Help - Decision Needed Fast

[Doc_Vegas]

Dear Boat Forum Members:

I am living near Lake Mead Nevada and strongly considering a first boat. I have navigated boats before when volunteering for National Park Service. I now have a wife and 3 year old son. We are looking serviously at a 1995 Four Winns Vista 238 which appears in very good shape. It has the 5.8 L Ford motor and rebuilt outdrive. Hours are unknown, but the boat looks VERY clean. No radio, and really no extras at all. Just a bimini top and a trailer.

Is this boat worth $10k? Can I later get a generator and AC/heat - which I think I will need for Lake Mead summers/winters as we plan to do weekend camping trips on the boat? How about camper canvas tops, are those worth the money?

Any and all opinions will be GREATLY appreciated!!!

Doc

 

[fimpel]

Re: Help - Decision Needed Fast

Don't know much about your boat. But others here have directed to this site for a ball park figure.
http://www.nadaguides.com/default.aspx?LI=1-24-0-5601-887-666-60472&l=1&w=24&p=38&f=5693&gc=mr&any=0

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: Help - Decision Needed Fast

having the Ford engine, leads me to believe it has an OMC outdrive, which is not longer supported with new replacement parts. at present you can still find parts, but when the supply is gone, it's gone. if it has a Volvo Penta, or Mercruiser outdrive, then you don't have that problem.

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: Help - Decision Needed Fast

i'm going to say in the range of $7,000-8,000. and it is a buyers market, so haggle. if OMC drive, keep looking.

 

[jaxnjil]

Re: Help - Decision Needed Fast

what TD says.+
i'v been watching las vegas craigs list and there have been better deals.
is it a 23ft or 38 ft? 23ft do'snt leave much room for a genset and AC. they have a hatch mount style poratable AC units but not sure how well they work.
if you want AC and genset price them before you buy boat. you might be better off finding a boat with them on and end up with a better boat for same money.

 

[jaxnjil]

Re: Help - Decision Needed Fast

1995 Four Winns Boats 238 Vista
This inboard/outboard cruiser is 23.33 feet long and weighs 4240 (pounds dry). This weight does not account for passengers, fuel, or gear. The beam of this craft is 96 inches.

thats about the same size as our boat so AC and genset could be doable. it would. be tight.
also on a boat that size a camper encloser is worth having. but if dos'nt come with boat is allso pricey to buy new.

 

[TilliamWe]

Re: Help - Decision Needed Fast

It has the 5.8 L Ford motor and rebuilt outdrive.
Is this boat worth $10k?
Can I later get a generator and AC/heat
How about camper canvas tops, are those worth the money?

Doc

Ford motor is not desirable, as parts for them are much more expensive than Chevy parts. Plus a Ford motor guarantees that it's attached to an OMC drive which is a bad thing.

Probably not worth 10k, no.

I sincerely doubt there is room on a 23' boat for a generator. Of course you can add heat and A/C, but you'd need to add shorepower too.
Camper canvas ia absolutely worth the money of you plan to overnight on it.

But you need to find a boat with all that stuff alreay on it, in my opinion. I know it makes them more expensive, but if you don't know how to add A/C it gets expensive having it done. And canvas places charge a fortune to "create" a camper canvas from scratch. Heck, they charge a fortune to just replace what you already have!

Keep looking.

 

[MikDee]

Re: Help - Decision Needed Fast

IMO, that price sounds kinda high for an almost 14yr old boat? Besides it doesn't have much in the way of the extras you're looking for at that price. I know Mercruiser used some Ford engines in the early years, but If it's an OMC walk away,,, quickly!

 

[Doc_Vegas]

Re: Help - Decision Needed Fast

WOW, thank you all so much for the VERY prompt responses. The ad says it has a "Cobra" outdrive. I am not sure if that is OMC or not???

To make it clearer, here is the ad below. Any further thoughts would be GREATLY appreciated.

"This 1995 Four Winns cabin cruiser has a 5.8L Ford fuel injected engine and Cobra outdrive. This boat is exactly what you are dreaming about if you want to enjoy the lake for a weekend camping excursion or a day trip of tubing, fishing or teaching the kids how to ski! After you've played hard all day there is no need to go anywhere because the super clean galley sleeps 4 comfortably, with a separate sleeping berth for two that has a privacy curtain. There is room for two more in the main galley area when the dining table top is removed, the dining area transforms into another bed. Bring your food and beverages on board and store what needs to be kept cold in the under counter refrigerator/freezer next to the sink. The head provides complete privacy with a closed door and is located next to the separate sleeping berth.

This boat has very low hours, the original owner was a woman who purchased it to take her kids out on the lake, which she tried a few times, but never got feeling comfortable with handling it because the size was a little more than she could comfortably handle. The second owner was a local politician (female also) and she took the boat out twice and the rest of the time she owned it, it sat in storage. We've had the boat for four years now, and only had it out four times for partial day excursions on Lake Mead. It has never been on salt water and has been professionally serviced and maintained. We have the original Owner's Manual. Three out of four of the trailer tires are new. As far as any problems with the boat, I don't know of anything that is not mechanically sound. She starts right up and runs like a top. The hull has a few chips, dents and scratches but nothing major, and for her age, this boat is a sharp looker! The L-shape seat in the back needs a new support bracket. The vinyl seats are in decent shape with no rips or tears. There is a bimini top, and cabin cover (missing a few snaps), transom shower - cold, and a swim platform with a fold down ladder. I replaced the factory stereo with a newer custom unit, but the stereo was stolen, so at this time there is no stereo. "

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: Help - Decision Needed Fast

cobra is OMC, a slight bit better to get parts.

 

[jaxnjil]

Re: Help - Decision Needed Fast

i'd keep looking. sounds like it is a has a mid berth. in your heat + if you run engine those soak up heat. you would be lucky if it cools off enough to sleep in there by 2am. even with a small fan the mid birth tends to be a oven.

 

[Gary H NC]

Re: Help - Decision Needed Fast

Yes...with a Cobra bolted to the Ford engine..NO WAY!
Much better deals to be had with a Mercruiser engine and drive.
Most marinas won't touch a OMC these days.
The only way i would buy it is if the price was about half of the asking price and i planned on doing all the engine and drive work myself.

Please! Keep looking...

 

[Doc_Vegas]

Re: Help - Decision Needed Fast

Thanks again! What boats should I watch for then? Bayliner? Donzi? Mastercraft?

I really want a boat, but I really am going into this blind. The messages above helped a lot.

Thanks

 

[jaxnjil]

Re: Help - Decision Needed Fast

when looking used keep an open mind. any well cared for boat of any brand will be a better buy than a top of the line boat that has has serious neglect.
watch craigs list there. i have seen a few boats that seem to be well cared for at fair prices. if you have time make the rounds of whats for sale and kick the tires. this will give you a good feel for what will and wont work there.
mercruiser and volvo are good drives. after that dual prop in each brand are a plus. for the size boat your looking at try to stick to 350 cid or larger. mercruiser bravo III and II good stuff. most engines will be chev. good cheap power.
make a list of what you need. AC to use in slip needs shore power. if you want to use AC on the lake then you need a genset. camper enclosure is a must imo.
just keep looking and come back here for advice and you'll do fine

 

[Doc_Vegas]

Re: Help - Decision Needed Fast

Thanks again! I will keep on looking, or at least try to get a better price.

When you say Dual-Props, is that one prop with several blades or truely two separate props? I assumed two separate props require separate engines...?

Cheers.

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: Help - Decision Needed Fast

DouProp, is two counter rotating props on one engine. they are expensive.

four winns, are a quality boat, just stay away from the OMC, drive systems. the mercruiser, and volvo penta are what you are looking for.

Buying a boat

1st you need to decide what you want to use it for, fishing, cruising, or water sports.

2nd how many people adults, children you want on board of the average outing.

3rd outboard, inboard-outboard, or inboard power plant.

4th Budget, what you want to pay, and what you are willing to pay, when you find
Exactly what you want.

You can hire a marine surveyor, to inspect the boat, or you can do it yourself.

You are mainly looking for soft spots in the deck, transom, cracks, all signs of a rotten, under frame. You walk all over the deck, that a mallot, or hammer with wooden handle, using handle, tap all over the transom, a shape rap is good solid base, a thud, is questionable base.

The motor should be clean, no spots where the paint is discolored, or pealing from heat, having run hot. (This part for outboard motors Compression should be atleast 100psi, and within 10% of each other,)
Spark on all cylinders, good pee stream, check lower unit for water in oil.

The overall condition of the boat will tell you a lot, as to how it has been maintained.
boat motor combo, A 30 year old may be in better condition, than a 3 year old.

 

[Doc_Vegas]

Re: Help - Decision Needed Fast

Thanks again. I am still looking that this Vista 238 (see link below for full info PLEASE). The Engine looks clean, but the outdrive sure has some paint missing.

Any more thoughts after seeing the ad and pictures? Seems the seller is firm at $10k.

Thanks

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEDWX:IT&item=160290016215

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: Help - Decision Needed Fast

He's nuts!!!! still it is Engine make: Ford with Cobra outdrive

 

[Doc_Vegas]

Re: Help - Decision Needed Fast

Thanks again guys. I will let you know what happens next...

 

[TilliamWe]

Re: Help - Decision Needed Fast

Doc, somewhere there is post on here that talks about the later model Cobras, that were actually VP drives. And to that effect, you could bolt on a readily available VP SX drive. I am not positive, but it is "possible" that the Cobra drive on that boat could be replaced with a VP SX. If that is the case, then the issue of parts for an OMC Cobra isn't an issue. (the parts issue for the Ford engine still exist, though) But the issue then becomes, a new VP SX costs $5395, where you can buy a brand new Mercruiser Alpha replacement drive from SEI for $1395. Or a brand new genuine Mercruiser Alpha One Gen 2 for $2895.
So what I am getting at is that you really want to find a boat with a Mercruiser or Volvo Penta drive coupled to a Chevy engine. That way you have a motor that is still in production and a drive that is still in production.

BTW, that boat does look pretty, but the guy is smoking crack if he thinks he's gonna get $10 for a 14 year old boat with an obsolete engine and drive. He should have ripped the person's arm off that bid the $7500 grabbing the money from his hand!