it.....
If they do it slowly, no one squawks too much......
If they did it all at one time, they would force government intervention, just like what happened to Standard Oil.....​

 

[Haut Medoc]

Re: Haut vs Big Oil

My post has nothing to do with your quote. I just wanted to make sure that you were tagged with this reply.

Just to get you up to speed and get some rudimentary information in regards to the pricing of gasoline, go to www.energy.gov.on.ca, click on Gas and Oil then click on Frequently Asked Questions. It is written from the Canadian perspective but is applicable to the U. S. This will give you a thoughtful foundation without heat and liberal jingoism.

As I said on another thread, unless you get some sound information and can respond to it , you will just be considered a garrulous old dude running loose on a boating forum.

Sorry if my disagreement with you assertions leaves your panties in a bind.....
So much so that you feel the need to follow me to a different thread....
​

 

[Pony]

Re: Haut vs Big Oil

I just want to throw this out there and see if it sticks............not all the people on this board in their younger 20's are like ZmOz Thanks for makin us all look bad.......

Z no one is stuck in a crappy job by circumstance alone.....unless they are somehow disabled. Otherwise that person just needs to step it up, try a little harder, and put themselves in a position to get that better job.

I for one don't want to hear you complain about gas, when you say things like I choose to buy inefficient vehicles because I make a comfortable living and I can afford it. IMO once you have chosen to reason that way you have lost the ability to complain about how much that CHOICE is costing you. If you have such a comfy life, and own your own business why dont you cut your friend steve in and give him a better job if you care about his so much? Buy him a little gas? or take him out for some lunch so that he doesnt have to make a choice between food and fuel.

We all hate paying high fuel prices, yet you act like everyone here sits at home waiting for the price to go up before they fill up.

I also think there is some gauging going on is some places, but if you do the math the gas station owner is usually making 2-3 cents on a gallon.

 

[ZmOz]

Re: Haut vs Big Oil

FYI, those record profits are causing young graduates to be hired straight out of school for 80-100k/yr plus 10-20k sign on bonus. Want a piece of the pie? go to school.

I already make more than that, and I didn't finish high school.

P.S When it comes to punctuation etc the word American is spelt with a capitol A.

There's a dot after the S in P.S. too. Also, "capitol" is the head of a state, "capital" is what you call those uppercase letters.

They are working up to it.....
If they do it slowly, no one squawks too much......
If they did it all at one time, they would force government intervention, just like what happened to Standard Oil.....​

Exactly.

Ya know ZmOz, I guess you are right: we just can't do anything on our own anymore without the government doing everything for us. Why are you and your friends such victims? You want the whole world to stop just so you and your friend get cheap gas so you can drive a big truck to work and to the hostbital every week, and your friend can keep his minimum wage job with a distant commute?

You don't seem to understand the point. It doesn't matter what I drive. I make a lot of money. I can drive whatever the hell I want. I like to start my big engines for no other reason than to hear them roar. The point is every single person in this country is forced to buy gas in one way or another. You can't change your life to get around it. You ride the bus, you're still using gas. Walk to work, you're still using gas because you ate corn flakes for breakfast and they were delivered to the store using gas. As such, these enourmous corporations should not be allowed to charge whatever the hell they want. They aren't part of a free market anymore. It's ruining our entire economy.

Can nobody answer this question? How is gasoline different than natural gas or electricity? Those things are already regulated. The world didn't stop turning. Stock holders are still happy, and utilities still make big profits. If my electric company tried to double the cost in only a few months time they would literally be arrested.


But hey, if you guys enjoy getting butt raped, by all means, have at it. Maybe you can organize an orgy at the next iboats get together.

 

[tommays]

Re: Haut vs Big Oil

I GET A FUEL SURCHARGE on my utility bill ALL THE TIME with NO input from the PSC

The utility is worse there guaranteed to make a profit AND they get run buy some compleat hack that somebody owed and election favor


Tommays

 

[stevieray]

Re: Haut vs Big Oil

Can nobody answer this question? How is gasoline different than natural gas or electricity? Those things are already regulated. The world didn't stop turning. Stock holders are still happy, and utilities still make big profits. If my electric company tried to double the cost in only a few months time they would literally be arrested.

Well, in the days before de-regulation, you had only ONE utility company to deal with, since they owned the power plants, transmission lines, gas pipes, etc. The state would typically have a Public Service Commission to keep them regulated since they WERE a genuine built-in monopoly.

Now, in areas that have de-regulated (like MD where I live), they are counting on free-market competition to set the prices, available services and such.

Problem is, in areas like mine, the rates have been held unrealistically low for such a long time that the base utility (BGE here) has to raise rates in order to survive in the de-regulated world. So my rate is going UP 70% over the artificially-regulated, rate-capped rate I was paying a year ago. They are phasing it in gradually (15% increase was allowed last yr & will go up the other 55% in July).

Now I can pick & choose the services I want, and the company I buy them from. But the price is now at the competitive market rate.

So there goes your regulated utility argument.

 

[ZmOz]

Re: Haut vs Big Oil

Z no one is stuck in a crappy job by circumstance alone

So everyone making minimum wage is doing so just because they like it?

IMO once you have chosen to reason that way you have lost the ability to complain about how much that CHOICE is costing you.

I'm not complaining about how much it's costing me. I'm complaining about how much it's costing our entire country and the toll it's having on our economy. Every person and every business in this country is losing money and it's all going to Exxon.

If you have such a comfy life, and own your own business why dont you cut your friend steve in and give him a better job if you care about his so much? Buy him a little gas? or take him out for some lunch so that he doesnt have to make a choice between food and fuel.

I would like to think that Steve has a little more pride than that. The man works very hard for what he has, he doesn't want handouts. And I do always pay when we go out.

We all hate paying high fuel prices, yet you act like everyone here sits at home waiting for the price to go up before they fill up.

I'm pretty sure that's what ken and plainsman do.

I also think there is some gauging going on is some places, but if you do the math the gas station owner is usually making 2-3 cents on a gallon.

I'm not talking about the gas station owners.

 

[OldMercsRule]

Re: Haut vs Big Oil

No, this is when I will vote for representatives who will stop the runaway train of greed......
There are not enough players in the game to make it a real competition anymore....
It's just a good ol' boys club.....
Legislation will fix that......​

Hmmmmmm, Ya know Bro Haut you've hooked lots of 'em with this junk yer spewin', so I'll take the bait and apply some logic and history to your proposal so we can collectively ponder the potential results. First: let's review some facts. #1 the US based oil companies are large relative to all US companies and fairly efficient, but they are quite small relative to the rest of the worlds oil producers, (many of which are sovern states). #2 "Representatives" you want to vote for to take over the US part of the world's oil production are not reliable and would not have any authority over the rest of the world's oil production, (the majority of the production of the valuable commodity in demand world wide is foreign). You sure can not count on them to complete a war they voted for, so what else do you realy think they can do? Please cite some examples of industries they have managed properly. Some 'representatives" are blatently corrupt; Murtha, Jefferson, Hastings et al come to mind. #3 Lennin tried a similar corncept in 1917. Did you learn anything from history me Bro? Governments are not good producers of anything. History is very clear about that. #4 If your "representatives" pass laws nationalzing all US oil companies, (or passed laws forcing them to sell products below market prices how would you enforce that)? How would you set prices? Would good Democrats get a better deal then the rest of us? Would you have John Kerry give ZmOz n' his friend a special deal on their gas so they could drive long distances to their work and hostbitals, n' ZmOz could fire up the ol' Merc 1500 n' go fer a spin? What if the oil companies decided to move offshore? Would ya throw the oil company workers in a Gulag n force 'em to produce oil or do what to 'em? This kind of out of corntroll whinning n' knashing of our teeth is very unproductive. If you voted for "representatives" who set prices or profit levels you would be turning over all the world's oil production to your favorite people. Do you really want the State to run just the oil business or all business. Do ya think we would last as long as the USSR did? JR

 

[OldMercsRule]

Re: Haut vs Big Oil

I already make more than that, and I didn't finish high school.

There's a dot after the S in P.S. too. Also, "capitol" is the head of a state, "capital" is what you call those uppercase letters.



Exactly.




You don't seem to understand the point.

I think I understand your point perfectly.

It doesn't matter what I drive. I make a lot of money. I can drive whatever the hell I want.

You are very illogical. You claimed you had no choice, and that you were forced to buy petroleum.

I like to start my big engines for no other reason than to hear them roar. The point is every single person in this country is forced to buy gas in one way or another.

No they are not. It is a choice. You are very self centered.

You can't change your life to get around it. You ride the bus, you're still using gas. Walk to work, you're still using gas because you ate corn flakes for breakfast and they were delivered to the store using gas. As such, these enourmous corporations should not be allowed to charge whatever the hell they want. They aren't part of a free market anymore. It's ruining our entire economy.

I guess you and Bro Haut want to start a new USSR and see if it works this time eh?

Can nobody answer this question? How is gasoline different than natural gas or electricity? Those things are already regulated. The world didn't stop turning. Stock holders are still happy, and utilities still make big profits. If my electric company tried to double the cost in only a few months time they would literally be arrested.

I'm not going to even try to answer this silly question. You obviously do not understand how things work. You need to go to school and learn why the USSR failed.


But hey, if you guys enjoy getting butt raped, by all means, have at it. Maybe you can organize an orgy at the next iboats get together.

Start you own little USSR with Bro Haut if you want to find out about those types of things. People will sacrifice their freedom for some very silly reasons.

 

[QC]

Re: Haut vs Big Oil

They are working up to it....​

​

OK, and this is where the Emperor loses his dress. Show me one example where a State's relative savings vs. another has eroded since the beginning of this New Monopoly (kinda like New Math). One. Does not count if there has been a mandated composition change although in most cases that will actually prove my point not the other.

BTW, I keep this absurd practice of debating with Master-du-baters up only because some poeple actually belive this carp and it is wrong

 

[ZmOz]

Re: Haut vs Big Oil

No they are not. It is a choice.

So tell me, how is anyone in this country supposed to buy the food they need to live without going to a store where everything was delivered by truck/train/boat/plane? If they grow it they still have to go buy tools and seeds delivered the same way. How are they supposed to get to work without driving a car or riding a bus? How are they supposed to brush their teeth without using toothpaste that comes in a plastic tube made from petrolium? How are the kids supposed to go to school without riding a bus, using heat, or writing with pencils delivered using gas?

To say it is a choice for Americans to burn petrolium is just blatantly stupid. Maybe a few people can stop using it if they radically change their life, but it is impossible for everyone to do that. People would die and our economy would end completely. You cannot stop using petrolium unless you run out into the woods naked and live off the land.

 

[QC]

Re: Haut vs Big Oil

You can buy Natural Gas trucks, Busses, cars, and I think some Russian dude even made an LNG plane . . . Oh yeah, ships too. There are commercially available diesel alternatives, you make some yourself if I recall correctly. Ethanol will run in many cars and almost all cars can be converted to use it. Heck many retirement villages run almost completely on Electric golf carts things. What's your point Z? Sounds like you are talking more about Armageddon than fuel Monopolies to me . . .

But you do make a great case for us to increase our presence in the Middle East

 

[ZmOz]

Re: Haut vs Big Oil

You can buy Natural Gas trucks, Busses, cars,

Sure, I can, but people earning minimum wage can't. I can't force the stores that sell everything necessary to survival to convert, and there isn't enough natural gas to power this country by itself.

But you do make a great case for us to increase our presence in the Middle East

I don't have a problem with that. I say nuke the ****ers and take their oil. Maybe it's not politically correct, but that's the way the world worked up until about 100 years ago - the people with the biggest weapons take what they need.

 

[RPJS]

Re: Haut vs Big Oil

I'm not complaining about how much it's costing me. I'm complaining about how much it's costing our entire country and the toll it's having on our economy. Every person and every business in this country is losing money and it's all going to Exxon.

.

Again, if you have a problem with companies making huge profits you are living in the wrong country.

 

[Coors]

Re: Haut vs Big Oil

The price of oil is set by world-wide oil traders, not exxon. And OPEC has the pull, by flow, or by threats to change the price. Not BIG OIL (sorry to use that nasty term).

 

[OldMercsRule]

Re: Haut vs Big Oil

So tell me, how is anyone in this country supposed to buy the food they need to live without going to a store where everything was delivered by truck/train/boat/plane? If they grow it they still have to go buy tools and seeds delivered the same way. How are they supposed to get to work without driving a car or riding a bus? How are they supposed to brush their teeth without using toothpaste that comes in a plastic tube made from petrolium? How are the kids supposed to go to school without riding a bus, using heat, or writing with pencils delivered using gas?

Petroleum is one of the easiest and most ecomonical ways to get usable energy (with the technology we have today), and other great products like plastic. Due to this simple fact many things we use today are in fact petroleum based, (a choice dictated by economic considerations). The US and many Western economies use a corncept called capitilism to allocate scarce resources that are in demand. You and Bro Haut are proposing a central control to set prices and allocate these resources. That has never worked in the history of mankind. If you had gone to school longer or gone to the library more you would already know this SIMPLE fact of history. If John Kerry decrees that you and your friend get cheap gas then he will have to build prisons to hold the rest of us who want the same cheap gas too. If the US oil companies relocate to Britian or elsewhere, then you will need bigger prisons to force the people to produce oil for you and your friend and other priviledged people John Kerry wants to favor.

To say it is a choice for Americans to burn petrolium is just blatantly stupid. Maybe a few people can stop using it if they radically change their life, but it is impossible for everyone to do that. People would die and our economy would end completely. You cannot stop using petrolium unless you run out into the woods naked and live off the land.

You need to back to school ZmOz. I can't educate you all by myself.