Help feul pump removal & install (now will not start)

[jason32038]

Re: Help feul pump removal & install (now will not start)

I just had a thought. Was the propeller moving at all when you got the engine running? Maybe the grinding could be coming from the lower unit. Maybe you think you're completely in neutral but it's not. Dogs could be rubbing. An easy way to check is to rotate propeller clockwise by hand in neutral..there should be no clicking noises and should rotate freely.

 

[jerryjerry05]

Re: Help feul pump removal & install (now will not start)

The screw on the top front of the carb is the AIR screw.It adjusts the air/fuel mixture at low rpm.#23 Pic1
#19 Tower shaft #21 Idle stop screw. Control the idle Pic2.

Don't be afraid to turn the motor over for prolonged times.That starter is actually pretty tough.Just make sure the battery is hot!!!
Do a compression test.If that's ok.Then start it and let it run.
It will take a couple of seconds for the adjustments to catch up.
If it starts to make any banging noises,shut it down.
This is a BIG IF!!!!It's possible that when the mechanic took it for a ride and he was running it hard something let loose in the motor and he didn't tell you he blew it up.
If something did go it probably wasn't his fault it was gonna go anyway.These motors were made to run fast!!!.J

 

[Karla45]

Re: Help feul pump removal & install (now will not start)

jason, the grinding thing happened only once after i messed with the flywheel to check timing. It was more like the teeth of the starter and flywheel caused the grinding sound. Either the flywheel was locked in place and the starter teeth were grinding on the flywheel or vice versa. This happened when i turned key to start it never started and i did not keep trying because of the sound. After i turned the flywheel until the piston went back to its original position it stopped.

I am not blaming the mechanic i am more trying to give history of what was done. Although i wonder if a good mechanic would bring a boat back to customer with compression 135,135, 100, would you? I am not planning on going and giving him hard time. DOes not do any good. It is just very expensive and frustrating.

 

[jason32038]

Re: Help feul pump removal & install (now will not start)

Here are some examples of what happens when you run a cylinder lean. Although I don't think I was running lean I was only running on 2 cylinders for a while. Found problem which was a loose wire to the coil. It screamed on the water for 10 minutes and started sputtering/sneezing/coughing when I came to the shore at idle. I think my case was from built up carbon from the cylinder not firing for so long but this can also happen when running lean. The other 2 pistons and cylinders were perfect. Anyone interested in what you see in the top two pics?

 

[Karla45]

Re: Help feul pump removal & install (now will not start)

Wow that is interesting. So that is not oil on there but a burnt piston. How hard would it be for me to take a look at piston. WOuld i have to remove alot of parts to see the front of them. The coil thing gives me a thought. On my motor right above the fuel pump are a bunch of wires on a panel. I had to unscrew the plate that had the cd units and these wires and move up in order to get to some of the screws on the fuel pump to change diaphram. I had considered before that maybe a wire came loose or something but felt like i was really careful enough that probably not. I disconnected the battery cables before i did this to be on safe side. Not sure which wires go to what or which are coils. This could be a prob not sure. Do bad coils cause backfires? I have had the motor backfire on numerous occasions.

 

[jerryjerry05]

Re: Help feul pump removal & install (now will not start)

You do a compression test yet?
Backfire is usually a carb or fuel pump problem.Low compression will cause it to do that too.
Carb not set right or something not assembled right.
NO I wouldn't give the motor back if the compression was like yours.
I'd tell you and see what you wanted to do.
The first thing I'd do is spray oil in the cylinders to see if the compression will improve.The oil fills in the spots where the rings might be gone.
If that didn't help I'd guess the head gasket next.

Removing the head is the way to see the head of the pistons. It will cost about $35 for a new head gasket.Plus the time to clean it.J

 

[Karla45]

Re: Help feul pump removal & install (now will not start)

I am taking to a mechanic who has come highly recommended by several people. I talked to him on the phone and told him what was going on. He said that he would look at gasket and pistons first, he will look it over for me at reasonable price. have not checked compression yet. Will let you guys know what he says. Thank you guys so very much for your help and patience with my total lack of knowledge.

 

[jason32038]

Re: Help feul pump removal & install (now will not start)

Good luck!! Hope it's nothing serious.

 

[Karla45]

Re: Help feul pump removal & install (now will not start)

Thanks. The mechanic has been working on motors for over 25 years. He also asked me the name of the mechanic who worked on my boat, when i told him he knew who he was. He said that he had worked on somebodys lower unit one time and had it all messed up. He said he thought my starting problem may be that the mechanic did not properly adjust the chokes when he went to put carbs back in. Oh well, that would be great if all the starting problem was just choke adjustment.

 

[Karla45]

Re: Help feul pump removal & install (now will not start)

How hard is it to get to the head gasket if that is what it is? Is this something that i could do easily. I have looked at the powerhead diagrams and it gets a little over my head.

 

[jerryjerry05]

Re: Help feul pump removal & install (now will not start)

Removing the head gasket is easy.Just start taking the bolts off the head.
There 14 bolts with a 1/2inch head.Remove them and pry it off.
The heads been on there for a while.So the bolts might need some persuasion. If they are too tight you might need to work them a bit.
You will need a tourqe wrench to re-assemble.Make sure the surfaces are spotless and smooth when you re-assemble.

There is a small flash light with a very tiny bulb on a wire that can fit in the hole.See pic. Get one of these and look into the plug hole.J

 

[Karla45]

Re: Help feul pump removal & install (now will not start)

are there any brand or kind of torque wrench you would recommend that is fairly inexpensive, even if nothing wrong with head gasket i think this would be a necessary tool and beneficial to have. I noticed there were different size torque wrenches for instance 1/2 inch etc. What specs would i be looking for on the wrench before purchasing?

 

[jerryjerry05]

Re: Help feul pump removal & install (now will not start)

Sears Craftsman tools is a good bet.Not as expensive as Snap-On or Mack Tools.But good enough for the home mechanic.
They come in different sizes.Inch pounds and Foot pounds.Some read in metric too.
The one you need is either Inch pounds or the small Ft pounds.
The 3/8 drive is good up to say 60# The 1/2"drive is good for up to a couple of hundred pounds.Depending on the one you have.
You need a 3/8 drive in Foot pounds.It will work for most anything your gonna do on the outboard.
A good compression tester.A good spark tester I use inline sparkies. And I have a spark checker for measuring the spark itself. About $6 at Auto Zone.
Then a fuel pump pressure/vacume guage.Then a fuel pump pressure tester for higher pressure,mostly used for fuel injector or electric fuel pump testing.J

 

[Karla45]

Re: Help feul pump removal & install (now will not start)

Well they say my boat is ready. He said that the linkages for the carbs were not adjusted right, throttle not adjusted right, something about the jets although i did not think you could adjust the jets on this motor. Said that the choke plates adjustment was wrong and choke not closing fully said not even close to enough. Asked fixed bog down issue, he said that he need to lake test to know for sure $125. Said he needed to test it under load to see if bog down is fixed. If had the money would pay but will have to take out and test myself. Need money if there is something causing to bog down. Said the compression checked out. I guess we will see. Not sure if i will take back and pay another $85 for more diagnostics. IF still bogging down after they corrected adjustments then i will just have to figure it out myself.

 

[jason32038]

Re: Help feul pump removal & install (now will not start)

The guy probably put the fuel jets where the air jets go and the air jets where the fuel jets go. The fuel jet is bigger. On mine the air jet is .060 and the fuel jet is .074 I THINK. The jets arent adjustable unless you feel like drilling a hole in one lol. Glad he fixed it for you and i'm sure it'll run fine! Good luck.

 

[Karla45]

Re: Help feul pump removal & install (now will not start)

Got boat back running great. Thanks for you help. Will be back on the lake friday.

I am going to start a different thread for my next question.